From what we've seen so far, do you feel you're going to stay with PoE1 or move to PoE2?
|
1453R is touching on this but dodge roll needs to be consistent between characters because all the mechanics will use it for the timings/safe zone windows.
Those things are far easier when everyone has the same evasive manoeuvre/charges its just way less work for far more consistent results. As everyone else loves bringing up Elden ring/DS too i'll point out that in those literally everything is based off medium dodge roll, its why heavy is considered a no-no and light is pretty irrelevant because the developer knows its far too important to fight cadence to have high variance in roll iframes. You can manipulate those in some way usually and if you can get them any longer it becomes busted quickly. Consistent fight difficulty is primarily a product of controlling the players interactions with that fight. |
|
" I was about to comment this. If there's a dodge roll, it needs to have i-frames. It's not gonna work without them. Especially when it has a cooldown attached to it. I've played other ARPGs and other Souls games where they had a dodge roll but no i-frames. Can't put any names to them right now off the top of my head, but let me tell you: it sucked. You'd then either use certain skills that re-positioned you anyway, or invest into more movement speed so that you could just run out of the way. And Souls-likes without i-frames is a no-no. Win 11, RTX 4080, i7-13700K, 32GB DDR5-6000, 7000 MB/s SSD, 4k Ultra
------------------------------------------------------ If PoE 2 has no CWDT builds, I will quit for good. |
|
" PoE2's roll does not have conventional "YOU PHASE OUT OF REALITY" iframes. It does offer a 100% avoidance chance for single-target attacks such as melee strikes or projectiles - during your dodge all such attacks automatically miss. AoE effects ignore the dodge if you're still in the AoE when it goes off, which honestly makes sense - a fireball is going to explode you if you're in it regardless of whether you're swinging a weapon or circus tumbling. Each proactive defense option Grinding Gear is adding to the game is intended to be a solution to some problems, rather than all problems. The dodge roll solves animation lock and adds avoidance against telegraphed blows. Active block similarly offers powerful mitigation and I believe it works against AoE, but only in a single direction - overhead attacks defeat active block and it swiftly becomes useless if you allow yourself to become swarmed while standing in place blocking. Crowd-control effects give you breathing room and openings to strike, but they can't be used repeatedly. And of course this is all on top of the usual PoE passive defenses - Armor/ES/Evasion, resists, damage reduction, Spell Suppression/Deflection (all the 'DOES SPELL SUPPRESSION STILL WORK?!' crap is guaranteed to be "no, because Deflection replaces Suppression in PoE2 and applies to all attacks"), slows/snares, all that jazz. Not to mention the jank crap people will inevitably come up with, like Ward Loop. Passive defenses weigh far more heavily in PoE2 than they do in Elden Souls: Wrath of Blood, and reduce the need for the dodge roll to do all the game's defensive lifting. | |
" This is gonna backfire. Watch them do a 180 after community backlash. " Honestly, the more I read about it, the less I want to play it. They are strafing way too far from the formula that got them where they are now. As the saying goes: "Never change a running system." There was another recent major flop of a game that tried something similar, and I was initially excited to try it up until I read the reviews: No Rest for the Wicked. Win 11, RTX 4080, i7-13700K, 32GB DDR5-6000, 7000 MB/s SSD, 4k Ultra
------------------------------------------------------ If PoE 2 has no CWDT builds, I will quit for good. |
|
" That's why they created PoE2 to have more space and freedom to experiment in new areas because they didn't want to 100% revamp their different PoE1 for that. In the end lots of people are just going to complain because they are getting challenged and hit a wall because of skill issue and simply because they can't face roll everything right away upon release. Pretty much the same state PoE1 once had but it's never bad to have something fresh and different on the market with the large range of different interest. Flames and madness. I'm so glad I didn't miss the fun. Last edited by Pashid on Sep 19, 2024, 2:10:41 PM
| |
|
the thing to keep in mind with that sort of criticism of the new game - "why fix what ain't broke?", "never change a running system", and all the like is that the dedicated PoE1 players with many thousands of hours in the game, Magebloods and Mirrors exploding from their nostrils in Standard, and such are unable to see where the system IS broke, and where it's NOT running.
Path of Exile the First has the toughest barriers to entry in the entire genre by an order of magnitude, at the very least. Watching high-level PoE is like watching someone doing speed, LSD, and meth all at the same time after thirty-seven red Bulls - it is utterly impossible to read, even for many players with hundreds of hours in the game. Many of the game's core systems are hopelessly outdated and have been patched, jury-rigged, and kludged into shape so often they're impossible to straighten back out. For players who've been there since the start and followed along with every slap fix and Jimmyjohning, that's not a problem - but it means the game is basically a cliff for newcomers. One laden with mines, and with a community that delights in nothing more than sniping newcomers off the cliff whenever a chance presents itself. I wouldn't even say that the game is necessarily for "hardcore gamers". It's for a very specific type of hardcore gamer. Skilled and experienced Gamer Life players coming in from other games often bounce off this one because it's so fiddly and up its own butt that finding the Ouroboros trail into Gitting Gud is rarely worth the time and effort. ARPG players and old Diablo 2 people have an easier time because they were primed on similar games, but even for many of them Path of Exile 1 is simply too much work - and the game's ugly animations and dated aesthetic doesn't help. Again, PoE1's die-hard fans aren't going to see any of this. Or when they do, they're not going to consider it important or telling, because a True Fan would fight through all of that exactly the same way they did themselves. But without the benefit of ten years of gradual acclimation to the current state of the game, how much "climb the mine-laden, sniper-infested cliff" is a new player, a casual player, or an out-of-genre player experimenting supposed to tolerate before they bounce? And how much bouncing is Grinding Gear supposed to accept in pursuit of catering to its existing base of players? Path 2 isn't necessarily for PoE1 diehards. PoE1 is for PoE1 diehards. PoE2, at its best, is for people who'd like to be PoE1 diehards but are unwilling to watch Zizaran for five hundred hours before playing the game in order to learn how to Streamer Meme money out of thin air to pay for seventeen Magebloods' worth of build to farm Uber Maven with. Or, in other words, for ordinary players wanting to try the slickest new ARPG on the market. | |
|
I can only speak for myself here, but I play PoE because it allows me to create chaos on the screen.
Games like Vampire Survivors aren't vastly popular because they offer your standard boring toolkit. 98% positive at 223.4k reviews vs 89% positive at 226.1k reviews for PoE. And one of them has dated pixel graphics and actually costs 5 bucks to play. I play PoE for when I want some repetitive gameplay in the form of massive monster massacre, while at the same time straining my brain cells to solve efficiency problems. And I still think that whole divided crowd pleasing is doomed to fail. One of them is gonna die, it's just a matter of which and after how long. Win 11, RTX 4080, i7-13700K, 32GB DDR5-6000, 7000 MB/s SSD, 4k Ultra
------------------------------------------------------ If PoE 2 has no CWDT builds, I will quit for good. |
|
|
Holy frick, it just hit me. I suddenly remember what game that was I was talking about earlier. Or, at least one of them:
Vikings - Wolves of Midgard It had a dodge roll just like that, and it sucked hard. Seriously, go check it out and see what I mean. Edit: phrasing Win 11, RTX 4080, i7-13700K, 32GB DDR5-6000, 7000 MB/s SSD, 4k Ultra ------------------------------------------------------ If PoE 2 has no CWDT builds, I will quit for good. Last edited by BaumisMagicalWorld on Sep 19, 2024, 2:31:41 PM
|
|
" I don't think this could be more elegantly stated. I love POE1 I want to be good at it so very bad, but even after lots of play time I'm still stuck following build guides and not really understanding stuff outside of league mechanics and gem combinations. Itemization is eldritch to me at this point. The game is still fun of course, I wouldn't be here or have the support packs I do if I didn't think so, but by Kiava it is DENSE. POE2 is a game that I can get into early and grow with. That's appealing all on its own before we even get into the idea that I find the gameplay more engaging and the bosses exciting. | |
" it has to be that way. you just gonna stand in the middle of an uber atziri double flameblast, not bother to move out of the aoe then just press roll before it explodes to take 0 damage? the way mitigate an aoe is to not be in the aoe, zoning is a major part of how aoe damage plays. |
|
