what the fuck is cyberpunk

We all make mistakes. I still deeply regret buying Wolcen.

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Johny_Snow wrote:

I still struggle to understand why citizen NPC behavior is so important. Are we there to watch them or to play?

But then again, I never understood the need to build "player homes" (hideouts here) or to have "realistic needs". We are here to play, not to live.

Did you play read dead redemption 2? those Npc are immersion incarnated.

Also why we can t even even get a 2-3 lines of code for robbing-helping-antagonizing npc-directions, would have been a great addition.

Well I am sure we will see mods like those on the Nexus soon enough.

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Johny_Snow wrote:

We all make mistakes. I still deeply regret buying Wolcen.

I wish I did. I want to be one of the cool kids playing the cool games. Instead here I am pushing 2.2k hours on it like a fucking nerd in the basement painting knock-off Warhammer figurines. It's been one of the best gaming investments I've ever made, rivalled only by Guild Wars 1 (5k or so hours) and the Diablos (which is cheating; mostly I just chatted on battle.net). You and everyone else can go on and on about how bad it is; I won't disagree. But it is a fact that I deeply enjoy it, far too much to bother trying to reconcile this difference in opinions. :)

...I deeply regret buying Dungeon Siege 3. Paid twice as much as for Wolcen, played it for a whole 2 hours. I also deeply regret buying Overwatch: 3 times as much for a game a friend wanted to try and I hated every fucking second of it, and sometimes was even gracious enough not to tell him. But I really, really regret buying the Grandmaster pack for Path of Exile. 500 bucks USD to put a carefully built character in only to have it nerfed to oblivion retroactively because Grandmasters weren't considered monsters but players, subject to skill nerfs. That, sir, was a scam. Wolcen? Just a rip-off, at worst. A disappointingly mediocre delivery of a brilliant concept.

The Grandmaster pack? Fucking. Scam.

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xMustard wrote:

anyway i've been very vocal about this cyberpunk garbage, essentially just telling people to wise up and hold companies accountable with your money.

Tbh, the garbage is universal. It's not just about Cyberpunk or CDPR, it's about pre-orders, Day 1 purchases and the power of marketing in general. It doesn't matter what company it is, you should never pre-order. The only time it ever makes sense is if there's a significant discount between the earlier price and the release price, in which case the company deserves all the hate for that. CDPR messed up sure, but they're not alone in messing up like this. The problem is gamers are hopeless. This is why I laugh whenever I see people claiming they're gonna boycott this game or that company, whatever the reason. There's hardly any examples of successful (not 'media successful' aka it gets a lot of attention, but actually 'denting the product revenue' successful) consumer boycotts, outside of literal national revolutions / freedom struggles. Even a certain famous global movement against a certain infamous little country has achieved jack squat. The day I see FIFA stop selling the same game year after year is the day I finally start believing those claims actually hold any water.

I think cdpr will patch and patch and patch this cyberpunk similar to no man's sky. Because they should value their reputation enough.

After playing for more hours I realize that the game should have been sold just like Baldur's Gate III. As a Beta WIP. Because yeah... mechanically it's really confused. You know because Borderlands is a pretty rich template for how to handle quests and narration without interrupting the action.

But apparently CDPR are not Gearbox fans because no one seems to have learned anything from the Borderlands series. You can have like 2-3 convos criss crossing one another at the same time while some guy starts shooting you so then V says, "Gotta delta" and when the fight is over you awkwardly pick up on the convo again. It's just silly. I don't know how they have the convos stumbling over each other's feet like that if it isn't a beta.

Dragon Quest Definitive Edition is free on game pass... and Epic Games gave away Pillars of Eternity and Tryanny. So I'll probably be swapping out Cyberpunk from the rotation from one of those. If not for the nudity I'd just give the game to my nephew at this point. Seeing as I bought it on GoG so I should be able to do that.

Everyone's entitled to their own opinion. I'm glad some people like it and some people hate it. :P

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Johny_Snow wrote:

I still struggle to understand why citizen NPC behavior is so important. Are we there to watch them or to play?

I picked it because it's one of the most common game features developers choose to hype for this type of game. Most, if not all, do it to one extent or another. If there are many seemingly "random" NPCs and it's a "AAA" developer, you could win good money betting in favor of them coming out with marketing hype that implies these NPCs are all individually simulate and appear to be living in a "living world."

And, nobody has lived up to that claim yet, no matter how hard they push it in their marketing hype. Why? Because they just give an "interpretation" of what their game is presenting that is cast in the very best, most gullible and innocent, light possible... In reality? They've just got a spawn spot called "home" and a set regimen dictated by a clock... But, that doesn't sound hypeworthy, does it? So, the dev rewords it as "living world" and pretends they're not lying by omission to their prospective customers.

Any interpretative statements that rely on an assumed impression a player may have when playing the game is a license to lie. A big license to lie bigly.

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But then again, I never understood the need to build "player homes" (hideouts here) or to have "realistic needs". We are here to play, not to live.

That's true, but games trying to immerse the player and to give them a feeling of achievement as well as some "open world" interactions tend to provide things like that.

But, you've hit on another widely used bit of hype - Player housing. OK... whoopdeedo, they built some extra assets and call it a "player house." Big. Friggin' Deal. But, they will hype the crap out of it because a good many players love that kind of thing.

Now, if you could build it exactly like you wanted it, with walls and corridors, kitchens and bedrooms, and choose basically anywhere in the game to build it... That would require a bit more "work" by developers. Putting in a player-instance and calling it "home" is a no-brainer they can give an intern to do. (But, since it's a likely source of continuing purchases and vanity items, it's probably a high priority. :))

PS: I just took a trip over to the Steam forums for Cyberpunk 2077. That place is humming... Every front-page thread is created "just now." LOLZ.

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Exile009 wrote:

Tbh, the garbage is universal. It's not just about Cyberpunk or CDPR, it's about pre-orders, Day 1 purchases and the power of marketing in general. It doesn't matter what company it is, you should never pre-order. The only time it ever makes sense is if there's a significant discount between the earlier price and the release price, in which case the company deserves all the hate for that. CDPR messed up sure, but they're not alone in messing up like this. The problem is gamers are hopeless.

this is exactly how im vocal about it. its just that the latest cyberpunk situation is the most recent debacle so its worth specifically mentioning.
but i 100% agree with you

i dont typically boycott things but i for one will never play (or rather pay) for cyberpunk, thats for sure.
mostly my own personal choices are just trying for myself to avoid being a part of the mess when it inevitably turns into one. at least for the gaming industry, lol
that means zero pre-order. zero games currently in development. zero buying on release.
but ya i'd say majority of gamers don't have the willpower to hold out a couple weeks or a month

I have only purchased pre-orders for games I am willing to accept as flawed on release. (Practically all of them that offer pre-orders...)

Given that Sony, and maybe even Micro$oft at this point, are now willingly processing "returns" for CP2077, it's a good sign that someone out there is a bit concerned with their image. But, it's not enough.

"Release Day" no longer means "Finished Product" and there are few legal recourses available to a electronic game consumer if, for instance, that game "works" but is terribly buggy. The developer is and should be allowed to "make good" on the purchase. But... when developers are routinely "making good" on such purchases for months after the fact, something is wrong with the current system.

And, what if they decide an advertisised feature is too difficult to "make good" on? For instance, I understand there are supposed to be some sort of "bountyhunters" in CP2077 and that the police can be bribed and/are corrupt. But, I've seen reviews where the presenter complains that these features are not in the game.

Wat do? What if that feature, as described in hype, doesn't make it into the game after a few months of patches? Can players use that as a reason to seek a refund? Not likely or at least not easily.

I am still not sure how things like dumb NPCs and overlapping dialogues are a deal breaker. I personally haven't crashed a single time in more than 20+ hours. There have been bugs but I had to reload because of them only 2 times (went through a wall and couldn't get out). The only real annoying bug was a subtitle that stuck to the screen but after I searched the forums for 5 minutes I was able to fix it. NPC behavior concerns me only up to the point where the game is too easy on very hard but then again, there are ways to make it more challenging (no health increase from the Body stat or playing with more damage-oriented gear, playing as a melee, ignoring stealth).

My biggest problem with the game so far is the lack of weapon/armor mods which forces me to keep sub-par pieces of gear that have extremely rare ones.

I can easily give this game a 10/10 without even really getting into the main story.