Economy is Bad

The funniest part of the debacle is that players are punished severely for engaging with the crafting system since the trading is based on the most important crafting orb (exalts) for low level players.

So if you attempt to craft you are gutting your trading power and if you trade you are gutting your crafting power.

Since crafting is random, trading will always be the better choice, entirely invalidating crafting at lower levels.

"

fouquet#0993 wrote:

So if you attempt to craft you are gutting your trading power and if you trade you are gutting your crafting power.

Since crafting is random, trading will always be the better choice, entirely invalidating crafting at lower levels.

it's always a difficult decision and one that changes with experience in poe.
and there is not much currency to find in lower levels to trade with.

"

vio#1992 wrote:

"

fouquet#0993 wrote:

So if you attempt to craft you are gutting your trading power and if you trade you are gutting your crafting power.

Since crafting is random, trading will always be the better choice, entirely invalidating crafting at lower levels.

it's always a difficult decision and one that changes with experience in poe.
and there is not much currency to find in lower levels to trade with.

It's not a difficult decision at all nor does it require experience. It goes like this:

Try to "craft" a good item by slamming exalts, brick and vendor. Repeat several times until you check trade website and realize better items exist for less currency than what you just wasted. Realize that the best choice is to save up all your exalts and other currencies, trade em in for divs and buy all your gear. That's it. There is no choice in this, no player agency. Nothing.

At least PoE 1 has a deep enough crafting system where you can actually make yourself decent gear even if you just understand the fundamentals. I'm not talking about making mirror-tier weapons. Most players with a few thousand hours and experience know that they can make a decent item if they start off with a fractured base for example. I've memorized the crafting steps to make a good +2 amulet for any elemental/chaos build and then I can even use a Veiled orb on it for a guaranteed veiled suffix. That's the beauty of a real crafting system, players have actual choices and at the same time they can just go to the trade site and buy the finished,already crafted items at a high price.

The "crafting system" in PoE 2 is a total joke compared to what we have in PoE 1. Here you're just pulling that slot machine lever every time you transmute,augment or exalt an item. That's it. Essences and Omens are a total meme. So are vaal orbs.

"

Akedomo#3573 wrote:

This game being based around the 'economy' is half the reason players quit.

Forced crafting and trading to progress. And new players, and even old players are sick of it. It's a dated system that promotes forced interactions, and it's being done this way as a bandaid solution. Compared to fixing the loot in this game.

Got to be honest. You should be excited when you kill a boss and a bunch of items drop. But that rarely happens, and you're stuck picking up blues and whites so that you can craft. Entirely killing the vibe for almost any new player.

Blame Bots all you want, but the reality is. This game just needs a different loot system, and no economy. Searching items on a website and then clicking a button to whisper them, because you can't find your own items while playing. Is just an awful experience. They artificially cranked up the difficulty in PoE 1 so that it forced more

Really unsure as to why tons of PoE 1 players don't recognize this issue, and instead continue asking for the 'economy' to be fixed. This system did not bring good value to the old game, and in part, is a large reason why the game got so bloated and convoluted, and unable to retain lots of new players. This is the reason people hit 70-80 and quit.

We don't need it in PoE 2. Ask for a better solution.

This. All of this.

O yea?

Need some boots and resists to not get oneshot?

FIFTY EX!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Enjoy your game

"

Alphavegeta#3655 wrote:

"

ManifestFX#7624 wrote:

So magically more and more streamers are speaking on this issue. How will GGG handle this is the question because at this moment PoE 2 economy is mirroring a 10+ year old games economy.

It's not easy to fix. If they increase the rate of dropping divines it will flood the market with more and send prices even higher. If they make it totally in game to trade that won't fix anything either as traders will still just buy everything up immediately even faster than before and reprice it. And it's not like they can just make trading not take place as a lot of people would quit plus they already have SSF mode.

IMO time is the only thing that will fix this and that's ONLY if most players don't quit. How will this help things? My guess is that more items that are being priced in divines will start getting found by players and they will begin undercutting each other to drive prices down. As a player who hasn't found a single divine yet, I would much rather undercut 500 unique belts like Ryslatha's Coil at 5 div cost by pricing it to 4 div and take the currency than use the item myself. There is no way in hell a level 31 unique belt should cost 5 divines. I would wager less than 1% of players found a single divine by level 31, let alone 5 of them.

If they increase crafting material drop rates significantly prices will only go up for the best of the best items. Prices will come down for everything else because demand will go down, due to the fact that people will actually be able to craft/find better gear on their own without relying so heavily on trading.

Seriously, they need to drop this trading business all together. Most people play this game single player, so we don't need fake MMO mechanics in order to create an endgame impression. Make drops better and crafting cooler and there you go.

In PoE1, rarity doesn't effect or stack with mechanics. Running mechanics was the way to make currency for low-rarity builds. It worked, because the rarity people would find the stuff like Headhunters, etc, on juiced maps without mechanics, then buy necessary things from people who ran mechanics.


They didn't port over what worked from PoE1. Rarity works with mechanics, including the rares in breach (which is the only worthwhile thing to farm, because everything else is just badly implemented and has poor rewards).

All players are now in direct competition with rarity farmers. If your first build wasn't a CI build that can fit a tonne of rarity in, and if you weren't doing that in the first few weeks, you are now pretty much screwed until a reset, or when they nerf CI so they can't easily get 5x the rarity of everyone else.

"

Akedomo#3573 wrote:

This game being based around the 'economy' is half the reason players quit.

Forced crafting and trading to progress. And new players, and even old players are sick of it. It's a dated system that promotes forced interactions, and it's being done this way as a bandaid solution. Compared to fixing the loot in this game.

Got to be honest. You should be excited when you kill a boss and a bunch of items drop. But that rarely happens, and you're stuck picking up blues and whites so that you can craft. Entirely killing the vibe for almost any new player.

Blame Bots all you want, but the reality is. This game just needs a different loot system, and no economy. Searching items on a website and then clicking a button to whisper them, because you can't find your own items while playing. Is just an awful experience. They artificially cranked up the difficulty in PoE 1 so that it forced more

Really unsure as to why tons of PoE 1 players don't recognize this issue, and instead continue asking for the 'economy' to be fixed. This system did not bring good value to the old game, and in part, is a large reason why the game got so bloated and convoluted, and unable to retain lots of new players. This is the reason people hit 70-80 and quit.

We don't need it in PoE 2. Ask for a better solution.

+1

I mentioned this in another thread and people tried to argue, but the "economy" is a huge reason players leave. If someone downloads the game after hearing about a new league, likes it, and somehow manages to overcome the barrier of having to log into a separate website for trading... once they see the prices many will uninstall. You have to remember that for many of them, its their first character, so it will take them longer to reach endgame than most folks. Once they get there, the economy has already left them behind. People tried to argue that the economy gets better mid/late league, but do you think a new player knows that or is going to stick around that long? Because I don't. I literally could never get into POE1 for this reason, among others (which GGG has tried to address with POE2). I know these players exists because I am one.

The best way to find items for your character should be by playing the game with said character. I told this story a few times before, but after leveling a couple of characters to 90+, I tried to level a warrior and hit level 5, which is basically just the first 4 zones of act 1. I looked at my character's items and noticed that not one single warrior item had droppped. All of my armor was ES or evasion based and I was stil using the starter mace because only quarterstaves had dropped and I didn't have the dexterity to use them without a respec. I went to town to gamble for some starter items and it sort of dawned on me... "what am I doing?"... and I just logged off. I could see the same patterns that I had experienced on my other 2 characters repeating... where nothing useful dropped. And keep in mind, this is a brand new character. I haven't touched the game since. Not being able to find items for your character while playing is a huge issue and a loot overhaul is needed.

"

Akedomo#3573 wrote:

This game being based around the 'economy' is half the reason players quit.

Forced crafting and trading to progress. And new players, and even old players are sick of it. It's a dated system that promotes forced interactions, and it's being done this way as a bandaid solution. Compared to fixing the loot in this game.

Got to be honest. You should be excited when you kill a boss and a bunch of items drop. But that rarely happens, and you're stuck picking up blues and whites so that you can craft. Entirely killing the vibe for almost any new player.

Blame Bots all you want, but the reality is. This game just needs a different loot system, and no economy. Searching items on a website and then clicking a button to whisper them, because you can't find your own items while playing. Is just an awful experience. They artificially cranked up the difficulty in PoE 1 so that it forced more

Really unsure as to why tons of PoE 1 players don't recognize this issue, and instead continue asking for the 'economy' to be fixed. This system did not bring good value to the old game, and in part, is a large reason why the game got so bloated and convoluted, and unable to retain lots of new players. This is the reason people hit 70-80 and quit.

We don't need it in PoE 2. Ask for a better solution.

I’m a little late to the party but this is a perfectly written post. Killing a boss only to see the same old currency + white / blue items is absolutely abysmal. It sucked in PoE 1 and it sucks much harder now.

PoE 2 is a perfect opportunity for them to have actual loot implemented, but we get the same old lazy shit that made the first game niche.

Admittedly, I’m a dad. I have a life. I cannot play video games 30, 40, 50 hours a week. By the time I reach endgame the prices are already insane and crafting blows. It’s a bad combination, and I get the feeling a lot of players run into the same issue and quit. I love PoE, but now more than ever it seems that it’s solely for no-lifers and RMTers. It’s unfortunate that they didn’t choose a different path. Hopefully it’s not too late.