Bex Confirms ExileCon is the Jumping-Off Point for Path of Exile 2's Marketing

I was gobsmacked when Chris told me that act IV's advent was so momentous that it would be signified with a new version number. 2.0. Holy shit. That was a really big deal.

And Fall of Oriath being 3.0? Equally momentous.

4.0 will be no less so. Probably even more so given 7 acts of completely new content, skill overhaul, etc.

But as DS44 said, outside of OW2, never in my long history of gaming can I recall an obvious version upgrade also be called a sequel. I don't play series that are apt to do this (COD, Fifa, etc) but if that is your whataboutist response, so be it: set the bar that low for PoE if you wish.

But I feel we can and should hold GGG to a higher standard than series reputed for slush and churn. PoE 4.0 or PoE 2: it can't be both and we all of us need to decide for ourselves which it is. Do GGG get to decide since it's their game? Well they are free to label it as such. And we are free to accept or reject that. It sounds like a simple choice but I have already all but exhausted explanations of what that choice really represents.

So many of my queries go unanswered here while people respond with questions I have already mostly answered. Frustrating, but hardly unusual.

I have also outlined my threshold for 4.0 earning its designation as a sequel and I already know GGG won't do it. Don't have to. Because luckily for them, not all or even many of its long time supporters are as exacting with language as I am.

This thread feels played out in light of how much more we will know in less than a month. Topic title is 100% fact. The rest...varying degrees of opinions. My initial response was cheap sarcasm and honestly I probably should have left it there.

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鬼殺し wrote:

But as DS44 said, outside of OW2, never in my long history of gaming can I recall an obvious version upgrade also be called a sequel. I don't play series that are apt to do this (COD, Fifa, etc) but if that is your whataboutist response, so be it: set the bar that low for PoE if you wish.

Is the first sentence here really less "whataboutism" than the second?

Fuck it, GGG are doing their thing and shouldn't really be judged by "what other games have or haven't done" when it comes to version numbers or naming schemes. It's not like they have (ever) tried to follow "the norm". Let them do their thing, and we can just sit back and watch how it plays out and judge it based on the result.

Let the nit-pickers pick their semantic nits. GGG is promoting "Path of Exile II" (based on the shiny, new logo), not PoE 4.0.

I'll be playing PoE II, along with all the other Exiles. =^[.]^=

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Raycheetah wrote:

I'll be playing PoE II, along with all the other Exiles. =^[.]^=

Interestingly this is the other slightly smaller issue. No one has a choice in what is happening with PoE. We will all be playing this "new" version of PoE whether we want it or not.

If someone likes the old PoE1 systems and experience, well that's too bad. There is no going back to it and playing it later. There is no, "hey maybe I will fire up PoE1 and play for a bit".

Sure the OG PoE1 campaign is there, but the OG "game" itself will not be. All the system and mechanical changes are global.

Again a bit of a small thing, but there is a more than zero percent chance that some players don't like the changes coming to PoE2, and this could be an unintended side effect.

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DarthSki44 wrote:

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Raycheetah wrote:

I'll be playing PoE II, along with all the other Exiles. =^[.]^=

Interestingly this is the other slightly smaller issue. No one has a choice in what is happening with PoE. We will all be playing this "new" version of PoE whether we want it or not.

If someone likes the old PoE1 systems and experience, well that's too bad. There is no going back to it and playing it later. There is no, "hey maybe I will fire up PoE1 and play for a bit".

Sure the OG PoE1 campaign is there, but the OG "game" itself will not be. All the system and mechanical changes are global.

Again a bit of a small thing, but there is a more than zero percent chance that some players don't like the changes coming to PoE2, and this could be an unintended side effect.

That's something that has happened since early days of POE. I'm sure a lot of people would love to go back and play 1.x, 2.x, or 3.x version of POE but can't. I think there are a lot of people that would want to play a specific league over and over again even. There is nothing new here around that topic, and POE2/4.0 doesn't change that. Stating that POE1 would be available to play if POE2 was a separate game assumes facts outside of the evidence. Hell, I recall Chris a long time ago discussing just turning the servers off and POE going away before an offline version was available back when the push for offline was heavy because of desync. I wish I could find that quote to back it up, but I can't.

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Phrazz wrote:

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DarthSki44 wrote:

Every single sequel, trilogy, 6th installment, 16th version, of an IP I can fathom, has been a standalone title.

But you and I both know that several developers make new games 'just' to sell more. Think FIFA, CoD or whatever, where you can't really claim "a new engine" or major changes from the last installment. Just a new game to make the last one obsolete, heavily encouraging players to buy the new one where 99% of all changes made could've been made through an expansion.

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Now that doesnt mean it cannot work, or that players will be fooled/tricked/mislead, whatever you want to call it, by this marketing. Either way if the players are satisfied with 4.0, then I guess it doesn't matter what it was called, and all those that knew what actually happened can do is shrug, and say "well played GGG".

This is the key. The thing here, is the "designed to be played forever" part. PoE is more or less unprecedented when it comes to how progressive it is, how much (and often) new content is being pushed out (for better or worse). To me, it only makes sense to keep this progression, but at the same time make huge changes to animations, models, graphics, physics, new weapon types and certain new gameplay systems. If we add the F2P argument into this, it makes a lot of sense.

As I've written before; I don't care what they call it. If the new character models, new animations, new story line, new weapon types and new gameplay systems make the experience FEEL like a sequel, I think it will justify the naming scheme. Especially if we add that Chris said himself at the Exilecon that they decided to call it "PoE 2" after a lot of discussion internally.

It makes a lot of sense, that should be enough to end the naming discussion. Should they be more clear about it? Yes. And I'm sure they will during and after the Exilecon, when we're closing in on release.

poe2 is poe1 upgrade visually, animations etc...
and an added leveling path
gonna feel different but at least wont mess it up as much as blizzard did with diablo4.
right GGG?

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Nubatron wrote:

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DarthSki44 wrote:

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Raycheetah wrote:

I'll be playing PoE II, along with all the other Exiles. =^[.]^=

Interestingly this is the other slightly smaller issue. No one has a choice in what is happening with PoE. We will all be playing this "new" version of PoE whether we want it or not.

If someone likes the old PoE1 systems and experience, well that's too bad. There is no going back to it and playing it later. There is no, "hey maybe I will fire up PoE1 and play for a bit".

Sure the OG PoE1 campaign is there, but the OG "game" itself will not be. All the system and mechanical changes are global.

Again a bit of a small thing, but there is a more than zero percent chance that some players don't like the changes coming to PoE2, and this could be an unintended side effect.

That's something that has happened since early days of POE. I'm sure a lot of people would love to go back and play 1.x, 2.x, or 3.x version of POE but can't. I think there are a lot of people that would want to play a specific league over and over again even. There is nothing new here around that topic, and POE2/4.0 doesn't change that. Stating that POE1 would be available to play if POE2 was a separate game assumes facts outside of the evidence. Hell, I recall Chris a long time ago discussing just turning the servers off and POE going away before an offline version was available back when the push for offline was heavy because of desync. I wish I could find that quote to back it up, but I can't.

This time with 4.0 will be different than previous iterations. We are talking about fundamental changes to linking and skills for example, and consequently how the gearing and progression will work.

Way beyond "I like XXX league".

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DarthSki44 wrote:

fundamental changes

I like how in some of your arguments, we're talking "fundamental changes" to the point where PoE players might react badly to them, while in other arguments, you're downplaying "PoE 2" and its changes for everything it's worth. But hey, we're talking "more than 0%", so it has to be mentioned :)

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heaven0777 wrote:

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DarthSki44 wrote:

This is bizzare.

Every single sequel, trilogy, 6th installment, 16th version, of an IP I can fathom, has been a standalone title.

Not in one single case can I recall a major developer, taking an existing game, creating an expansion, dlc, patch, whatever, and then calling it a new game, or rebranding it as a sequel. Not ever in my entire gaming life can I remember a similar scenario than what is playing out with Path of Exile.

Perhaps I'm missing something, but asking to prove a negative in this case is beyond illogical. It's literally the case that every single game with sequel, or more, has done it this way.

Now that doesnt mean it cannot work, or that players will be fooled/tricked/mislead, whatever you want to call it, by this marketing. Either way if the players are satisfied with 4.0, then I guess it doesn't matter what it was called, and all those that knew what actually happened can do is shrug, and say "well played GGG".

I'd personally say Overwatch 2 has been just that. Apart from the 5v5 and of course the monetization model changing, none of the new heroes, maps and events would have been out of place in OW1. The PvE was touted as the reason for the replacement, but they gave up on following through on most of that 1.5 years before release. They wthheld content from OW1 stating that 2 was being worked on, but yeah.

OW2 is the perfect example.At least in POE's case, I understand why they decided to call 4.0 POE 2. OW2 doesn't have any system overhaul, it's just a big patch to the original game. And after they fooled everyone by canceling story mode and turning it into a simplified version locked behind a paywall, the "2" makes even less sense now.

Fuck it indeed. On that alone it seems we agree. :)