we need aspirational endgame in 3.28 otherwise game is doomed

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SoColdO_O#1989 wrote:

what was your build? i mean fortress punching bag immobilised by deli and without stacked def mods + only 1 orb is OK, otherwise...
I'm not omega bow enjoyer, played them twice in affliction and necro (and in necro insta speced into CWS xddd) so no negative/sarcasm, just interested

iceshot deadeye, had plans to swap to a TS build, but grave crafting and the rest of the league just didn’t keep me entertained enough to grind out more hours. But overall it was still a pretty fun build.

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Pashid#4643 wrote:

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sidtherat#1310 wrote:

if powercreep is so overarching:
fireball - go

Played fireball 2 leagues ago, and it was quite fun and easy.
It's easier than ever to pick up a random ability and mash together a solid build, all thanks to power creep. lol

OP isnt talking about killing Maven once for the completion and few stray T17s

OP is all about endgame juice - in current league BlightheartInvigoration is a perfect example

he demands that there are more juices like that 'otherwise game is doomed'


your fireball build might have killed maven or few T17s but if you think it had ANY chance with bligh-invi.. well, no. just no. same with omega rogues, same with risk scarabs of the past.

there are just few builds - nowadays mostly forms of int stacking (with str and mana stack mixed in) - that can attempt that. he just demands more content for these few outliers

when the correct course of action is to nuke them from orbit - suddenly there are lots of challenges everywhere and you cannot cheat by playing a build GGG forgot to nerf

"Stacker" builds were always aspirational because they keep scaling with investment and there's basically no limit in how much currency you can dump there.

Heist bases popular among any attribute stackers - this is usually far beyond mageblood cost already. You're speaking a mirror for amulet and 100 div for a good helical ring. And that's just the beginning of min-maxed stacker gear.

Stackers being strong at high investment isn't anything new or unexpected. These builds usually felt bad to play before having 200-300 div at least.

Keepers was an exceptional league for stackers. Int-accuracy juggs specifically. You could get that character online for way less currency than it usually takes to build a competent stacker.

-Fracturing orb was super cheap and crafting 12p clusters for stackers was much easier due to this
-T1 int fractures on top bases were printed out by tree all the time
-Foulborn HoTM is cheap
-Shaper touch and cyclo coil cheap too

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sidtherat#1310 wrote:

OP is all about endgame juice - in current league BlightheartInvigoration is a perfect example

And I do agree with OP as we could use some spicier endgame as the current endgame is just as bad as stale bread.

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he demands that there are more juices like that 'otherwise game is doomed'

OP is not entirely wrong, because endlessly making the game easier can backfire quickly.

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your fireball build might have killed maven or few T17s but if you think it had ANY chance with bligh-invi.. well, no. just no. same with omega rogues, same with risk scarabs of the past.

Nah, even a fireball build could do the named content without issues once you put enough currency into it, pretty much like every build.
Almost as if the system is working as intended. More powerful gear enables more juicy content, shocking concept, I know.

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when the correct course of action is to nuke them from orbit - suddenly there are lots of challenges everywhere and you cannot cheat by playing a build GGG forgot to nerf

Nah, they would have to nerf everything in order to get some results. They can nerf one archetype, and people will just move to the next popular pick, and people like you will continue to see the new popular archetype as the big issue and complain about it being OP and broken, some fomo, while in reality power creep is just out of control in every area of the game.
Not that it's a bad thing, because it actually allows you to play everything without massive punishments, which allows the large build variety we have since leagues.

BlightInvi on fireball? (no energyblade, no Potential, no mana stack, no rathpith aka cptlance build) lol, man, you have no clue - regular scaling is not strong enough, no matter how many mirrors you get, to reach what these few 'build templates' can reach

all this talk about 'enough currency' is sweet bs

few outliers can, the rest cannot. the rest is MUCH larger group, so outliers should be cut as it is easier to do and less risky

'Cleave is fine because with my int/acc HOTM build i can do everything' - do the same with POB warrior phys gear and then you might have a point. but everybody knows these two are in different realms

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sidtherat#1310 wrote:

'Cleave is fine because with my int/acc HOTM build i can do everything'

I'm sure cleave is going nuts on a claw. Thanks for the insightful recommendation Sid.
But nah, cleave is fine even with int stacker being in the game.

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do the same with POB warrior phys gear and then you might have a point. but everybody knows these two are in different realms

You don't get your hands on good phys gear? That's kinda unfortunate?

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sidtherat#1310 wrote:

there are just few builds - nowadays mostly forms of int stacking (with str and mana stack mixed in) - that can attempt that. he just demands more content for these few outliers

when the correct course of action is to nuke them from orbit - suddenly there are lots of challenges everywhere and you cannot cheat by playing a build GGG forgot to nerf

I (and a large number of players I suppose) do not want to play underperforming, bad skills which are simply long forgotten by GGG. I did not choose to play KBoC this league because of some streamer, I chose it bc it's fun and can be scaled. All the skills should be scalable as far as int/str/mana/life stackers can, also GGG can add even more ways of scaling skills.

"poe" 2 has extremely bad designed skills, and everything which corresponds "the vision" (1 million endgame dps should be hardly reachable, according to Jonathan) is basically unplayable and 1% of ppl play these in adequate endgame, whereas 99% play COC mana/lifestack or bow/xbow

game will become trash if you simply remove all the ways of giga scaling your builds, its gonna be d4/poo2 clone, not poe anymore.

BUFF underperforming stuff, ADD more ways of scaling, DO NOT TOUCH balanced abilities (TS was OK, hexblast was OK)

About fireball - I guess chieftain's 500% explode can be a nice wheelchair to get proper setup for vaal fireball and especially to clear screens of blue mobs. you just gonna need no to run avoid ignite

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Pashid#4643 wrote:

OP is not entirely wrong, because endlessly making the game easier can backfire quickly.

it already backfired, look at keepers/necropolis league retention. people get bored quick when there is no meaningful endgame because of stupid, unreasonable nerfing strats/builds to the ground.

the only builds that should be entirely deleted from the game are ones which grant 100% immoirtality, etc, like it was with gluttony of elements/old zerphi PF. builds which just perform well, cant do all the content effectively and have ups and downs should be SLIGHTLY nerfed, not like GGG did with TS and hexblast

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Pashid#4643 wrote:

OP is not entirely wrong, because endlessly making the game easier can backfire quickly.

it already backfired, look at keepers/necropolis league retention. people get bored quick when there is no meaningful endgame because of stupid, unreasonable nerfing strats/builds to the ground.

the only builds that should be entirely deleted from the game are ones which grant 100% immoirtality, etc, like it was with gluttony of elements/old zerphi PF/immortality aura merc from 3.26. builds which just perform well, cant do all the content effectively and have ups and downs should be SLIGHTLY nerfed, not like GGG did with TS and hexblast

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SoColdO_O#1989 wrote:

it already backfired, look at keepers/necropolis league retention. people get bored quick when there is no meaningful endgame because of stupid, unreasonable nerfing strats/builds to the ground.

Yep, pretty much this.