Development Manifesto: Harvest Crafting

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sirgog wrote:

Increasing player retention means "people are having more fun therefore not quitting the game".

That should be the primary goal. If retention is bad, changes need to be made to make the game more fun. And if Google Trends are anything to go off, retention was terrible in Harvest, and not up to 3.9 level in 3.13.

But Delirium - with a brutally challenging mechanic and no Discord powered item editor - was the unquestioned most popular league of 2020 by Google Trends staying power.


This is completely wrong and misleading. The player retention for the core playerbase that sticks around for the whole league, according to GGG's own statements, can be estimated around 80k concurrent players. It holds true for any league from the last 2 years, including Harvest.

The only difference with Harvest is that it lost casual players faster, in fact most of casuals stopped playing before GGG even buffed rare seed spawn rate a couple of weeks into the league. It is absurd to think that casual players left because they got their perfect items too fast, they left because the league mechanic was complicated and underwhelming for players who never dabbled with crafting before.

The only league that broke these numbers is actually Ritual, with Harvest available for all players in a uncomplicated form.
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sirgog wrote:
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Biszek wrote:
Based on what statistics you made these changes?

I believe you literaly made at least few % players to quit because of that.

I kinda don't understand on what basis your game balance person does these changes.

Like back in the day in 2016 i LOVED Righteous Ride on Chieftain as Pure HP build, which you literally killed 2 leagues later(because of chieftain ascendancy change to force physical to fire because 10% STR was hidden behind it and then nerf to RF to deal 20% of HP)

I kinda do not like changes to builds that I create/think of, as I was using cyclone to curse on hit flammability on it, I decided to stick with cyclone for my 'next' build..

..which you nerfed hard 2 leagues after with your awesome 'boosting 2handed weapons' patch where Ngahamu Axe got nerfed really hard (molten burst is also procing a lot less compared to before) with lowering its physical damage by 30% or so.

I am casual player, I like to stick with one build that I like (feel free to check my characters)

Harvest was one of 'in game events' that gave me option to craft stuff (in which i was unlucky and wasnt albe to btw and not that I am very good at crafting) with less RNG that makes me want to quit playing this game.

Well here goes GGG with nerfing harvest where i can't even 'roll physical' on items..

Well I guess i'll just skip Harvest as there's nothing to do in there, back to old alternation spam with regal + multicraft

Whats gonna be next?


The obvious statistic is Google Trends interest in POE, which collapsed super fast during Harvest as people got bored of the league quicker than usual.

Then it hasn't held up as well in 3.13 as it did in 3.9, despite (at least in my opinion) 3.13 being a superior expansion save the issues of Harvest being so dominant.

Turns out, when characters get too powerful relative to the content, the game gets less fun.


3.9 had cluster jewels, that was game defining, and along with the loot explosions, that I'd why delerium was popular. Harvest wasn't popular as the garden side of harvest was terrible.

Google stars show 3.13 is doing extremely well for retention, one of the best ever.
As only mods read these posts I hope my expression wont be deleted again.

I am playing approx. 2 to 3 hours a day since league start. I am yet to have an excessive amount of add remove craft options in my few harvest encounters.

Not sure how many players were able to just go off and craft perfect items via this option but I am a 100% sure its a small minority that wont be affected but the players like me will definitely be affected as my hopes to make such items is gone. I never make enough currency to be able to buy items like this but I hoped to maybe craft one or two.

Well it seems the medium minority are not allowed to have fun.
Thank you GGG for adressing the long term concerns for the game instead of the short term gratisfaction players are only focused on.

Time to buy another supporter pack.
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Sylie wrote:
Just make the crafts tradeable (Like Beasts)

Actually very good idéa. I like it.
[Removed by Support], I never interact with harvest cuz it makes me stop playing the game with the stupid limit of 10 so I have to walk around and check all my itens to see if I got any crafts that are worth to use in the middle of the map, now it is even less worth to do, also all the changes just made going into discord a lot more important, sorry ggg but this changes are all bad besides grove being a fragment gz on that
Last edited by Lisa_GGG on Mar 11, 2021, 7:21:43 AM
Well,i dont think i will play next league.This game takes too much time to min-maxing gear without harvest.
Yikes... When all they need to do was to remove certain mods from harvest crafting pool but they decided to gut it completely, favouring those that can spend a lot of time nolifing the game (for currency) and/or enjoy (not really but close to) gambling.

Was kinda planning on buying either the harvest supporter pack or the atlas one 2 weeks ago but good thing i settled with delve and read up on the forums only to find harvest got ninja nerfed and now being gutted.

With this Decision nothing has changed apart from that now only people who play an extraordinary amount will have frequent access to those crafts. even if a lot of mirror-tier items were produced normal people still cant afford them and if you want to take those people as your standard then you can just raise every boss health to 500Mio and make it that normal people wont even get to maps. Harvest as it is in 3.13 is perfect. It is still very hard to get good items especially on SSF. I think this is a very poor decision. Not looking forward to 3.14 after this awesome 3.13 league.
Just watch Path of Matth's video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pdpA_xHXhEA

You guys need to widen your perspective.

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