Puncture

thought it already did... for this skill at least.
but now it will though for sure lol

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soul4hdwn wrote:

thought it already did... for this skill at least.
but now it will though for sure lol

I'm pretty sure he means if it double dips now like burning dmg does. The bleed scaled with the dmg in the sense that 10% of your dmg would be done as a bleed. The question is, does projectile dmg increase the %bleed part like fire/elemental dmg now also scales burning dmg and does the scion dmg node (the general one) increase melee phys puncture bleed % now?

If it does.. I can make it work in a build. If it doesn't, it's still garbage.

EDIT: Forgot I had a char with projectile nodes. Gimme a sec to test it.

EDIT2:

Projectile dmg nodes do not increase the bleed%, only the base puncture dmg (so it says 10% bleed and doesn't double dip).

No idea why this is.. If Poison Arrow's DOT get's increased so should Puncture.
Still not worth it to use this skill.

Also tested it with my lvl 77 melee phys char. (With a 2h sword)
Not even melee splash reduces the bleed %. Only thing i'm not sure of atm is if the Scion node increases the bleed % cause it adds to all sorts of phys dmg. Have to get a Scion to test that.

EDIT3:

The Scion general phys node doesn't work either. So maybe except for uniques, there is no way to scale the bleed% itself.

sooo do we have definitive evidence that generic increased phys damage double dips for puncture? from a rustic sash for example

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Vipermagi wrote:

Well no, the percentage isn't going to change. It'll always be 10% of Physical Damage Dealt, multiplied by whatever you have that is applicable :/ Actually hitting stuff for ages will show whether it works or not (due to damage variance you need a lot of samples).

I don't have to hit it for ages. Just 10 times already showed me it isn't working.
Rustic + Scion node.
I found a mob that no matter how much he moved wouldn't die to 1 puncture. (But in the worst case, survived with like 5-10% hp)
After that I equipped the sash and specced the node.

If it would actually work I should have been able to one shot it. But again, no matter how much it moved. It wouldn't die in 1 hit. So visually, as far as I can tell. It isn't double dipping.

(and trust me, 50% dmg on top of 50% bleeding dmg would be easily visible)

"

Vipermagi wrote:

Well no, the percentage isn't going to change. It'll always be 10% of Physical Damage Dealt, multiplied by whatever you have that is applicable :/ Actually hitting stuff for ages will show whether it works or not (due to damage variance you need a lot of samples).

Considering that some tooltips now display damage per hit and no longer DPS, we may hope that in a near future, pncture tooltip is changed to reflect the modified DoT.

wow i'm sorry, when i responded to the person "TheTenthDoc", i thought the vulnerability curse was the question. that curse is what (most likely) "double dips" due to what its boosting, physical damage (initial hit and DoT) and damage over time damage. puncture consitantly deals its % damage over time. if you had strong enough damage to a mob, that 10% (up to 29%) of physical attack damage WILL "one shot" a mob. duration passives help FAR more too. and the damage while moving scales a lot more (and adds to the non moving damage rate).

now i can still be wrong, the DoT could be a converted thing like ignite damage, and thus does not apply to what i attempted to say about vurnibility's physical boost.

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soul4hdwn wrote:

wow i'm sorry, when i responded to the person "TheTenthDoc", i thought the vulnerability curse was the question. that curse is what (most likely) "double dips" due to what its boosting, physical damage (initial hit and DoT) and damage over time damage. puncture consitantly deals its % damage over time. if you had strong enough damage to a mob, that 10% (up to 29%) of physical attack damage WILL "one shot" a mob. duration passives help FAR more too. and the damage while moving scales a lot more (and adds to the non moving damage rate).

now i can still be wrong, the DoT could be a converted thing like ignite damage, and thus does not apply to what i attempted to say about vurnibility's physical boost.

The curse does 'double dip' yeah. But that already worked pre patch. So no changes really.

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Vandenreich wrote:

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Vipermagi wrote:

Well no, the percentage isn't going to change. It'll always be 10% of Physical Damage Dealt, multiplied by whatever you have that is applicable :/ Actually hitting stuff for ages will show whether it works or not (due to damage variance you need a lot of samples).

I don't have to hit it for ages. Just 10 times already showed me it isn't working.
Rustic + Scion node.
I found a mob that no matter how much he moved wouldn't die to 1 puncture. (But in the worst case, survived with like 5-10% hp)
After that I equipped the sash and specced the node.

If it would actually work I should have been able to one shot it. But again, no matter how much it moved. It wouldn't die in 1 hit. So visually, as far as I can tell. It isn't double dipping.

(and trust me, 50% dmg on top of 50% bleeding dmg would be easily visible)

Bleed isnt a physical damage, no wonder that phys damage increase dont work for it directy.

However, projectile damage nodes (or even projectile weakness curse) should work for bleed, as well as for direct damage. LMP/GMP also should reduce bleed damage dealt, resulting in ridiculously weak bleed effect (lvl 1 puncture - 5% damage dealt to bleed with lvl1 GCP, instead of 10%).