[3.21] Aegis Incinerate Elementalist - Tank with over 10mil Shaper DPS!

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AndyLovesHisBge wrote:

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stoudtlr wrote:

Spoiler

Hey Andy! Thanks for the critique on the CI version. Here's a new POB for the hybrid version you were working on that includes Purity of Elements. This has been a lot of fun to theory craft!

https://pastebin.com/RUuUYVy1

Maxed res to include Chaos, strength/intel equal, and 10mil dps when flasks are up

Adding Purity actually makes it easier to balance everything.
1. Swap the watcher's eye for the +Chaos version.
2. Gloves with +1 gems, strength (20-30), and lightning or cold res. One in POB is listed on trade for 1ex.
3. New ring with minimum 60 chaos, the missing res (cold or lightning) and an open prefix to craft -mana. 70c for one in POB
4. Conqueror's Efficiency jewel. This is only needed if you want hextouch linked to Tempest shield. self casting curse on boss wouldn't be bad if you need the rare jewel for res or strength you couldn't get on gloves or ring

Strength is close enough to intel at that point to throw a couple divines at your Circle of Anguish until they're equal.

Edit: Change #5 would be swapping the small cluster from reduced zealotry res to reduced determination reservation

This is BEAUTIFUL!! Fantastic theory craft :) !!

* Full mana sustain

* Nice damage

* Wonderful health pool of 8k, especially considering this is now fully ailment immune)

Looks great!

Here are some questions/comments

1) In place of Righteous Fire, can we use Vaal Righteous Fire to pick up extra burst damage when needed? I know VRF comes with a down side but I wanted to make sure it was an option for those that wanted it.

2) I am still a bit concerned that we can not support Righteous Fire unless we are stationary. Having to turn on and off RF is not going to be fun. Is there any way we support RF with out having to stop?

3) In past leagues, we have tried to shoot for trees that ended around 96/97 which we felt was more reasonable for people to achieve during a league. What 3-4 points would you remove from the build in this case?

4) I have never used corrupted soul with this build. I see it gives an insane amount of ES. But we also base much of our recovery on getting back our ES. How much of an issue will it be that so much damage will bypass our ES? We have life leech on our weapon. Will that be enough?

5) Typically in past leagues we have tried very hard to be 100% stun immune. I see that we are a healthy 90% in this POB. I assume that will be enough but I wanted to raise the point in case that might be an issue. Getting stunned sucks for this build because channeling has to start over from scratch and we lose lots of dps.

6) For fun I like to lower the cost of the theory builds to see what is possible early in a league. As such I removed Bottled Faith, removed Enlighten (which means I also removed Herald of Ash to fit everything in), and lowered Empower to a level 3. Enlighten 4, Bottled Faith, and Empower 4 are always going to be really expensive. Even with removing those powerful items (along with HOA), the damage is still an extremely healthy 5.7M which we know from previous leagues is more than good enough to do T16's which we create currency for the big ticket items.

Bravo!!! I would love to hear your feedback on some of my comments. My only real concern is number 2. If I can find a way to mitigate that (or learn to shut it off when needed), I am very likely to use your POB as a baseline for 3.17 (depending on nerfs of course).

Thanks! Theory crafting for 3.17 already is what brought me here. :-) Hopefully we don't see any big nerfs or changes as I'm excited to try an incinerate tank again.

1) VRF could be used, but I personally don't like it since the nerf in 3.14. Losing 60% of life and es when you use it instead of only the 30% that it used to take really drops your EHP and makes you vulnerable to getting one shot before you regen

2) I am as well. We only regen ES when on consecrated ground so I think RF would only be used on bosses. 7.6mil DPS without RF should be more than enough while mapping I think.

3) damage nodes for sure - heart of flame, rapid infusion, blast radius, amplify, etc. still at 6.3mil mapping dps without those.

4) i've never used it with this build either, but I have with others. it shouldn't be an issue since incoming damage is split 50/50 between ES and life. Will have 700+ regen and leach

5) my mistake. we are 100%. POB should have had the last 15% stun avoidance node selected instead of Static Blows. I don't believe Static Blows does much of anything for us since it's the Skitter Bots, not us, that are shocking enemies.

6) for the amulet the most important IMO would be +3 fire due to RF. least important would be cold since the build has 82% cold res already. One with +3 fire, +2 light, and -2 cold listed right now for 2ex. With -2 cold we are still at 80% cold. :-)

Let me know your thoughts

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stoudtlr wrote:

Thanks! Theory crafting for 3.17 already is what brought me here. :-) Hopefully we don't see any big nerfs or changes as I'm excited to try an incinerate tank again.

1) VRF could be used, but I personally don't like it since the nerf in 3.14. Losing 60% of life and es when you use it instead of only the 30% that it used to take really drops your EHP and makes you vulnerable to getting one shot before you regen

2) I am as well. We only regen ES when on consecrated ground so I think RF would only be used on bosses. 7.6mil DPS without RF should be more than enough while mapping I think.

3) damage nodes for sure - heart of flame, rapid infusion, blast radius, amplify, etc. still at 6.3mil mapping dps without those.

4) i've never used it with this build either, but I have with others. it shouldn't be an issue since incoming damage is split 50/50 between ES and life. Will have 700+ regen and leach

5) my mistake. we are 100%. POB should have had the last 15% stun avoidance node selected instead of Static Blows. I don't believe Static Blows does much of anything for us since it's the Skitter Bots, not us, that are shocking enemies.

6) for the amulet the most important IMO would be +3 fire due to RF. least important would be cold since the build has 82% cold res already. One with +3 fire, +2 light, and -2 cold listed right now for 2ex. With -2 cold we are still at 80% cold. :-)

Let me know your thoughts

Regarding nerfs, would it kill GGG to give a little love to an older underused skill like Incinerate? :) We can always dream.


1) I never used VRF before in this build until 3.16 due to the downside. But I used a little trick to mitigate the down side. I would only use it before boss fights and then I would instantly drink Sorrow of the Divine and then a life flask that had instant recovery when on low life (which is a great mod of this build since we are always low life no matter what). After drinking these two, I would be back to full life and ES instantly. It really removed the danger. I needed VRF before items like Empower 4, Bottled Faith etc to help against the end game bosses. Sorrow of the Divine also gives a little DPS boost as well along with the healing effects.

However, I don't think I can employ this in a build with RF because the flask gives us Zealots Oath as well.

2) Oh, I did not realize it would only be used against bosses but that makes sense. I was hoping we could use it when mapping but I don't see a way around the degen issue when moving from pack to pack. Maybe some one will come up with an interesting idea to give us a little more life regen/fire protection.

The 4 second window when bossing should be more then enough to keep RF up even if we are dodging a lot. I assume every time we stop even for a moment, the 4 second clock starts again?

Hmm that actually brings up an interesting question....

If we are mapping and we have finished off a pack, and are ready to move to the next one, and we start chaining our flame dashes together, does the moment we end a Flame Dash restart the 4 second window and as such give us the chance to sustain RF? Or is it other items well beyond the Concecrated ground that helps us sustain?


3) ok that is what I figured as well.

4) cool!

5) I agree Static Blows will not work. Also, there is a small side benefit in the POB with this change. Not only do you cap Stun but you also cap cold res (which needed exactly 3 more res to cap at 85 with out a flask which is what the stun node gives).

6) Agreed. Also see #5 for cold which is even better now :)

This is so fun, thank you for engaging in the thread.

It would be really fun to go all the way back to the beginning where the build started which was Inquisitor and ailment immune many many leagues ago :) I hope this theory craft can survive the patch notes.

Note that we have had some leagues where a naked Golem dies almost instantly in hard content. If that is the case in 3.17, I may consider using Vaal Haste again.

This is a lovely little boost to Incin when fighting a boss with out the down side of VRF.

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AndyLovesHisBge wrote:

Note that we have had some leagues where a naked Golem dies almost instantly in hard content. If that is the case in 3.17, I may consider using Vaal Haste again.

This is a lovely little boost to Incin when fighting a boss with out the down side of VRF.

That's a great point! Vaal Haste would be a bigger boost on bosses than the lightning golem anyway even if you don't have the dex to fully level it.

I think I see one other item we need to discuss.

In this build, CWDT and TS both proc quite a bit since we are always getting hit, blocking and taking damage. WOC uses 33 mana, and Assassins' Mark uses 29 mana.

I think if both of those start procing, it is going to starve Incin of the mana it needs to channel.

Only having 60ish mana as an unreserved pool may be too small. We may have one too many auras to effectively run the build (skitterbots may have pushed us to far over the top).

If we remove Skitterbots and add back in Defiance Banner, that would give us more room to play effectively.

We lose shock and chill but they are meaningless if we can't run the build.

Is there any other way to get more efficient and give us more head room? I think we needed around 120ish mana left over to feel good in 3.16.

So during mapping and bossing, we can easily maintain 100% consecrated ground uptime. every flame dash or even frost blink resets the 4s duration and obviously attacking gives us consecrate so RF shouldn't be an issue to sustain.

Static blows isn't completely useless since it will give us increased lightning ailments allowing us to get 20% sap easier and for longer. 20% sap is extremely underrated and that single point could be the difference between 16% sap and say 20% sap.

Also skitterbots wont work with static blows because our character has to be the one to shock. It is also my guess that arctic armor will have full effect even with the necklace since it seems like the enemies chill themselves, so we arent the ones who inflict the ailment.

The amulet Leadership's Price is also not league starter friendly, I believe it drops from a heist boss or something like that and it doesn't become available for some time. So I think the idea is to run the standard EO Inquisitor version and then transition to Leadership's Price. Should only require a few items and some orbs of regret.

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jeekudo92 wrote:

So during mapping and bossing, we can easily maintain 100% consecrated ground uptime. every flame dash or even frost blink resets the 4s duration and obviously attacking gives us consecrate so RF shouldn't be an issue to sustain.


Also skitterbots wont work with static blows because our character has to be the one to shock. It is also my guess that arctic armor will have full effect even with the necklace since it seems like the enemies chill themselves, so we arent the ones who inflict the ailment.

* Does consecrated ground alone sustain RF? I thought we needed Tukohama as well as other pieces in the build?


*I agree that Skitterbots don't work specifically with Static Blows but I think Skitterbots still shock the enemies which provides us a damage boost since shocked enemies take more damage. Is this correct?

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AndyLovesHisBge wrote:

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jeekudo92 wrote:

So during mapping and bossing, we can easily maintain 100% consecrated ground uptime. every flame dash or even frost blink resets the 4s duration and obviously attacking gives us consecrate so RF shouldn't be an issue to sustain.


Also skitterbots wont work with static blows because our character has to be the one to shock. It is also my guess that arctic armor will have full effect even with the necklace since it seems like the enemies chill themselves, so we arent the ones who inflict the ailment.

* Does consecrated ground alone sustain RF? I thought we needed Tukohama as well as other pieces in the build?


*I agree that Skitterbots don't work specifically with Static Blows but I think Skitterbots still shock the enemies which provides us a damage boost since shocked enemies take more damage. Is this correct?

For RF, I believe with vitality, even without Tukohama we are still positive, I would have to double check.

Yeah, Skitterbots shock is still nice, it goes to around 18-19% shock effect which isnt terrible. However it is a 35% reservation so it comes at quite a cost.

There are numerous ways to deal with chaos resists. Cleansed Thoughts annointment could be a great way to reach the cap assuming we hit the 37 chaos resistance without it.

ok here are the lastest changes to the Inquisitor build

1) Removed Skitterbots entirely from build to fix our mana

2) Moved Herald of Ash to the Enlighten set up to take advantage of Enlighten

3) Added back in Defiance Banner

4) Removed Charisma from Necklace as we have 136 mana left over with out it, which is a nice amount to run the build

5) Removed Lightning Golem and added Vaal Haste

6) In place of Charisma I added in old favorite Soul of Steel* which gets our resists to 81/86/81 and gives a nice chunk of armor. The extra point in Fire Res may help us sustain RF while mapping if we want to attempt that.



* There are a million choices you can make here so if any one sees a better idea please let me know. This version is extra tanky with Soul of Steel and still tops out over 10m in burst mode with Vaal Haste. Even with out Vaal Haste we are still close to 9m dps.

Lets keep improving this!! I am sure we can come up with better ideas than mine :)

Here is the latest Inquisitor that brings in the changes from above

https://pastebin.com/fkvfHaaE

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AndyLovesHisBge wrote:

ok here are the lastest changes to the Inquisitor build

1) Removed Skitterbots entirely from build to fix our mana

2) Moved Herald of Ash to the Enlighten set up to take advantage of Enlighten

3) Added back in Defiance Banner

4) Removed Charisma from Necklace as we have 136 mana left over with out it, which is a nice amount to run the build

5) Removed Lightning Golem and added Vaal Haste

6) In place of Charisma I added in old favorite Soul of Steel* which gets our resists to 81/86/81 and gives a nice chunk of armor. The extra point in Fire Res may help us sustain RF while mapping if we want to attempt that.



* There are a million choices you can make here so if any one sees a better idea please let me know. This version is extra tanky with Soul of Steel and still tops out over 10m in burst mode with Vaal Haste. Even with out Vaal Haste we are still close to 9m dps.

Lets keep improving this!! I am sure we can come up with better ideas than mine :)

Here is the latest Inquisitor that brings in the changes from above

https://pastebin.com/fkvfHaaE

I like the changes!

Would 97 mana still be enough? If so we can remove the +1 gems corrupted gloves now too. Will make gearing a little cheaper and easier. Stats we need without the corruption are about 40c instead of 1ex.

I think this version is the best so far. On paper at least until someone actually tests it. I started buying gear in standard to try on my level 100 templar, but quickly remembered how expensive everything is there and why I don't play there. :-)

This final version (maybe?) is great because of the anoint options for Stampede now.
1. Soul of Steel - Defensive option. Agree with you that this is probably the best one on finished build
2. Charisma - still a great option until Enlighten is leveled
3. Throat Seeker or Heart Seeker - 30% crit multi DPS option. +700k DPS
4. Cleansed Thoughts - Doubled chaos res is great obviously if you can't get the chaos version of watchers eye or gear with chaos res is too expensive.