Exp loss on death topics are getting out of hand.

People complain about xp loss 24/7 because it is a shit mechanic no one enjoys. If no one enjoys it, remove it. It is a detriment to the game, only the top 0.1% who pretend that anyone cares for their "leveling speed balance" defend it. No real arpg fan enjoys it.

All xp loss does it punish players for doing what a rpg wants, experiment and grow a character. XP Loss is a huge reason people follow guides because anything else could lead to a build that has troubles in end game and fixing it requires tons of xp loss, how enjoyable that must be. To some people a single death could elimiate the progress of an entire day worth of their playtime, the game will bleed players like crazy once the casual playerbase reaches endgame.

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Echothesis#7320 wrote:

I remember one of GGG leads on some interview said that exp penalty is still needed in poe2 because they don't want players winning the race events by bruteforcing glasscannon dps:)

Fine, keep your penalty in race events, but I have yet to hear how GGG employee explains why penalty has more pros than cons in generic softcore.

Based on the known facts so far, the only reason penalty is omnipresent is to stroke egos of top 1% of players who are willing to both research and grind for unkillable borderline exploit gimmicks. Visual clarity and mob dps spikes are only slightly better than poe1, average deathtime in poe2 is still very low.

Make some badges and hideout totems for those who really cares about how often they die, and leave the rest of players in peace.

This shows how out of touch GGG are in terms of making a game, no one gives a shit about the people racing to 100. It's not seen as an achievement, people genuinely could not care less because they hate trading and interacting with others. ARPG's are primarily single player games.
People should be able to either:
Toggle death penalties for extra rewards (so racing means toggling should be optimal + drop rate bonuses)
or
Toggle some kind of race to 100 legitimate character enabling these.

Punishing softcore casual players and forcefully making them participate in this nonsense is asinine. Barely anyone cares and if given the choice would opt out immediately as it makes the game objectively more fun.

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Echothesis#7320 wrote:

I remember one of GGG leads on some interview said that exp penalty is still needed in poe2 because they don't want players winning the race events by bruteforcing glasscannon dps:)

Fine, keep your penalty in race events, but I have yet to hear how GGG employee explains why penalty has more pros than cons in generic softcore.

Based on the known facts so far, the only reason penalty is omnipresent is to stroke egos of top 1% of players who are willing to both research and grind for unkillable borderline exploit gimmicks. Visual clarity and mob dps spikes are only slightly better than poe1, average deathtime in poe2 is still very low.

Make some badges and hideout totems for those who really cares about how often they die, and leave the rest of players in peace.

Exactly, move all these special death penalties to official races and events and keep them out of softcore. The average player doesn't care about ladders lol

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AintCare#6513 wrote:

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Akedomo#3573 wrote:

Yes it is feedback. Stop arguing with your emotions. Use your brain.

You might like the mechanic. Most people don't. That doesn't mean that your viewpoint on it is correct.

We can have both! The option to turn it on or off.

insulting me and telling me to stop arguing with my emotions in one line. 10/10

the mechanic is suppose to be disliked- that its purpose. and fact you don't like it it means its working, problem is that it suppose to teach you to avoid death. and fro some reason its failing at that

Ah yes, I need a mechanic to know death is bad. Because losing portal, loot and having common sense is not enough. 10/10 game design.

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AintCare#6513 wrote:

the mechanic is suppose to be disliked- that its purpose. and fact you don't like it it means its working, problem is that it suppose to teach you to avoid death. and fro some reason its failing at that

Am I missing something? Where's your argument? Your bring nothing to conversation.

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AintCare#6513 wrote:

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Akedomo#3573 wrote:

Yes it is feedback. Stop arguing with your emotions. Use your brain.

You might like the mechanic. Most people don't. That doesn't mean that your viewpoint on it is correct.

We can have both! The option to turn it on or off.

insulting me and telling me to stop arguing with my emotions in one line. 10/10

the mechanic is suppose to be disliked- that its purpose. and fact you don't like it it means its working, problem is that it suppose to teach you to avoid death. and fro some reason its failing at that

A mechanic existing to make players hate it is the most horrible idea I've ever heard. No, that's just gonna make the players hate the game lol

Sorry but everyone hates the death penalty, and the game would instantly be objectively better and more fun if there was just a checkmark in the settings to turn it off. And 99.9% of people would turn it off, by the way.

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AintCare#6513 wrote:

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Toforto#2372 wrote:

The average player doesn't care about ladders lol

but average player need to hit lvl100 with minimal effort? interesting

The time it takes to farm the exp, already excludes the vast majority of players. And that's without slapping the cancerous exp-loss on top.

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AintCare#6513 wrote:

that's because you removed the post i replied to lol

I didn't know I am moderator now.

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BK2710#6123 wrote:

People complain about xp loss 24/7 because it is a shit mechanic no one enjoys. If no one enjoys it, remove it. It is a detriment to the game, only the top 0.1% who pretend that anyone cares for their "leveling speed balance" defend it. No real arpg fan enjoys it.

All xp loss does it punish players for doing what a rpg wants, experiment and grow a character. XP Loss is a huge reason people follow guides because anything else could lead to a build that has troubles in end game and fixing it requires tons of xp loss, how enjoyable that must be. To some people a single death could elimiate the progress of an entire day worth of their playtime, the game will bleed players like crazy once the casual playerbase reaches endgame.

thats really not true at all. xp loss is no punish for growing, its the opposit. it tells people that their build isnt good enough and makes reaching high levels mean something other then dying constantly through the maps. and stop talking about casuals. the moment xp loss starts hurting is 93+. if somebody reaches lvl 93 in 2,5 weeks, its far from being a casual. on top of that, not a single content is gates behind reaching lvl 95 or 100. the game isnt better with lvl 100 and its not worse with lvl 90. there is nothing behind it.

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AintCare#6513 wrote:

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Akedomo#3573 wrote:

Yes it is feedback. Stop arguing with your emotions. Use your brain.

You might like the mechanic. Most people don't. That doesn't mean that your viewpoint on it is correct.

We can have both! The option to turn it on or off.

insulting me and telling me to stop arguing with my emotions in one line. 10/10

the mechanic is suppose to be disliked- that its purpose. and fact you don't like it it means its working, problem is that it suppose to teach you to avoid death. and fro some reason its failing at that

Your argument is extremely poor, if something in a game is meant to invoke feelings of frustration you are a terrible game designer. Penalties need workarounds and safeguards to make the player experience good.
More than 1 life before penalties tick in so you can learn what even kills you, death recaps so you can actually learn what happens since getting cc'd by random unseeable attack in the clutter into death really makes you want to avoid dying huh.

It's not failing, people want to win at a game so they avoid dying because that is the natural thing to do, it requires no mechanic. Just losing waystones would be more than enough punishment since those require a lot of investment to be really strong. Map mechanics loss is probably already too much.

You should always design a game so the challenges are enticing. Currently you get fucked in the ass by failing and get spit in the face by winning. All death penalties ought to be optional for great extra rewards.
It rewards confidence in your build making skills/character, gives the player good feelings for beating the challenge and satisfaction with extra rewards. That's what the "git gud" people want anyway.
No reason to force those who do not want into it, it has no effect on you who wants to either. It's a simple fix, requires barely any time.

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AintCare#6513 wrote:

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Akedomo#3573 wrote:

Yes it is feedback. Stop arguing with your emotions. Use your brain.

You might like the mechanic. Most people don't. That doesn't mean that your viewpoint on it is correct.

We can have both! The option to turn it on or off.

insulting me and telling me to stop arguing with my emotions in one line. 10/10

the mechanic is suppose to be disliked- that its purpose. and fact you don't like it it means its working, problem is that it suppose to teach you to avoid death. and fro some reason its failing at that

I never insulted you. I pointed out your hypocrisy. Telling others to leave because they're giving criticisms that you don't like is hypocrisy 101. Especially when this game is Early Access, and that is the entire point of it.

If you took that as an insult, Then my point is even more valid. You're thinking emotionally.

There's a dozen ways they could make deaths more punishing, without straight up removing XP.