Why PoE 2 will again not get a Auction house? (or trading system)

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innervation wrote:
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Baharoth15 wrote:
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innervation wrote:
y what would be good or not for the game.

I have between 2x-3x your playtime and I like trade the way it is. Actually that's not true, I wish they'd ban players who use 3rd party TOS-breaking apps so that all players were on a level playing field within their system.

The reason you don't hear from the people who agree with the current system is because GGG has made it pretty damn clear they aren't intent on changes to it, so there's no need for me to waste my time making posts or telling people

'wow isn't this thing great exactly how it is? just wanted to let everyone know that I don't want changes to this thing GGG said they wouldn't change!!'

I'm happy when players like Nidal speak up for the quiet enjoyers so that the 'frictionless trade now' crowd can't lie softly in their echo chamber.


May I ask what exactly you like about it? And i really mean like as in "it's great this way" not like as in "i can't think of a better alternative" or "it is what it is and it's not going to change so just accept it."

I can somewhat understand why people don't want an AH/friction less trade even if i disagree but leaving alternatives aside, i can't think of a single reason why anyone could like the current system. It's unfun, inconvienient and forcefully distracts from what's supposed to be the essence of the game, i.e killing monsters in order to progress.


You can absolutely ask! I go way back to the days of trading via 'forum shop' in PoE and there was something magical about the idea of going to someone's thread and seeing their shop. You'd browse some and leave disappointed, and you'd see others that were way out of your price range (mirror-tier stuff), and sometimes you'd find just the shop you were looking for. I think we like games that mirror real life, in fact I know we do - that's why there is a market for these grindy (think idle/cookie cliker) games. Those games should be just as wearying as our day-to-day grind, but they aren't, because constant progress lets us 'win' at the games unlike IRL where there is no guarantee of winning or constant forward progress.

Spoiler
Although with that said it probably explains why so many players want 'push button get thing' trading as it mirrors the Bezos-teat-suckling good little consumers that they are.


This level of friction made it so that being a trader really was a game within a game. We joke (okay we're half serious) about that now - haha that guy isn't even playing the game, he just sits in his h/o and flips currency all day, making 3% value on each transaction, building up the bank over time. In modern PoE it's no wonder that has a bad reputation as not being fun. It's not fun.

Yet I think forum-shopkeeper time was fun. Why? 2 reasons

1. Because that level of friction creates artificial scarcity. Any kind of scarcity creates value in the face of demand. Trade value is a form of value-add that is perpendicular to the main form of value in this game - the 'lucky drop'. Perpendicular value is great for games because being able to do something off-meta to find success makes for a more rich and varied game experience.

2. Shopkeeping was an occasional thing to do which meant you did it when you felt like it - it wasn't some 'always on' thing that pulled you out of maps.

To expand on point 1. Scarcity. Today you find a well rolled item on the ground and at best dump it in a 2c or a 5c tab if its early enough in the league. When everyone can do it that easily, everyone does it, resulting in rock-bottom prices. In a high friction system, 75% of sellers can't be bothered to sell it, so the seller can charge more.

Kind of like how crafting items is a big value add. In a high friction system, doing the leg work of bringing items to market is a value add and lets you charge prices appropriately. Another scenario...

You find a rare wand with 6 desirable mods called the Throat Goat Imbued Wand. There are 9 other identical wands up for sale. In the current system there's not a lot of wiggle room on how you price the wand. You must price the item lower than the other 9, or you can price it in the middle or higher and hope that demand for the Throat Goat is sufficiently high as to result in the lower priced ones getting bought, leading the next prospective buyer to key in on yours.

Either way, you, the seller, are pretty much out of agency. There's no gameplay here.

In the forum shopkeeper system, your wand is worth more, even if there are 9 identical wands. How is this possible? Because it forced sellers to actually get off their ass and do some work. There was room for salesmanship. Add some graphics and color to your shop post. Work on the layout. Format out different areas of the shop. Run specials and discounts. Keep it updated. That may sound terrible but for the entrepreneur it was great because it rewarded your work as much as your luck. If you were willing to 'grind' at the trade game you would get better results than the same player with the same items in their shop. To me, this is gameplay.

I'm not saying the old forum system should come back, but in my experience, the higher the friction, the more it rewards the work, knowledge, and intelligence of the seller instead of just the pure RNG of finding an item. I would much prefer a system with flavor, texture, and gameplay to one of cold, robotic automation.

To expand much more briefly on point 2 I actually think players might like a higher friction system more than they think in the sense that...how often do you see complaints about 'having to leave your map to trade' and 'no one ever response to my trade PMs'? A high friction system is one that results in fewer, but more valuable trades per day. You'll both be pulled out of maps less, and also have fewer players ignore your PMs because that may be the only sale they make that day - they're not going to let that opportunity go away.


Very nice post!
Heart of Purity

Awarded 'Silverblade' to Talent Competition Winner 2020.
POE turned into a ratrace for the most div/hour.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NDFO4E5OKSE
I think it is important to consider what the tradeoff of having an easier trade system would be. In the years I have played this game if some combination of item's or even crafted mod's become desired by a lot player's because they are powerful. GGG balances this power by making the items or craft's more scarce. As it is now they seem to balance powerful item's around its scarcity and the friction of trade is a part this. Remove that friction and suddenly they need to readjust the rarity of just about everything to compensate.
POE will not make a meaningful trading platform because they lack the skillsets to design one.

No other reason.
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Tulina wrote:
POE will not make a meaningful trading platform because they lack the skillsets to design one.

No other reason.


What a stupid thing to say.

You honestly think they couldn't design a trading platform (they already have one), when they have made one of the best ARPG's on the market already.

If every item in the game was as easy as going to a vendor/shop and right clicking, it would completely destroy the games economy, as it stands every item has a certain amount of friction/weight to it.

The more desirable an item, the rarer it is and harder it can be to acquire. If all you had to do was right click and it's yours, instead of actually interacting with the current trading system, each season would be over in a couple weeks.
https://clips.twitch.tv/SpoopyGrotesqueBearSoBayed-BZxenujI2RpiPe8h

Enjoy boys :) We are winning!
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Tulina wrote:
POE will not make a meaningful trading platform because they lack the skillsets to design one.

No other reason.


So what is stopping them from stealing one? there are hundreds out there. Where is this "meaningful" trade platform? please enlighten us oh great elitist.
Current Build: Penance Brand
God build?! https://pobb.in/bO32dZtLjji5
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Tulina wrote:
POE will not make a meaningful trading platform because they lack the skillsets to design one.

No other reason.


They litteraly have one on the Chinese version.
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Sidefx06 wrote:
https://clips.twitch.tv/SpoopyGrotesqueBearSoBayed-BZxenujI2RpiPe8h

Enjoy boys :) We are winning!


nice...its about time !
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Sidefx06 wrote:


Enjoy boys :) We are winning!


Game's already dead before it arrives.
They give certain people just way more power as they already have, but I'm sure lot's of people are already thrilled and excited about more bots and tft clown fiesta on an even higher level of market manipulation just for the sake of being able to instant buy stuff.
The better approach would have been a full ssf balanced game without any trading, and maybe just short trading in party play like D3 did it. It would remove close to most rmt
Flames and madness. I'm so glad I didn't miss the fun.
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Sidefx06 wrote:
https://clips.twitch.tv/SpoopyGrotesqueBearSoBayed-BZxenujI2RpiPe8h

Enjoy boys :) We are winning!


This isn't winning, and it's sad you can't see that.

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