[3.5] The Blinding Blizzard - Whispering Ice CI Elequisitor - Viable For Everything

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Hi Kel

why you have fire penetration in case of life leach. is the watchers eye enought to leech and why more fire penetration ?

I'm experimenting with clear speed improvements for the high tier/bad mod Incursions, similar to the stuff used for Chayula's domain:

1. Replace Enfeeble with Flammability. There are no bosses there, nothing hits hard.
2. If you have the Watcher's Eye and the leech enchantment on the boots, replacing LL with FP works fine too.

My only problem with high tier Incursions right now is the rooms with no mobs in the center. There are some layouts where the mobs are bunched in the top and bottom parts of the room with empty corridors in the middle. You have to run to one end first, kill the architect and the mobs there, and if they don't drop a stone then you have to run all the way to the other end of the room and kill everything there. That's a bit annoying. I guess learning room layouts helps.
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1.
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- jewel sockets to the left and up from the start (rares or Izaro's; see Gear-Jewels)

Where exactly is this? Sure I saw un-allocated socket nearby the Scion starting point but I didn't remember touching any nodes to the left and up from the start.

It's the socket right and up from the start, of course. Fixed. Thank you.
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Sykar wrote:
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Kelvynn wrote:
Tried the new Incinerate for clearing. It's trash. It does too little DPS of its own and takes too long to power up (about 2 sec to reach stage 8). If I were to spend 2 sec casting on 1 pack of mobs, that would result in 5 Icestorm casts - a massive overkill/wasted time. Rares might need 2 sec of casting, but on rares SR is better because it applies extra resist debuff. So much for that idea.


Incinerate is fine. You do not have to channel the full duration to get that final 500% more damage/more ignite wave. It synergizes well with Ice Storm, Combustion and Ignite nodes for basically 100% ignite chance which means with Combusion you almost instantly have 19% fire resistance reduced.

Also it does profit from all of your fire penetration since it is a spell that hits unlike Scorching Ray. Since it is a hit it can also leech which Scorching Ray cannot do. To top it all off it also has a base crit chance which helps keeping EO going.

If you go at least partially for Ignite then Incinerate will out-damage Scorching Ray which cannot Ignite at all. Use an Emberwake Ring and you can keep up two of those monster ignites if you can brainlessly channel if you have no duration nodes or Temp Chains.
In fact my level 17 Incinerate has double the base DPS of my Scorching Ray which is level 19.

There is also the fact that it Incinerate scales off AoE gems and nodes, which means better synergy between Ice Storm and Incinerate if you use AoE nodes and gems. It makes a 5 link actually valuable on WI.

Lastly Incinerate scales greatly with quality, gaining 1% increased fire damage per 1% quality. Scorching Ray gets an almost inconsequential range increase.

Sorry, I TL;DR'd through the pleasantries between you guys. Please, no need to get like that. But a few points here:

- leech: Incinerate hits at its cast time, for me it's 5 times per second. And only while you are channeling it, and only 1 instance of it exists. The leech from that is very small compared to Icestorm.

- resist debuff: with SR and Combustion in another link you can get even more.

- DPS: that's the only thing I'm not sure about. I've tried it for Incursions, and it didn't seem to help. But maybe I didn't find an optimal duration for channelling. I'll try again. Everywhere else it looks useless: trash packs are dead/dying by the time you release it. 1-2 Icestorms is enough to kill them.
Last edited by Kelvynn on Jun 11, 2018, 7:08:35 PM
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fabricardo wrote:
Noob question, but why both Golems at level 12 only?

To add to previous answers: level 12 is chosen because of the Chaos golem. At lv 12 it gets 4% phys mitigation.
Last edited by Kelvynn on Jun 11, 2018, 7:09:16 PM
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NoImagination wrote:
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Med1umentor wrote:
If you have that kind of watcher's eye - it definitely worth to drop herald. I mean, if by droping herald we can get 1.5% of leech, then we can put something instead of life leech gem, which basically around 50% more damage (instead of about 17% or so)


Ah: I meant if it's worth dropping Herald instead of AA. I dropped the latter & replaced LL with Fire Pen.


Well, that's also a possiblity, but i tend to dislike removing defensive capabilities, and quite like AA.
Also, i kinda think that controlled destruction would be better than fire penetration, cause we already have way over more things that lower resistances (-19% from combustion, -24% from scourching ray) and on top of that 21% of penetration from ascendancy and "pure talent".

Math about it:
Spoiler
Controlled destruction will just give us damage multi of 44%, so our damage with it 1.44.

That multiplier for resistances would be (1-x)/(1-y)=1.44, where "x" is res after applying fire penetration gem, and "y" is res before applying fire penetration gem, so obviously we can say that y-x=0.37, as fire penetration gem is 37%.
Then, y=x+0.37
1-x=1.44*(0.63-x)
-x+1.44x=0.9072-1
0.44x=-0.0928
x=-0.211

So, final resist after applying all of ours debuffs and penetration must be -21%, so base resist of monster must be -21%+19%+24%+21%+37%=80%


Meaning that for fire penetration to be on the same level of controlled destruction, fire res of the enemy must be atleast 80%.
Oh, but well, it's not on the level that will make much bigger difference, i guess, and 8 stacks of SR would be only on bosses, and made our elemental overlord trigger worse, so consider it just as "thinking aloud" :)




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Med1umentor wrote:
8 stacks of SR would be only on bosses, and made our elemental overlord trigger worse, so consider it just as "thinking aloud" :)

That's exactly why I chose FP. In the Incursions you can't wait for SR to power up fully, and you start hitting most packs before they hit you, i.e. Combustion is not on yet.
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Kelvynn wrote:
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Med1umentor wrote:
8 stacks of SR would be only on bosses, and made our elemental overlord trigger worse, so consider it just as "thinking aloud" :)

That's exactly why I chose FP. In the Incursions you can't wait for SR to power up fully, and you start hitting most packs before they hit you, i.e. Combustion is not on yet.

So, i asked before, looks like it got lost in the crowd. Can you answer this, please?

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Med1umentor wrote:
By the way, about flasks... Can anyone tell me why everybody using basalt flask instead of granite?

I mean, sure, it's obvious on normal armor character, because it adds 15% of reduction regardless of our armor stat. When armor is already high - 3000 from granite flask isn't really high.

BUT... we use ES gear. Our armor stat is nonexistent. It's 0! Granite flask alone give us 25% reduction, which already almost twice as effective if compared to basalt. But also, now that we have an armor from flask, we can actually roll up to 100% increase armor on flask which will boost our flask to 40% or so, can't remember exactly.

Not even need to say that granite flask is 30/60 charges, therefore can be used twice without any additions, but basalt is 40/60.

Am i missing something, or entire forum just forgot that granite flask exist?
Use whatever flask suits you better , I'm using Granite with anti bleeding instead of Basalt one for normal mapping.

For strong physical damage bosses (Shaper, Mino , Chimera, Rigwald I use Granite
+ a Basalt flask with % reduced charges and % armour increase)
Last edited by lilianmarius on Jun 12, 2018, 7:13:59 AM
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lilianmarius wrote:
Use whatever flask suits you better , I'm using Granite with anti bleeding and increased duration instead of Basalt one for normal mapping

Yeah, i know. I'm jsut asking if i miss something in mechanic, which can be. I don't see even 1 pros of basalt over granite (on that build, atleast), but looking at everyone characters - they still prefer basalt, so i'm kinda confused if i missed something.
short answer: there are 2 kinds of "% physical reduction"

long one:
- phys reduction from flat armor (normally showed in character tab) is an estimated-number for NORMAL mobs with the same lv as your char.
- fpat phys reduction from other sources (Arctic armor, basalt, Tukohama or other pantheon....) is added into the estimated-number above when you fulfill its conditions. The main point here is this flat-phys-reduction work with EVERYTHING that deals phys damage (including phys DOT as far as I know)

Therefore, in most of the case, a basalt will provide more nutritious than a granite.

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