Development Manifesto: Harvest Crafting

What should be done?
Crafting should not require a PhD!!!

Chris is crying his f*ing eyes out that people are trying to, and demanding, a market and yet he makes it pretty much f*ing impossible for typical players to do anything with the f*ed up labyrinthine crafting system.

Compounded with the asinine non-recoverable death penalty the crafting system is what makes he quit the game after about 2 weeks into a given league. Because I either have to waste hours trying to find a non-rigged sale on an item or cannot progress because I simply cannot craft it.

Bwahahahahaha (The irony is just wonderful)

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Niteglys wrote:

I wonder what other crafting features they'll add.

PS: In case it's not obvious, I agree with this question. And the very likely answer that we all know is: "none"!

So question: After Ritual league is over will there be a way to easily acquire synthesis items? I can accept the harvest nerfs and buffs, but i do think the community is really wanting the return of a way to acquire more synthesis item bases.

The current ways are only through heist, synthesis maps and ritual. Can we add more areas for these items to drop? Can we have a chest affix that can roll synthesis items or delve nodes? Maybe map mods or have an atlas passive that helps drop them? or maybe tied to watchstones?

Also for harvest, is there a way to add something similar to the beast orbs for harvest to make trading crafts easier? maybe add a cost of 5-10c or even divine orbs as a cost to purchase the orbs from a vendor.

Thanks and goodbye, GGG.

Thank you!

"

BlaqWolf wrote:

What should be done?
Crafting should not require a PhD!!!

Chris is crying his f*ing eyes out that people are trying to, and demanding, a market and yet he makes it pretty much f*ing impossible for typical players to do anything with the f*ed up labyrinthine crafting system.

Compounded with the asinine non-recoverable death penalty the crafting system is what makes he quit the game after about 2 weeks into a given league. Because I either have to waste hours trying to find a non-rigged sale on an item or cannot progress because I simply cannot craft it.

The changes that are now implemented in 3.13 don't make most players try to craft using harvest. They take the crafts and sell them on discord or some trade channels. This makes PoE players to need another external(to the game) thing/tool. Taking away the option to remove targeted mods won't make new or casual players try to craft more, it will make them stop crafing at all. There will still be near-perfect items, those that are made by a smaller number of players.
If you want all players to experiment with harvest give us a bigger number of crafts and make the items soulbound once you used harvest crafting.

What GGG does is make it even harder to craft top items for normal casual players, not for the top ones. The casual players will need to farm more and more to pay the top players for items. And they need those items to be able to have an end-game build. Every league they nerf things more and more, making the game require better and better gear. Now they want people to farm/play even more to get to those items. They will make many many players stop playing the game.

League after league you make the game more "grindy", it reached a level where, if you want to achieve something ingame you need to play it as a job, and this trend continues. You nerf builds for top players, while the others are left with mostly broken builds. Good job GGG, but i am the last of my friends playing PoE now. Most of them stopped, others don't want to start playing a game that require that much time per day. It is my last league also. Great game, made into a grind fest.

Exalted orbs are so rare for normal/casual players and you expect those players to use them and try things? The ones that do this lose. The only thing that GGG does is to make the game require more and more time to normal, casual players. They want to see the game on top in steam charts non-stop, but that will drive away players that don't see PoE as a job. Bye.

+1

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surio wrote:

+1001 to this.

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Miraille wrote:

Mods, you're still reading this, we know you are. We watch you handle your jobs, so here's a request from us players. Make Chris sit down and read this. Every page of it. Make him do it. Don't ask him, don't plead with him. TELL him to sit down and read. Let him see what the base really wants.

I want well for this game. I have since it began. However, casino gambling is not crafting by any definition. Yes, you are making items, but by rerolling them randomly, augmenting them randomly, etc. It's literally all one big casino gamble.

Harvest fixed that for me. Harvest removed the one detail from the game that plagued me most. So I'll chill around here and see how this plays out, my only hope being that somebody actually does tell Chris to sit down and read this feedback.

the problem is the real lack of how much those perfect crafted items really cost, cause you aren't looking at the value expense going on in TFT.

What I mean is you say you want the thrill of hitting an EX and making a great item or bricking the item.

Ok well i dumped 10ex in add/remove fire one night to get the 1 fing fire roll i needed. However that all looked like I traded 10 ex for nothing.

What needs to happen is make the crafts work like beast orbs. Then balance their drop rates accordingly. Also just make it so after level add the reforge ones have the lucky mod all the time or trash them. I see those and just go next plant area.

So by having them as orbs, we can trade the orbs, you guys can see the real cost of those items. It's not like they are cheap or simple to make if so these "GG" tier items would trade for a few EX not where the base alone for the item is 10ex. Because you still have to dump 5-10 ex into rolling the base items to make the ungodly. It's just that once you hit that base item, via fossil crafting, essense, fracture gambling, etc. Then i can make the huge big item, but even then i am spending 10-30ex for the crafts.

It's not that EX orbs have no meaning now, or that essence costs has changed. Everything currency wise in the game is the same as it was without harvest. The only difference is we can make items that are strong yes. I guess the issue is the streamers are mad they aren't the only ones with uber gear? Cause the rest of us can't spend our whole life in game.

With it being an orb i can still have that thrill of ok here is the add fire i paid 2ex for, hope it hits, bam, yes yes finally. Or crap....

The problem with POE crafting is that in it's undetermilistic form you have to know a billion nuanced aspects, look at 20 different websites, use 10 different calculators, and then if you know it all can make something half decent, that you can then slam and pray you didn't screw it up. But to have the money to do all of that, you still have to make the money, which means you have to know all the key money making tricks, run trade bots, etc.

So harvest is loved cause it leveled the playing field for all. We could see a build that can take maven down in 40 seconds, and the average joe playing 2-3 hours a night could make the money, and put in the work and have that chase item.

Before harevest the chase item was well save up your EX to get the item, cause you could end up failing so horribly. It's not worth the risk and you don't have the play time to offset that.

But then you lose out, on keeping people engaged for longer. Leagues with Harvest have kept me more engaged longer, as i've been pushing each of my gear pieces to perfection, day by day. I have each slot basically becoming a chase item for my build. Without harvest like it is. I have maybe 1 chase item, and I'll just slow grind it's worth in EX. Call it a day, go wow i bought the OP item i win. yeah... So glad i farmed 40 mind numbing maps to do that.


the devs act like every harevest roll is a win, it's not it's still gambling and it's expensive as well.

They just need to remove the biggest issue of having it not be tradable. And rebalance of it being in game tradable. but leave it as it is.

OR OR OR OR.....

Rebalance drops in general, I would love to get a great influenced rolled item, as a map drop that only needed, a few bench crafts, and a possible chaos spam. Instead, we chaos spam a ilvl 86 and it rolls 4hp, and 10 dex. There needs to be bottom tier rolls, then it's not a big deal. If at level 85 a chaos spam wouldn't roll less than t4 stats, then great. Use that method along with item level to make us juice maps, i want to run a map with added item level boosting, zana boosting, delve with the +3 to item boosting, so that the item level 90 drops, only have a t3-t1 roll chance. Then yes we can live with harvest being how it its.

Solves the general problem of loot drops as well. I'll be jumping up and down yelling in guild chat, look what just dropped booooyssssss. Or I'll chaos spam it and oooohhh that is a juicy one. Then I'll slam the EX on top and go really? really you stupid RNG why did you give me spell damage on my 2 handed PDS sword... bah, back to map farming for a new base.

Right now the base and the rolls you can do with anything are so completely randomly and poor, it's a living nightmare to craft. Essences helped with a bit of direction, and fossils helped with preventing junk from rolling, where it shouldn't be. But really it's the complete 0 to 5 million roll option for everything in the world, that is the problem. if that was narrow so you didn't have to spend 1000c trying to slam just 1 stat you want / need for your build, and then praying to build it the rest of the way up from the ground. Then we wouldn't need harvest how it is. Till then leave it as is but make it tradeable via orbs.
Then I don't have to beg and plead and play some facebook style love me game in discord to trade.
You as devs can then see what we really are sinking into it.

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ymost wrote:

Yup

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surio wrote:

+1001 to this.

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Miraille wrote:

Mods, you're still reading this, we know you are. We watch you handle your jobs, so here's a request from us players. Make Chris sit down and read this. Every page of it. Make him do it. Don't ask him, don't plead with him. TELL him to sit down and read. Let him see what the base really wants.

I want well for this game. I have since it began. However, casino gambling is not crafting by any definition. Yes, you are making items, but by rerolling them randomly, augmenting them randomly, etc. It's literally all one big casino gamble.

Harvest fixed that for me. Harvest removed the one detail from the game that plagued me most. So I'll chill around here and see how this plays out, my only hope being that somebody actually does tell Chris to sit down and read this feedback.

Agree. Gambling is not crafting. If PoE wants to have crafting, Harvest should stay. Early Path of Exile, pre-Essence, with forsaken masters and the crafting bench only... that was a quirk to just help you get that one mod you were missing, be it life or resist, etc. And that was the most Crafting would or could be. The expectation was low, essentials only.

But as more cool mods enter the game, and the mod pool of possibilities gets huge, and the good mods are weighted quite scarce, we kind of NEED a less RNG way to roll endgame gear. I'm talking level 95+, only running T16 maps, using sextants and scarabs and delirium orbs, etc. all the content that keeps the endgame perpetually challenging. Chaos spamming an item just doesn't cut it.

This league was so good for the average player. I managed to self craft my own end game items. I do wood working on the side. When I build something for a customer, I generally try to deliver a product THEY like. Not what I like. This seems to be the exact opposite of that. I hope you look to the player base on these changes before ruining the only means us "Average Joe's" had at getting good items. I suggest looking into obvious (in my opinion) things this game needs. Such as a solid trade system. The website stuff sucks guys. Whispering 25 players for items to get AFK responses for just flat out ignored sucks. Missing a sale because I had to step away from my computer for a few moments sucks. Put in an auction house style system that lists your premium tab's contents in game. Make them purchasable in game. A mailbox would even look cool in my hideout. And not to mention, all those infuriating price fixers and trade screen scammers would be 100% out of a job. And I think they should be. Victim blame all you guys want, but if there is a way to completely mitigate the scam rather than maintaining constant vigilance, why not do it?

P.S.
Nobody closes their eyes and exalt slams items. The chances of bricking the item vs hitting are astronomical. That stuff is for streamers and their viewer counts.