Death Penalty System - EXP Loss in particular
" Diablo 2 is an offline single-player game. I played it when I was 11 and managed just fine. If this stuff is happening to you, maybe update your machine from a literal potato. D2R doesn't count. "Always online" wasn't a thing back then. Besides, balancing around one-shots matters very little. That's not even the core of the problem. One-shots aren't much of a problem once you learn where they are coming from, just like how people learned to adapt to porcupines' on-death spikes mechanic. The problem is that there's too much of it in the game, and when it layers, it becomes obscured, absurd and unfair. The Shaper fight is a great example of this. His slam is a one-shot for most builds, but you either learn how to deal with it or learn how to avoid it. Unless you are lagging in that moment, it never feels unfair when you die to it. Pretty much everything about that fight is very fair, minor RNG aside. Gaming PC: Win 11, 7600X3D, RTX 4080, 32GB DDR5-6000 CL30, 7000 MB/s SSD, 850W, 3840x2160p 120Hz Streaming PC: Win 11, i5-12400, RTX 4060, 32GB DDR5-6000 CL36, 7000 MB/s SSD, 450W, 1920x1080p 60Hz Last edited by BaumisMagicalWorld#0673 on Jan 16, 2025, 4:45:00 AM
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" Yeah and back then it ran on engine which sometimes forgot to render all effects so you may insta died to invisible spark from ligtning enchanted enemy even with maxed lightning res. " Too many one shots? Where? I have two 80+ characters doing T15 maps and died to oneshot maybe five times and that's just on my warrior. Last edited by Sakanabi#6664 on Jan 16, 2025, 5:45:15 AM
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" In "Diablo 2" XP loss was the only penalty existing. In PoE you lose much more progress, even if there was no XP penalty. Saying that "It was in D2" is ignoring this fact. "War's over, soldier. You just don't know it yet. Everybody lost." Last edited by Nishrek#6401 on Jan 16, 2025, 6:25:50 AM
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The other day I made a thread in similar vain, trying to explain that not being able to level for a casual/semi-casual player is a tremendous punishment.
Most people in this forum are the top 5%. The developers are hardcore ARPG players. They will not make the endgame content enjoyable for casuals. That's what I got from it. POE1 fanatics just can't comprehend that you can play this game without watching tutorials and videos and copying all the meta builds. If you are just clicking what sounds good or you don't have good gear, you just can't progress past the lower tier of maps. Or best case scenario, all you do is T15 maps without bosses, deliriums and whatever else is there that casuals are not allowed to touch. |
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" In what way is it punishing for casual/semi-casual players? You don't need to reach level 100. In PoE there are many different goals to reach for a wide variety of players/characters, knowledge, skill, power and so on. Not every goal is for every player/character. Everybody can reach levels around 85 very easily because up to that point the XP loss is very minimal. It just takes some time. So at most you may be missing 15 skill pints. Which do not make a big difference. So what exactly is the punishment? What is detrimental to a casual/semi-casual player? Do you understand, that when you are dying, you are doing something wrong? Do you understand, that the game is designed around not dying/dying very little? What are you doing/what difficulty are you playing on when you die? Have you tried doing something different? Have you tried farming better equipment? Have you tried lowering the difficulty? " Is this a criticism? That is the way it should be. At some point a player has to build some knowledge about their character/build and has to improve their character. What do you expect/want? Do you want every player with every random skill and only normal (white) items to reach level 100 and do all content? " Yes you can, absolutely. What you cannot do on the other hand, is play like this AND expect the same outcome as someone who plays a meta build or already has 5+ years experience in PoE 1. Last edited by Avaricta#4758 on Jan 16, 2025, 8:14:50 AM
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" Some of us who don't think we're Einstein or want to suck up to the company, understand you and think the same. A game is for having fun, period. You have to make people have as much fun as possible, try to make people as frustrated and angry less possible. Because it's a GAME!!!! It's not an engineering degree test. It's a GAME!!!! I agree with the idea that if you want to get the penalty, put it in the game options. And now there are no portals. With these apparently premeditated decisions, you only make people angry and have bad experiences. Last edited by Sastre19#1001 on Jan 16, 2025, 8:36:23 AM
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" Continuously losing my progress while trying to learn. " If those skill points don't make a difference to good players, they sure do to not so good players. If you are good what do you even care about such a change? " Playing T15s. Nothing different I can play other than trials maybe. I've farmed literally hundreads of crossbows over the last 2 weeks, and hadn't been able to upgrade my weapon, even after spending 250 exalts, many chaos orbs, and a few divines trying to craft. There is no perceived change in difficulty between T10 and T15 and you said I have to farm so we can't really go lower difficulty can we? " We are on the same page finally. Yeah I'd like to improve my build and character without being arbitrarily punished. And yes I would expect people with 10-15 divines worth of gear to be able to do all late game content without pinnacle bosses, who should be mechanically challenging most of all. Guess what, that is how the whole campaign plays out and every single casual player loves it about it. Bosses should be the challenge. Death penalty is not challenge. Just punishment. |
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the whole death penalty system. needs to be removed or make two different leagues .
one without penalties . and now is your one and only chance GGG , once the train gets rolling people who decided POE 2 is not for them , wont come back no matter what . . |
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" This simply comes back to, you are not supposed to die. XP also is not the only progress. In trade every currency is progress and in general items are progress. Also shards for bosses to maybe get one of the uniques. " They make a difference, but only a very small one. If you cannot level past level 85, these 15 skill points won't help you. In this case your character has other, bigger issues or you need to change something with your playstyle. A player who cannot level past level 85 could be given 15 skill points for free and absolutely nothing about their situation would change. " Are you playing trade? If so, with that amount of currency you could easily buy a better weapon, or if not, then your weapon is already very strong. Improving your gear does not necessarily mean weapon. Like with everything in PoE it is about priorities. The weakest item with the highest potential power increase, has the highest priority. If you have spent that much currency on your weapon without upgrade I assume that your weapon either is already very strong, or you may have a sub optimal strategy for crafting. If you play SSF and your weapon is weak, highlight every acceptable weapon, advanced and expert, normal, magic and rare in your lootfilter. Then start with Transmute and Augment. Only if you roll one or two (depending on how good your current weapon is, how good the new one needs to be in order to be an upgrade) high tier damage modifier, continue with Regal and only if this affix is acceptable continue with Exalts. So to me when I think of 250 Exalts, that means I would have tried to craft at least 2000 items in order to spend that amount of Exalts. Because with most items I would not get further than Regal. You can also gamble for items and maybe find useful bases to continue crafting on. Like for casters maybe get a magic amulet with +3 spells. " Yes that is the campaign. Mapping is different. XP penalty is not meant as a challenge. If you keep dying, ergo failing, your character has not earned to receive XP. Why do you expect to be earning XP for failing? In general. Why keep players dying? I died yesterday because I screwed up. The first time in maybe 50 or so maps. How do you manage to die often enough for the XP penalty to even effect you in any way? |
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The sad truth is that death penalty does no hurt casual players. It hurts only bad players.
Last edited by Sakanabi#6664 on Jan 16, 2025, 9:15:44 AM
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