[3.21] Vatinas' Spiders + HoP Guardian - CI, 70K armour, 1400 ES on block, millions of DPS

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ibaass wrote:
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ibaass wrote:
Ellarizz's build using impale? don’t get why he is using faster attack support gem? For sure a better option?


Yes he uses impale.

He uses faster attacks because he was able to buy on one of the few double corrupted armors this league and it had two green sockets.

If you don't have socket colors worries, replace faster attacks with Multistrike.


But What colors are best then? 4R/1G/1B? Or 3R/2B/1G?


If you want to use impale, and have no color restrictions, I would recommend using 3r/2b/1g

HOP - Empower - Multistrike - Predator - Minion Damage - Impale

As always though, please feel free to experiment and the share back with the thread on what you find. With the massive nerfs this league, we are all learning and trying to figure out what works best.
Last edited by AndyLovesHisBge on Aug 29, 2021, 1:25:42 PM
I don't feel like I am getting much out of my flasks.

Has anyone experimented with using a Bottled Faith to squeeze out a little more DPS from our minions?
Hi!

First of all I would like to thank you for this build. It's amazing. However I have one question that I can't seem to figure out.

You reserve 98% of your mana and I don't see where I went the wrong way with that since I only reserve 97%. We have the same rings for the mana reservation, etc. I see however that your discipline reserves 29.4% and mine only reserves 18.9%. We both use the same setup for the gem (anomalous one).

Is it possible to look into this so that I may find the problem with my reservation of mana?

This is my pob link if you would need it tho.
https://pastebin.com/yWQs8LAp

Thanks in advance.
One huge advantage of faster attacks vs multi strike is the mana multiplier as well though, certainly makes it easier to use the +1 sentinel enchant vs the RMR enchant.
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SirArganar wrote:
Hi!

First of all I would like to thank you for this build. It's amazing. However I have one question that I can't seem to figure out.

You reserve 98% of your mana and I don't see where I went the wrong way with that since I only reserve 97%. We have the same rings for the mana reservation, etc. I see however that your discipline reserves 29.4% and mine only reserves 18.9%. We both use the same setup for the gem (anomalous one).

Is it possible to look into this so that I may find the problem with my reservation of mana?

This is my pob link if you would need it tho.
https://pastebin.com/yWQs8LAp

Thanks in advance.


hello!

I am unsure which POB you are asking us to compare to. If you are trying to compare to the original POB in the first post, you should note that the original build is out of date now as it does not factor in the latest changes to the mana reserve that happened early in this league.

For example, you no longer need the cluster that has Uncompromising and Self Control. You can remove that entirely from your build and replace it with a second cluster that has Cult Leaders and Disciples (you will end up with two of these total in your build and they stack).

Here is an updated POB that can give you some ideas:
https://pastebin.com/ah5GPw4z


Please give this a look at and then ask any questions you might have and I will try and help you.
Last edited by AndyLovesHisBge on Aug 29, 2021, 4:53:16 PM
Hello,

Big thanks to Vatinas for the build and Ellarizz for their version and ideas.
So far this build has been very reliable in my ventures into the Heist league mechanic. I've been looking around and trying different ideas that you guys put out.


Here's something I'm experimenting with right now



Game decided to roll me reduced reservation on HoP in a lab run so I rolled with it.
With the extra Mana I decided to reserve Pride

It gave me a much needed boost in DPS while pushing me to 95% reservation, with a bit of tweaking with my rings I'm sure I could push that further.

I guess this could be an alternative to having +1 sentinels if that enchant is too expensive.

Any input from you guys as to why this may be a good or bad idea?

Here's my POB :)
https://pastebin.com/Ze9VXmEz

Thanks again to Vatinas for the build!
Last edited by Balogna on Aug 30, 2021, 2:30:14 PM
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Balogna wrote:
Hello,

Big thanks to Vatinas for the build and Ellarizz for their version and ideas.
So far this build has been very reliable in my ventures into the Heist league mechanic. I've been looking around and trying different ideas that you guys put out.


Here's something I'm experimenting with right now



Game decided to roll me reduced reservation on HoP in a lab run so I rolled with it.
With the extra Mana I decided to reserve Pride

It gave me a much needed boost in DPS while pushing me to 95% reservation, with a bit of tweaking with my rings I'm sure I could push that further.

I guess this could be an alternative to having +1 sentinels if that enchant is too expensive.

Any input from you guys as to why this may be a good or bad idea?

Here's my POB :)
https://pastebin.com/Ze9VXmEz

Thanks again to Vatinas for the build!


Hello and thank you for sharing your version of the build! It was very interesting to study.

Your version looks pretty good. Well done making it work for you based on what the game gives you!!

Here are some comments for you to consider:

*You are correct in that you can very easily fix your mana by changing out one of your rings. You can do this 2 ways (the second way is better all around but more expensive than the first)

1) Change one of your rings for one that has 3% less reservation (the 20% to a 17% would work nicely).

2) Swap the 18% ring for a second 20% reserved ring. You can then drop Self Control from your cluster and use that tree point to allocate Cult Leader. You win all around on this change. More DPS, more armor and more ES. :)

*Is there a reason you are using 3 writhing jars? I have been playing the whole league with just 1. I could see maybe needing 2 for the extra long phased boss fights that don't have any adds, but 3 as your regular load out seems a bit overkill to me, but there may be a good reason for it.

*Your DPS is a little lower than you would like but you have lots of room for improvement. The most important item for DPS is the level of your HOP gem. You have the ability to raise it 8 more levels in a perfect world.

From easiest/cheapest to hardest/most expensive, do the following to raise your HOP gem's level.

1) Get a level 21 HOP (a level 21 regular is MUCH better than a level 20 divergent)
2) Upgrade your Empower 3 to an Empower 4
3) Get a corrupted armor with +2 to Duration or +1 to all gems
4) Get an amulet that has lots of dex and +1 to strength gems and +1 to physical gems
5) Get a double corrupted armor with both corruptions listed in #3

if you manage to do just the first 3 (which is manageable with a grind), you will add about 1.5M dps to your build (about a 50% increase). If you some how manage to do all 5 (not realistic but a couple have done it), you could easily double your damage. I have done the first 4 so far and am working towards #5 but I don't know if I will get there.


* You are leaving some damage on the table with how you have allocated your cluster jewels but I realize you may be doing this to better your defenses. Your defenses look solid so any levels ore extra tree points you free up should go into your cluster jewels.




Last edited by AndyLovesHisBge on Aug 30, 2021, 4:00:17 PM
Hey Andy i've been following your last POB, and i'm wondering why are u allocating ravenous horde instead of charisma, is it because your amulet gives you reserve reduction for determination? or is it that it's just better, i don't want to waste 90c in 2 golden oils if i'm not using it. xD
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lacalaca wrote:
Hey Andy i've been following your last POB, and i'm wondering why are u allocating ravenous horde instead of charisma, is it because your amulet gives you reserve reduction for determination? or is it that it's just better, i don't want to waste 90c in 2 golden oils if i'm not using it. xD


hello!!

yes, your guess is correct. Because the amulet lowered the reservation of Determination, I no longer needed Charisma.

So I chose what I think was the strongest minion damage node left that I wasn't planning to take on the tree myself in Ravenous Horde.
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Hello and thank you for sharing your version of the build! It was very interesting to study.

Your version looks pretty good. Well done making it work for you based on what the game gives you!!

Here are some comments for you to consider:

*You are correct in that you can very easily fix your mana by changing out one of your rings. You can do this 2 ways (the second way is better all around but more expensive than the first)

1) Change one of your rings for one that has 3% less reservation (the 20% to a 17% would work nicely).

2) Swap the 18% ring for a second 20% reserved ring. You can then drop Self Control from your cluster and use that tree point to allocate Cult Leader. You win all around on this change. More DPS, more armor and more ES. :)

*Is there a reason you are using 3 writhing jars? I have been playing the whole league with just 1. I could see maybe needing 2 for the extra long phased boss fights that don't have any adds, but 3 as your regular load out seems a bit overkill to me, but there may be a good reason for it.

*Your DPS is a little lower than you would like but you have lots of room for improvement. The most important item for DPS is the level of your HOP gem. You have the ability to raise it 8 more levels in a perfect world.

From easiest/cheapest to hardest/most expensive, do the following to raise your HOP gem's level.

1) Get a level 21 HOP (a level 21 regular is MUCH better than a level 20 divergent)
2) Upgrade your Empower 3 to an Empower 4
3) Get a corrupted armor with +2 to Duration or +1 to all gems
4) Get an amulet that has lots of dex and +1 to strength gems and +1 to physical gems
5) Get a double corrupted armor with both corruptions listed in #3

if you manage to do just the first 3 (which is manageable with a grind), you will add about 1.5M dps to your build (about a 50% increase). If you some how manage to do all 5 (not realistic but a couple have done it), you could easily double your damage. I have done the first 4 so far and am working towards #5 but I don't know if I will get there.


* You are leaving some damage on the table with how you have allocated your cluster jewels but I realize you may be doing this to better your defenses. Your defenses look solid so any levels ore extra tree points you free up should go into your cluster jewels.



Thanks for the input! I was feeling a bit lost in terms of progression, now I have a goal to work towards. Number 1 and 2 are complete and slowly working towards 3.

Yes you are correct on the defenses, I reset for 5 ways to save an exalt or two. Also, I'm starting to realize that dying costs money in the later levels.

The Cult Leader node is allocated. I made a small mistake in making my POB, my bad.

As for the 3 flasks, I initially started the build with them to get used to the spawning mechanic, and I guess I just got comfortable with them. Time to take off the training wheels :)

Again thanks for the input and goodluck to your builds!

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