-20% exp on death needed
" I long stopped believing there's any logical consistency there. This past week's been the L-ympics basically and when there's no counter-argument, the initial claim is repeated as if nothing happened between then and now. The opposite of knowledge is not illiteracy, but the illusion of knowledge.
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" Yes, ofc. There is no point in me arguing with anyone who simply has a different point of view and disagrees with me about exp loss. Neither side will convince the other, nothing will come of it. So its better to do nothing. Like I don't gotta prove anything to anyone lol And then I'm just left with 1 choice only: keep complaining about exp loss until it gets deleted. |
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" What he was saying is that there is little value in arguing when no proper counterargument or reasoning is being presented. If you put forward an idea, such as removing the experience penalty, you are expected to provide clear and reasonable justification for why it should be removed. That justification needs to go beyond a vague statement like “it’s bad” and instead explain, in concrete terms, why the system itself is flawed. Ultimately, many players have already explained why the penalty exists in the first place. They have also pointed out that it becomes far less of an issue if you adapt your build or invest more into defenses. Refusing to do so while continuing to complain, without offering any solid or well-reasoned explanation for why the mechanic is fundamentally bad, significantly weakens your position. At that point, the argument is no longer about the system, but about an unwillingness to adjust. Because of this, continuing to argue does not lead anywhere productive. No matter how many valid points others raise, you dismiss them without providing meaningful counterpoints of your own. As far as I am aware, the death penalty is not going to be removed simply because you dislike it or repeatedly complain about it. The practical solution remains the same: build a better character with more defenses, die less, and the penalty becomes largely irrelevant. If someone continues to complain while also contributing to the problem by refusing to improve or adapt, and fails to present compelling reasons for the developers to make changes in their favor, the likelihood of any changes happening is effectively zero. It is reasonable to assume that the developers read these discussions, review individual cases, and evaluate the arguments being made. When players consistently ignore obvious solutions or rely on weak reasoning, their credibility suffers, and their feedback is far less likely to be taken seriously. That being said, the death penalty is almost certainly going to remain unchanged. It is extremely unlikely that it will be removed entirely, for reasons you should be well aware of by now. If GGG were to make any adjustment at all, it would be far more plausible to see an increase to 20%. Based on everything discussed in this topic, that outcome would actually be more justified, as those advocating for a higher penalty have consistently presented clearer, more coherent, and better-reasoned arguments for why a stronger punishment would better support the game’s overall balance and design. Hobby Gamer and Professional Software Engineer & Systems Architect from Tennessee
“Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I’m not sure about the universe“ - Albert Einstein |
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" Because its bad and pointless and wastes a player's time for no reason. I don't have to justify anything. I'm simply giving my valid feedback. That's a good enough reason. The game would be more fun without exp loss, and this mechanic isn't necessary at all. The campaign is just fine in the first half without exp loss, so the whole game would be fine without it too. This is a feedback forum, I don't have to justify, or prove, or do anything of the sort with any of my feedback. I simply say "game should be like this" and that's it, its up to the devs to decide what to do with the feedback. I'm not here to debate anything. I'm here to give my feedback on how to improve the game and make it objectively more fun for everyone. |
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" Saying something is bad is a conclusion without evidence, a label rather than a reason. If you feel like your time is being wasted from dying, stop dying. If you can't stop dying, build a better character. You are free to give your feedback and we are free to contextualize your claims and engage in an open forum. If you don't want to be scrutinized, send your feedback via email to GGG. " Saying it would be more fun without XP loss is an unsubstantiated claim. You are working back from a conclusion, not making an argument. The purpose of the XP penalty has been explained so many times, you claiming it isn't necessary is dishonest at best. The first half of the campaign has no XP penalty because it's part of the tutorial, ramps up during the second half, and the tutorial ends in maps basically. That whole line is a non-sequitur as your claim does not follow logically from your assertion. " But you are absolutely debating. You don't simply share your feedback. No, you actively engage and keep re-iterating the same claims without providing any substantive arguments. The last few pages are a true testament to the maturity other commenters possess. I can honestly say that were I still in my 20's I'd find other words to describe the frustrations I'm sure not only I feel in dealing with whatever this is. If you truly don't want to debate things, leave it with your last response or accept that you have to face the music. Everyone's been super patient with you, so respectfully, respect other people's time as well by at least attempting to argue in good faith in return The opposite of knowledge is not illiteracy, but the illusion of knowledge.
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" But you do not give any reasonable feedback. You just claim something is a waste of time or bad while the fault is clearly yours. A real example of something being a waste of time would be if we were playing a game and an item had a 0.00001 percent drop chance, and then it turned out the drop was completely bugged and could not happen at all. If someone pointed this out and said it was a waste of time, that would be valid feedback. Saying that the experience penalty is a waste of time is simply wrong. The penalty exists for obvious reasons, and it does not waste time on its own. The only people who lose time are players who are being tested by the mechanic, which is there to punish deaths. Every game has some kind of penalty for dying, so this is nothing special or unusual. Calling it outdated is also not a good argument because similar penalties exist in many other games, which makes the claim weak and unsupported. The idea that the game would be more fun without an experience penalty is also not a proper argument for removing it. If anything, removing the penalty would only encourage corpse rushing even more, which GGG has already dealt with in several ways. This shows how GGG wants players to play, which is by progressing naturally and building stronger characters to tackle harder content. A better example of proper feedback would be if we suggested removing the experience penalty but letting players level up naturally while adding something like PoE2’s portal system to keep a risk and reward element. If you are running a tough Tier 16 map, you would have to manage one or two portals carefully, which makes your choices and deaths meaningful. That is the kind of feedback that is specific, realistic, and useful. " This is the feedback section, a public space for everyone, so you should expect traffic, especially if you are in the wrong lane. You should also expect to be proven wrong if you try to support your personal opinion with incorrect facts. If you do not provide good feedback, the chances that the developers will take note of it are very low, and those chances become even lower if they see the rest of the context of the topic and the way you engage with it. On the other hand, it is very likely that they are having a fun day at work. " You’ve shared your personal opinions and thoughts without any real support, yet you try to argue that you are right and everyone else is wrong. Even so, you haven’t provided a single valid argument or explanation for why it would objectively make the game better for everyone. You are missing the bigger picture and seem to think that if the game is designed in your favor, it automatically becomes better for everyone. You’re wrong, because you do not represent the majority, and GGG’s design philosophy clearly shows that they have no intention of making the game the way you want it to be. You’ve shared your personal opinions and thoughts without any real support, yet you try to argue that you are right and everyone else is wrong, effectively attempting to force your personal opinion onto everyone even as you are proven wrong. There is no need to try to bring the game down to your level, which would actually make it less enjoyable for the many players who love it as it is and hope for meaningful, impactful changes. Ultimately, if you think you know exactly what a fun game for everyone would look like, you could at any time create your own game. Just be aware that there is a lot of math involved, and a lot of hard math at that. Hobby Gamer and Professional Software Engineer & Systems Architect from Tennessee “Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I’m not sure about the universe“ - Albert Einstein Last edited by VoidWhisperer42#5989 on Dec 21, 2025, 5:12:41 PM
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Exp loss is bad, and I will keep voicing my feedback that it should be deleted. It is what it is. That is the only thing I can do, because I know the game will be more fun without exp loss. I'm not interested in proving anything to anyone, because I simply don't have to.
And I will also +1 and agree with any other threads that pop up asking for the removal of exp penalty. Of which there are a countless number, and more new ones keep appearing regularly. So clearly the majority of the SC playerbase doesn't like exp loss. And I agree with them. |
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" Well, there’s another solution. Have you tried not die or die less often? If you don’t die, the penalty doesn’t even exist. It’s really as simple as that. " Without valid facts to prove the claim, it is difficult for the feedback to be taken seriously, and it reduces the likelihood that GGG will treat the personal wish list as a meaningful suggestion. " You and a few topics do not represent the majority. In reality, most players reach level 100 just by playing the game normally within the first week or two, while you are still stuck in the campaign. So no, this is already enough evidence that the penalty is not bad, in fact, at most it might be considered too easy. It might even be time for GGG to increase it to 20% or even more. It might even make sense to adopt PoE2’s revive system in PoE1 to make dying in the endgame even more punishing, which would only improve the overall risk to reward balance of the game. Hobby Gamer and Professional Software Engineer & Systems Architect from Tennessee “Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I’m not sure about the universe“ - Albert Einstein Last edited by VoidWhisperer42#5989 on Dec 21, 2025, 5:42:50 PM
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" the game devs have the right to decide everything. but then again the players get to decide if theyre having fun with it. one thing i absolutely loath about poe is you simply cannot learn mechanics organically without feeling like you're heavily punished for doing so. maven for example. shes actually "easy" for the first few phases but you need to learn how her attacks work. telegraphing in poe is BAD. it is immersive but if you dont know how attacks work, you sometimes have no idea whats about to happen. the first time i defeated maven i ate 6-7 maven writs before i finally got my first kill. i really had to pay attention and not get hit by her attacks and learn how to deal with her permanent degen aoes. i can kill her but i dont fight her often enough to remember her patterns so more mistakes are made. sometimes in new leagues i come in, try doing her, forget how some of her attacks work or dont pay attention enough then i fail the encounter. then i need to farm writs again. by the tine i've farmed enough writs. i've forgotten all the lessons i've learnt. and more often than not, i would fail her again. ggg introduced zana related bosses a patch ago or two. i first tried em this league. whats going on? what am i supposed to do? i dont know lmao. i only know that i died a few times fighting em because i dont know their attack patterns. in fact i didnt even know i was set up to fight them and thought i was just doing a regular map. its real ironic that GGG also gave us a very forgiving way to get the first two voidstones, teach us how to fight izarro with easier versions. but then dont give a flying fuck about every other boss in the game. there are many things that can be improved. but many better players such as yourself have already accepted things as the way they are. i m now playing wwm. i need actual skill to fight the bosses in that game. i dont cheese the bosses. i learn how to parry/dodge etc. i LOSE a huge lot. sometimes its to the point all my gear is broken and even to the point i literally have no potions left. but i push on. it maybe took me hours, but i managed to kill many bosses that i consider hard, with broken gear and with a single life (since i have no potions). i do that and i feel happy. i feel challenged. but its enjoyable. poe? i often feel robbed [Removed by Support]
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" My hypothetical was in response to Toforto asserting he decides when he's ready to beat an encounter, thus insinuating that the game should yield as he wishes to progress. I imposed that hypothetical where someone clearly isn't making good decisions for their build and having far less power and defence than is expected at that stage of the game, because it is a true test of what he's asserting. Of course he didn't respond to that. Feelings over facts, or some such. I don't know what "wwm" is and don't care to look it up either as it has nothing to do with the discussion at hand. From context clue I gather you want to say that you like boss design in that game better. I'm not one to judge, you like what you like man. Just don't have a point of reference there. If I sound dismissive here it's because I am. This is a discussion on Death Penalty which is not even a thing in Boss Invitations, and you're opening a branch on a branch discussion The opposite of knowledge is not illiteracy, but the illusion of knowledge.
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