derail incoming...
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Hey Mark,
Thanks so much for answering all of our questions. Must be tiring given the varying degrees of quality from this thread's questions.
No problem. It's been an experience, to be sure, but I do relish these opportunities to interact with the community.
/derailed
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IGN: ___I_Fink_U_Freeky___
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Posted byKlimentiyon Jun 18, 2014, 2:36:59 AM
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Righteous Fire:
By design, Righteous Fire is meant to persist, whether or not you lose the skill. The theme of the skill is that you burn to death! As a result, if you unsocket the Righteous Fire gem, the effect will persist, but will no longer update with changes to support gems as there's no skill gem for them to support. However, if you then make changes to your gear or passives that would affect the skill, it will still detect this and change its effectiveness accordingly. If you resocket the Righteous Fire gem in the same slot, it will begin checking the support gems again, and change the effect to match.
So basicly everything except RF (the skill that gets the biggest damage boon, with lowest time investrment) gets a fix... I hope I'm reading it wrong and just unsocketing the gems won't allow for snapshot to continue, or else it's kinda unfair.
Plus the socket issue for summoners is still unresolved, all the new skills added in summoner patch take up space, auras take up space etc...If you knew that you will fix snapshot, why did you add so many mandatory (since they are the buff that you promised in the patch) supporting skills and need supports of their own, with the overly restrictive socket system of POE you should have known better.
IGNs
GroovyBeard
JooJooFromTheWell Last edited by Allnamestaken on Jun 18, 2014, 2:42:54 AM
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Posted byAllnamestakenon Jun 18, 2014, 2:37:42 AM
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If you have two different types of spectres, 1 type supported with 5 support gems and the other type supported with 4 other support gems, you have a net 9 support gems for the cost of one item and 1 minion gem. Surely you can see how that is unfair compared to other builds?
what the hell are you talking about?
if just using 1 type (and your example) - you're suggesting be 4 spectres all with 5 support gems is lesser than some with 5 and some with 4?
what you suggest would be MORE powerful. it's backwards.
i don't think you understand my argument, at all. i'm not talking about switching gear or anything. i'm saying - if we can have 4 spectres with up to 5 support gems (if 6L) for each, why can't we decide which support gems to use for each spectre; in contrast to having all spectres use the same gems? it's the same amount of gems/skills, either way. nothing's being circumvented to gain more slots/skills.
besides, like i already stated and then killed a horse to beat it some more - the obvious result is that we'll all just use the same type of spectre (4 projectile or 4 evangelists or 4 arcers or 4...) , anyway. which then defeats the stated purpose of the change.
there's no 9 support gem crap. it's going to be max 20, either way (4 spectres * up to 5 supports).
[Removed by Support]
"Your forum signature was removed as it was considered to be inappropriate and a breach of our Code of Conduct."
...it was quotes. from the forum. lolz! Last edited by robmafia on Jun 18, 2014, 2:41:02 AM
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Posted byrobmafiaon Jun 18, 2014, 2:38:57 AM
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Thanks, ruining multiple builds with 1 foul swoop, im impressed really. Lets allow something to persist for so long that people develop builds and start enjoying them. Then not be okay with it anymore and make everyone respec. Its great. Really you guys are awesome. Keep the awesome updates coming.
Joined:
May 29, 2014
troll or smurf? at least post from your real account to have a valid point.
Thanks i appreciate your opinion, i did not know that only if you had an account made longer then 20 days ago your opinion is valid. You right lets for a moment imagine that only people who played in the beta could influence GGG's potential changes to the game. Where do you think we would be. I personally think your an idiot and need to grow up. Thats just my opinion of course but its okay. Its not valid because my account was made less then 20 days ago
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Posted byIlmeriaon Jun 18, 2014, 2:39:19 AM
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There's some good feedback in your post that I'm sure some of the balance team will take into consideration, but I'd like to address this bit here and now. It's nothing to do with snapshotting specifically, so isn't part of this change, but 1.2.0 will also be changing "mine damage", "trap damage" and "totem damage" to explicitly mean damage dealt directly by a trap, totem or mine.
This means that if you place a mine that throws a trap that shoots a fireball, the fireball came from a trap and gets trap damage modifiers, but not mine damage modifiers. It came from the trap, not the mine.
Similarly, If you throw a trap or place a mine that summons a minion, and that minion uses an attack (or spell), then that attack or spell didn't come from a trap or mine and is not "trap damage" or "mine damage" so will not be affected by modifiers to either.
Just as with the snapshotting change, the balance team will also be keeping this change in mind when re-examining minions for 1.2.0.
There goes my Flame Totem Trap, oh well, next build :D
Question regarding Explosive Arrow supported by Trap: Will EA's explosion no longer benefit from trap modifiers?
Also, would you consider allowing traps & mines to grant life/mana on kill to the player? I know people would argue that trappers/miners have the benefit of being immune to reflect (which is a "sometimes" problem), but this play style lacks the constant output capacity that regular casting has and also requires placement, at which point the player is at risk. Life/mana on kill are fairly weak stats late game so I do not see it unbalancing the game at all.
Tin foil hats are a lie propagated by the aluminium industry. Last edited by Rufus82 on Jun 18, 2014, 2:41:26 AM
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Posted byRufus82on Jun 18, 2014, 2:39:48 AM
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Hey Mark,
Thanks so much for answering all of our questions. Must be tiring given the varying degrees of quality from this thread's questions.
No problem. It's been an experience, to be sure, but I do relish these opportunities to interact with the community.
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I'm interested to hear about (potentially) more changes to RF's snapshotting. We've already established that activating RF then replacing it with a completely unrelated set of skill and support gems (hell, even a Kaom's) WILL STILL WORK under the (currently) planned changes.
zSavage has also posted another similar question in another thread:
snip
My assumption based on the information in this thread is that this will also WORK. And I'm also assuming that the dev team DOESN'T want that to work, but it's a much more technically challenging case to tackle.
We don't (ideally) want Righteous Fire to be able to snapshot. We do want Righteous Fire to not be something you can "turn off" by just removing the gem - it's a fundamental part of the skill's design that you must either include elements in your build that allow you to manage it, or suffer the burning until your last life point.
These two goals are somewhat at odds, as the basic non-snapshotting version on Righteous Fire would be one that did turn off when you removed it's gem.
We're currently looking into some solutions like keeping the part where it burns yourself, but removing the enemy burning and/or spell damage, so you couldn't escape burning yourself, but do need to keep the gem socketed to get actual use out of it. At this point I can't say if that's the path we'll take or not, or even if anything will change from the article before 1.2.0. As I said, I'll do my best to keep you guys up to date.
The solutions that I can think of: Make the gem (and supports and item it is socketed in) unremovable while RF is active. In theory, it would be like the Palantir from LOTR, in that once you touch it, you are unable to let go, as such. Basically, it would be like the weapon/armour + gems burning themselves to your skin in such a way that they can't be removed until you find some way to turn it off. I think it's kinda colourful. I can almost smell the burning flesh.
Last edited by Xasrai on Jun 18, 2014, 2:41:29 AM
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Posted byXasraion Jun 18, 2014, 2:40:44 AM
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The impact of fixing snapshotting on existing player characters dictated that we wait for the period between leagues.
i'm just wondering on how many players got (and get) advantages from snapshotting and how many got advantages from this in the beginning of the league. you had no problem fixing the latter and put all players who could not really often play in the beginning of the league on a serious disadvantage.
but i see that fixing the snapshotting was far more complicated than changing an number in a table. good job :)
age and treachery will triumph over youth and skill!
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Posted byvioon Jun 18, 2014, 2:46:36 AMAlpha Member
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Thanks i appreciate your opinion, i did not know that only if you had an account made longer then 20 days ago your opinion is valid. You right lets for a moment imagine that only people who played in the beta could influence GGG's potential changes to the game. Where do you think we would be. I personally think your an idiot and need to grow up. Thats just my opinion of course but its okay. Its not valid because my account was made less then 20 days ago
If you have legitimately been playing this game for only 20 days, you shouldn't have enough of an opinion on the multitude of 'broken builds' to make your original statement. You wouldn't have begun to understand the intricacies of any single one of the builds in question, let alone all of them.
It is akin to a first-year law student turning around to the government and saying, "Thanks for fucking up the law, assholes' when inevitably the government passes some sort of changes that they don't like, but don't fully understand yet. So, either way, I think Klimentiy was right.
You are either trolling, or lying or both.
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Posted byXasraion Jun 18, 2014, 2:48:33 AM
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So basicly everything except RF (the skill that gets the biggest damage boon, with lowest time investrment) gets a fix... I hope I'm reading it wrong and just unsocketing the gems won't allow for snapshot to continue, or else it's kinda unfair.
You read it completely wrong.
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Posted byelitedesolatoron Jun 18, 2014, 2:49:10 AM
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Thanks, ruining multiple builds with 1 foul swoop, im impressed really. Lets allow something to persist for so long that people develop builds and start enjoying them. Then not be okay with it anymore and make everyone respec. Its great. Really you guys are awesome. Keep the awesome updates coming.
Joined:
May 29, 2014
troll or smurf? at least post from your real account to have a valid point.
Thanks i appreciate your opinion, i did not know that only if you had an account made longer then 20 days ago your opinion is valid. You right lets for a moment imagine that only people who played in the beta could influence GGG's potential changes to the game. Where do you think we would be. I personally think your an idiot and need to grow up. Thats just my opinion of course but its okay. Its not valid because my account was made less then 20 days ago
" Lets allow something to persist for so long that people develop builds and start enjoying them."
18 days... sooo long.... bet it will be really hard to try playing without snapshotting now. I understand you may have a point and can whine if you snapshotted for many months and countless hours and now have to learn to play without.... but you started playing may 29th... must be really tough to to respec your lvl 78 snapshotting marauder and learn a whole new play style.
This is Path of Nerfs. Get used to it.
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IGN: ___I_Fink_U_Freeky___
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Posted byKlimentiyon Jun 18, 2014, 2:52:07 AM
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