Reworked and Changed Ascendancy Classes in Path of Exile: Echoes of the Atlas

Honestly, I don't like how you removed two elemental penetration from Ascendant. Exposure is not same thing, especially when you use totems...

next assassin nerf: remove critical strike and elusive entirely. balanced.

wtf, nice changes

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Zaturnin wrote:

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AbyssOfManus wrote:

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Zaturnin wrote:

Well, that's more than 65% less damage for Necromancers. And 20% less manage. What a "light" nerf.

You understand that it is increased, right? If it was more, then the necro would be extremely bad. However, increased means like 10-15% less damage at the worst (if you pick Gravepact and Righteous army/redemption wheel, you already have 105% INCREASED minion damage).

With the current ascendancy + basic skill tree, if you grab all the minion nodes, you are sitting at 435% INCREASED minion damage.

The full effect will thus be 15% less damage. This does not include the cluster(fuck) jewels , which will decrease the #% less damage above.

The way I read it, it says "Removed : Minion deal 15% increased damage" ; Added : Minion deal 10% increased damage". So that's a 5% less damage to each of those nodes... I'm not sure how you see that as an increase ? Plus the flat out removal of Corpse Pact 30% damage buff further adds to that.

The small node change - -5% is not less, it is reduced. there is difference between that.

MATH: x*y*z , where x is flat damage, y is 1+(% increased/reduced damage/100) and z is 1+(% more/less damage /100)

Now, when you understand this, 5% reduced is much less than the 5% less.
What you thing the change is, is LESS. In reality, it is REDUCED.

MATH #2 : Your minion deals 1000 flat damage, you had 400% increased minion damage (PRENERF) and 200% more damage via support gems (this is the example).

What I have pointed out, was the from like 5 nodes from 15% to 10%.

POST NERF will be looking like this - 1000 flat damage (unchanged), 375% increased damage (POST NERF) and 200% more damage.

NOW MATH #3 :

Prenerf damage - 1000* [1+(400%/100%)]* [1+(200%/100%)] = 1000*5*3 = 15000 damage

Postnerf damage - 1000% [1+(375%/100%)] * [1+(200%/100%)]= 1000*4,75*3 = 14250 damage

You have lost 100% * [1-(14250/15000)] = 5% damage (or in the POE calculation, it would be written as 5% LESS damage).

POINT #2
I was talking about cluster jewels that add more multipliers to the equation. Thus, the percentage loss can be even lower, because you can generate more INCREASED damage via cluster jewels than through the passive skill tree.

People saying these changes are good, or "shaking the game up" must also think the Riot games approach of purposely releasing broken shit and nerfing into the ground after people buy it, is a good concept. The DOTA approach is better.

Seriously, buffed underused gems and items is how you change the meta, and removing useless content, NOT adding more useless shit, and nerfing everything strongarmed.

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hyttemaier wrote:

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AbyssOfManus wrote:

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hyttemaier wrote:

This all would be good if they buffed the base movement speed to at least 20% more... its around the 60% MS the game starts to feel good, with avoiding boss mechanics ect..

What i dont get is, why not buff all the classes, and then if you want to slow the game down, buff the monsters aswell, noone likes nerfs.. and especialy when its a core mechanic of a class...

Lets take gladiator as an example he now have 20% more damage with bleed, but the scion (gladiator) have 25% more damage with bleed..


The assasin had alot of movement speed, and that felt good

If you buff everything to the same level, then buff monsters, you will eventually end up with D3. Thats not good.

I agree on you with the movement speed, even though assassin was one of the fastest classes out there (only ones being faster were all ranger ascendancies). And many people forget about elusive effectivness (seems to me like it was buffed, but i can be mistaken).

Gladiator bleed damage nerf is kinda bad, but when compared with the ascendant, he still has explosions (no need for conqueror chest or haemophilia). Also, you now get the 100% bleed chance much faster and blind can be good in the boss fights (10% was really hard to proc compared to 25%).

When you think about it, the right side of the passive tree you have ES+EVA in the top right, and dodge+EVA in the lower right side, while evasion is a great defensive layer you support it with other defensive layers such as movement speed dodge..

Now the assassin give you zero movement speed, beeing one of the slowest classes there is, while we still have movement speed on the juggernaut, one of THE most tanky base classes there is.

Evasion pairs well with movement speed is my point here.

What about elusive? it gives you 30% movement speed at the start, now it has more effectivness (you can push it higher than 50% increased effect iirc? forgot to check on exact numbers). so, everyone crying about it - if its 50% increased effect, every time you crit, you get 45% increased movement speed, thus it is better than 10% increased which was removed. It is a nerf for nonelusive assassins (who even does that?). Thats how I see it.

elusive is a debuff, so the effectiveness drops over time, and so you have a yo yo effect with movement speed.

for the most classes looks nice but there are class that got just basically strait up nerfed overall

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Thatsnasty wrote:

People saying these changes are good, or "shaking the game up" must also think the Riot games approach of purposely releasing broken shit and nerfing into the ground after people buy it, is a good concept. The DOTA approach is better.

Seriously, buffed underused gems and items is how you change the meta, and removing useless content, NOT adding more useless shit, and nerfing everything strongarmed.

Exactly this. There are two ways to go about "game balancing"

1) Balance things

2) Cycle Strong things

Riot Games, and GGG, have both published essays on why they choose #2. It's just rough to read through comments here, and 20% of GGG news posts, where they pretend like they do #1 for whatever reason.

How the heck you trying to discuss GGG's balancing when you don't even know their goals?

I really like the Juggernaut ascendancy buff. I mean, additional 0.5% life regen is some crazy stuff. And how streamlined, more enjoyable it feels now, pure fun! Made my day :)