@OP, there's an obvious difference between buying MTX with real money and e.g. currency:
MTX don't give you an ingame advantage, but currency does.
I've always maintained that PoE was "P2W light", because in reality, what is there to "win" in a PVE game anyways?
That said there are a few MTX GGG sells that blur the lines. Stash tabs are one for example. Not only from a storage and QoL standpoint, but you cannot even engage in PoE trade without paying some money to GGG to acquire a premium tab.
In addition to that there are some skill and character MTX that improve visuals in the game for identification purposes, or the ability to turn off effects so that visual clarity improves. These are minor true enough, but they do indeed exist. Never mind the curious place we find ourselves in having to pay GGG to turn off an effect with an "invisible MTX". How that isn't a free option by default is beyond me.
GGG has gamble loot boxes, which CW indicated represented about a 1/3 of their total revenue. There is also a battle pass, in which the pass does provide in-game items as you progress it.
Point is GGG isn't exactly the pinnacle of ethical F2P imo. Law abiding? Sure. Pretty fair in the F2P competitive market when compared to others? OK, I'll agree with that to an extent. Although I do think it's fair to say that money does provide some advantages in PoE.
***As a side note, let's also not forget that in the early days there were GGG shareholders that also owned websites that sold PoE currency. Granted that was many years ago, but it did happen, and was pretty poor optics. It's not an easy thing to forget, at least for me.
"Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak out and remove all doubt."
- Abraham Lincoln
@OP, there's an obvious difference between buying MTX with real money and e.g. currency:
MTX don't give you an ingame advantage, but currency does.
Spoiler
I've always maintained that PoE was "P2W light", because in reality, what is there to "win" in a PVE game anyways?
That said there are a few MTX GGG sells that blur the lines. Stash tabs are one for example. Not only from a storage and QoL standpoint, but you cannot even engage in PoE trade without paying some money to GGG to acquire a premium tab.
In addition to that there are some skill and character MTX that improve visuals in the game for identification purposes, or the ability to turn off effects so that visual clarity improves. These are minor true enough, but they do indeed exist. Never mind the curious place we find ourselves in having to pay GGG to turn off an effect with an "invisible MTX". How that isn't a free option by default is beyond me.
GGG has gamble loot boxes, which CW indicated represented about a 1/3 of their total revenue. There is also a battle pass, in which the pass does provide in-game items as you progress it.
Point is GGG isn't exactly the pinnacle of ethical F2P imo. Law abiding? Sure. Pretty fair in the F2P competitive market when compared to others? OK, I'll agree with that to an extent. Although I do think it's fair to say that money does provide some advantages in PoE.
***As a side note, let's also not forget that in the early days there were GGG shareholders that also owned websites that sold PoE currency. Granted that was many years ago, but it did happen, and was pretty poor optics. It's not an easy thing to forget, at least for me.
You are of course free to disagree, but I'd say: accurate enough for the purpose of this thread.
@OP, there's an obvious difference between buying MTX with real money and e.g. currency:
MTX don't give you an ingame advantage, but currency does.
I've always maintained that PoE was "P2W light", because in reality, what is there to "win" in a PVE game anyways?
That said there are a few MTX GGG sells that blur the lines. Stash tabs are one for example. Not only from a storage and QoL standpoint, but you cannot even engage in PoE trade without paying some money to GGG to acquire a premium tab.
In addition to that there are some skill and character MTX that improve visuals in the game for identification purposes, or the ability to turn off effects so that visual clarity improves. These are minor true enough, but they do indeed exist. Never mind the curious place we find ourselves in having to pay GGG to turn off an effect with an "invisible MTX". How that isn't a free option by default is beyond me.
GGG has gamble loot boxes, which CW indicated represented about a 1/3 of their total revenue. There is also a battle pass, in which the pass does provide in-game items as you progress it.
Point is GGG isn't exactly the pinnacle of ethical F2P imo. Law abiding? Sure. Pretty fair in the F2P competitive market when compared to others? OK, I'll agree with that to an extent. Although I do think it's fair to say that money does provide some advantages in PoE.
***As a side note, let's also not forget that in the early days there were GGG shareholders that also owned websites that sold PoE currency. Granted that was many years ago, but it did happen, and was pretty poor optics. It's not an easy thing to forget, at least for me.
You can trade w/o premium tabs. There are 3rd party tools for that, we used it in ancient times before premium tabs were a thing.
I've always maintained that PoE was "P2W light", because in reality, what is there to "win" in a PVE game anyways?
[Removed by Support] If someone could pay real money for a mirror, that's pay to win.
"
There is also a battle pass, in which the pass does provide in-game items as you progress it.
***As a side note, let's also not forget that in the early days there were GGG shareholders that also owned websites that sold PoE currency. Granted that was many years ago, but it did happen, and was pretty poor optics. It's not an easy thing to forget, at least for me.
The battle pass's in-game items are available immediately to everybody for free, so far, every time. Only cosmetics come along with the paid one. And that is quite a stretch blaming GGG for the outside actions of shareholders who come and go like a snowstorm in Antarctica
Stash tabs have always been the only gray area for GGG's MTX decisions. I am sure they generate a ton of income for them. I'm sure someone at GGG has mentioned how much more money they could make if they themselves sold power like mirrors. The Chinese version has pets that pickup items right? For now we can only hope the company stays in the control of people who care about their game so that doesn't happen outside of China.
Last edited by Whai_GGG on Jan 18, 2024, 2:44:19 AM
I wonder if doing the Math and discussing rmt for some educational content is allowed or not?
Yes, doing RMT is agains the TOS (people say), but discussing stuff is not the same as doing something. /curious?
"
Virtual Item Trading: Subject to the remainder of these Terms of Use, you may trade Virtual Items with other game players for your own personal and non-commercial purposes using the in-game trading mechanisms provided by Grinding Gear Games and through use of official Grinding Gear Games Website APIs. You agree that to the greatest extent permissible at law Grinding Gear Games will have no liability to you of any nature arising out of or in connection with any trade or inability to trade.
Where even is the "point" RMT = agains TOS? i cannot find it...🤔
Personal Use = Multiplayer Excluded? (Party Play, Stash) or where is the "line"
Licking a smelly place is allowed.
Any criticism (even if it is only truth) is STRICTLY FORBIDDEN!
@OP, there's an obvious difference between buying MTX with real money and e.g. currency:
MTX don't give you an ingame advantage, but currency does.
Saying microtransactions don't give you an in-game advantage is denialism. All this convincing is contradictory as there is no reason to buy them if there isn't. Real Money Trading (RMT) is the buying and selling of in-game data (items, characters, etc.) in exchange for real life currency. Interpreting the definition, all microtransactions in online video games are also RMT. The gaming industry is normalizing RMT as supporting the gaming industry. RMT is for Profit maximization not for their customers. There is sanctioned RMT from the gaming companies and unsanctioned RMT from third parties. There is bad and there is worse.
@OP, there's an obvious difference between buying MTX with real money and e.g. currency:
MTX don't give you an ingame advantage, but currency does.
Saying microtransactions don't give you an in-game advantage is denialism. All this convincing is contradictory as there is no reason to buy them if there isn't. Real Money Trading (RMT) is the buying and selling of in-game data (items, characters, etc.) in exchange for real life currency. Interpreting the definition, all microtransactions in online video games are also RMT. The gaming industry is normalizing RMT as supporting the gaming industry. RMT is for Profit maximization not for their customers. There is sanctioned RMT from the gaming companies and unsanctioned RMT from third parties. There is bad and there is worse.
Except that this is player-to-player instead of business-to-player and that is the part that is forbidden. You'd have to ignore TOS and common sense to make your argument.
And of course companies try to maximize their profits. Do you think games should be made by non-profit NGOs out of the goodness of their hearts?
Besides that, game companies have good reason to not want players to trade for in-game goods with real money. It would allow players to skip narrative structures of a game and disturb the flow of the game. Essentially it ruins the UX the company designed for their game.
The opposite of knowledge is not illiteracy, but the illusion of knowledge.
