Why PoE 2 will again not get a Auction house? (or trading system)

Diablo 3 auction was closed for a reason. It was very quickly swarmed with pure traders who pumped prices to the roof.
The problem of the game is not absence of auction, but the drop rates, because buying is the only option. I played the game for more than 1000 hours and found one really good item.
In Diablo 2 Resurrected I had enigma, windforce and bunch of top tier uniqes and runewords after 4 month of playing, all self found.
Though farming high tier runes works only in single player, you need an ability to reset the area without changing map layout (super chests in Lower Kurast).

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dima_dunedin wrote:

Diablo 3 auction was closed for a reason. It was very quickly swarmed with pure traders who pumped prices to the roof.
The problem of the game is not absence of auction, but the drop rates, because buying is the only option. I played the game for more than 1000 hours and found one really good item.
In Diablo 2 Resurrected I had enigma, windforce and bunch of top tier uniqes and runewords after 4 month of playing, all self found.
Though farming high tier runes works only in single player, you need an ability to reset the area without changing map layout (super chests in Lower Kurast).

did you play those 1000 hours on a different account or why did you never beat shaper/elder I mean of course you don't find the "good stuff" if you don't run the "good content"

Comparing the rarity of enigma and windforce with mageblood etc.

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dima_dunedin wrote:

Diablo 3 auction was closed for a reason. It was very quickly swarmed with pure traders who pumped prices to the roof.
...

Fascinating how many people believed when blizz blamed AH for D3 problems and made a show of closing it. Problem was and still is D3 itemization itself. It was before silly sets with +10000% dmg came around, but still, no meaningful gold sink, no gem sink, no legendary item sink, cheap and unneeded crafting, and smart loot on top. Of course hyperinflation was a matter of time.

We still have AH working on our private D3 server, and let me assure you, with our changes economics there is fine, nothing collapses.

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Echothesis wrote:

Fascinating how many people believed when blizz blamed AH for D3 problems and made a show of closing it. Problem was and still is D3 itemization itself. It was before silly sets with +10000% dmg came around, but still, no meaningful gold sink, no gem sink, no legendary item sink, cheap and unneeded crafting, and smart loot on top. Of course hyperinflation was a matter of time.

We still have AH working on our private D3 server, and let me assure you, with our changes economics there is fine, nothing collapses.

There was no smart loot in D3 when AH was around, they added it after the fact. The sheer amount of players is what breaks the AH economy. You have biliions of items generated every single day. Its not "your changes" that are so good, its the amount of players. Even 10k players is nothing compared to 7 milion D3 had.

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kuciol wrote:

There was no smart loot in D3 when AH was around, they added it after the fact. The sheer amount of players is what breaks the AH economy. You have biliions of items generated every single day. Its not "your changes" that are so good, its the amount of players. Even 10k players is nothing compared to 7 milion D3 had.

For the sake of common ground, why do you think is currency in poe still worth something in standard if even the less knowledgeable players can farm it? Poe doesn't have millions of players, but still has at least 100k CCU on average I believe. Poe is nearly as old as D3 too.

Poe also has very strong currency sinks all around the game, as well as item sinks to a lesser extent via corruption, recombination, and other forms of irreversible crafting. It is true that I never had that many players in our house, but I disagree it cannot be controlled at all.

Blizz made fundamental design mistakes from the beginning, and then chose to delete trade rather than salvage the situation. It doesn't mean AH concept itself is flawed.

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Diablo 3 auction was closed for a reason. It was very quickly swarmed with pure traders who pumped prices to the roof.

How do you pump prices on AH?

I played MMOs with looots of players and AH and nobody pumped prices to the roof.

The prices were somehow predictable and corresponding with either droprate / man-hours to obtain item.

So you are pure trader with AH and you do what? Buy every undercut to keep price high?

Won't work, cause a) you do not have infinite "money" b) people will notice and 100 % try to use your predictable behaviour against you c) you do not act 24/7, need to eat, sleep whatever.

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BambulaGTS wrote:

How do you pump prices on AH?

There are two examples:

1. Seller lists the item for 1d
2. Buyer offers 1d
3. Robot offers 2d
4. Buyer offers 3d
5. Robot offers 4d
6. Buyer offers 5d and buys the item or PM to the Seller directly

Buyer bought the item for 5d instead of 1d


1. Seller #1 lists the item for 1d
2. Buyer offers 1d
3. Robot offers 1.1d at the very-very end of the auction
4. Seller #2 lists the item with new price for 2, 3, whatever d

Buyer wasted his time and now sees the item for 2d instead of 1d.

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BambulaGTS wrote:

Won't work, cause

You definetly underestimate the traders in PoE. Compare the SSF and trade league builds. The difference is larger than the size of the Universe.

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Echothesis wrote:

For the sake of common ground, why do you think is currency in poe still worth something in standard if even the less knowledgeable players can farm it? Poe doesn't have millions of players, but still has at least 100k CCU on average I believe. Poe is nearly as old as D3 too.

Poe also has very strong currency sinks all around the game, as well as item sinks to a lesser extent via corruption, recombination, and other forms of irreversible crafting. It is true that I never had that many players in our house, but I disagree it cannot be controlled at all.

Blizz made fundamental design mistakes from the beginning, and then chose to delete trade rather than salvage the situation. It doesn't mean AH concept itself is flawed.

Because nobody really plays standard and the currency has use besides being money. Also currency in standard is kinda worthless. You can even check how many offers there is to sell divines for example, as of writting this there is 7 offers. Inflation is already a thing, AH would speed up this process 1000 fold.

AH has no place in a game where the amount of items genereted with no way of removing them from economy is so huge. D3 also had accound and character bound items, PoE doesnt even have that. The economy would be destroyed after 24h. AH cannot work in a game where the main focus is getting items. It would devalue other means of getting them like drop and crafting. Trading is in direct competition with those 2, make one too easy and you make the other two irrelevant.

Introducing an instant trade system akin to a traditional auction house raises concerns about potential repercussions on the game's balance. Such a system might necessitate widespread adjustments to drop rates, potentially making loot acquisition primarily reliant on trade rather than in-game drops. This is already a prevalent issue in high-end play, where stringent loot filters, driven by the efficiency of trade, often lead to devalued loot and a diminished sense of accomplishment.

In the event of a full-scale auction house implementation, there's a risk of catastrophic consequences. Developers would likely need to impose arbitrary taxation and restrictions to counterbalance the impact on players who prefer a more traditional loot-focused experience. While trade is an integral part of PoE, the current system allows players to choose whether to engage in it extensively or opt for a more self-sufficient playstyle.

Fortunately, GGG has expressed a commitment to improving the trading experience. The idea of integrating trade sites directly into the game is a positive step towards reducing friction and streamlining the trading process. The challenge lies in finding a balance between accommodating new items for bulk trading and avoiding power creep. The developers are cautious about introducing changes that could inadvertently disrupt the game's delicate balance and are opting for gradual, well-considered improvements to prevent unforeseen consequences. This approach aims to enhance the trading experience without compromising the essence of the game for both seasoned and newer players.

Trade's importance to the game cannot be understated; GGG understands that this game is economy-driven, and they recognize the impact that small changes in values and player population can have on their numbers mid-league. Changing something as substantial as the trade system without experimenting with it in a safe environment would be a recipe for disaster. I reckon they'd be less likely to fail miserably if they did this on a separate game, perhaps other than PoE 1 and PoE 2, where they aren't as financially dependent and financially invested to the deep end of their future, respectively.