We need more Atlas Trees, we have so many strats and the game gets stale fast!

Also...we do kind of have pretty decent insight and proof that more trees (less choice weight) is a bad idea, or at least problematic: the sheer fact that this game is.....not D3/D4. You think the devs of this game haven't PLAYED the other games? They are human and, more than that, they are game developers in the same genre. OF COURSE they have played D3 and D4. And they make choices for THIS game based on the things they believe are NOT good in those other games.

And the absolute biggest difference in D3/D4 from D2 and PoE is the removal of weighted choice and the overall dumbing down of nearly every system to cater to a HUGE varied audience and make the most money possible (not the "best game" possible). Second biggest difference is graphical and mood. These aren't mysteries to the ARPG community or developers.

What is the RIGHT number of trees? We can't really know that. But at least from what I can see and what I feel, 1 was too few and 3 feels like plenty. That is MY opinion.

"

cowmoo275#3095 wrote:

^I am NOT playing D3 for a reason: we are on the PoE forums. So obviously....making design decisions on THIS game that are taken from the poor path that D3 developers chose is....not what I want. Editing your previous post to remove your initial direct attack on other's opinions doesn't erase it from those involved in this thread btw.

Not sure why you got so incredibly tilted from that post lol, just because I pointed out downsides to your idea. I wasn't even attacking YOU at all...I was pointing at the holes in your argument.

I was never making an objective assertion, it was fairly obvious that it was my subjective opinion. But at least I offered reasoning WHY I believe in my subjective opinion over your suggestion. That is called "debate". And man....you are HERE, on the PoE forums. In your own post you said you don't like Blizzard and don't play D3 beyond a week. There are REASONS for that man! This forum is RARELY going to have objective fact involved, especially when it comes to suggestions.

You have confirmation bias: because this is something you clearly feel strongly about, you have only remembered the threads where people ask for more trees post-3tree. I can pretty much guarantee you that it is NOT the majority who want more trees, let alone 90%. Because the majority was fine with ONE tree, when it happened to only be one tree. And you can kinda already see in this thread alone, even in a short time, that it isn't a majority.



Posting on a public forum invites disagreement. Don't take everything so incredibly personal. Focus on the things people disagree with you with, digest the WHY, and refute them if you can. There have been zero attacks on YOU in this thread, except when you said you don't want to listen to anyone else's opinion. That's not how a public forum will ever work. And replying and disagreeing with you is not "reporting you". Until this last post, you didn't do anything wrong other than reply to someone else's DIFFERENT opinion with "I don't care or want to hear your opinion". Which even you recognized and edited. Why not ACTUALLY be a bit kinder and more open minded instead of the odd platitude at the end of the post.

I did not edit anything, you reported me, and it got removed, i got a warning if i would discuss it further i would get a punishment. Anyways, i'm out of here, are you going back on your main account now? Goodbye!

i was originally one person who hated the idea of having alternate atlas trees.

my reasoning was it gave players a reason to use orbs of unmaking and it gave a sense of weight. your choice carries serious weight when you only have 1 atlas tree. repeccing can be VERY EXPENSIVE for weaker players. but it made the choices matter much more.

after they introduced the 3 atlas presets and i actually used it. i found that.... i want MORE.

fuck weight. the game is vastly more enjoyable when i m not busy scrounging orbs to reset the tree to try different strats.

want to farm exarch? go exarch tree. want to farm eater? eater tree. want to farm maven? maven tree.

but its really not enough.

one thing that i quickly came to realize is. instead of one entire skill tree. we actually need it segregated. i cant recall if i asked for it before but POE2 does this.

in poe2, each league has its own league specific tree which you can invest points in ONLY if you engage in the mechanic.

the result is theres no real fomo. if you like breach you could work yourself up and unlock the full breach tree. whenever you encountered breach in maps, you would ALWAYS receive the benefit of your breach passives.

this is something that i want in poe1. despite having 3 presets, it is just not enough as theres too many combinations of league content i would want to spec into.

and because theres only 3 presets. what happens is i will NEVER engage in those content unless its for an achievement. its simply COSTS too much for me to switch to a different tree to get the best results.

if POE2's system was introduced, this can be mitigated. i can have the 3 pinnacle presets and i wouldnt care for which league mechanics i want to run. as long as i've unlocked each individual tree high enough, i get a better experience running them regardless as long as i have points in their specific tree.

one thing that i will point out is i actually dont like how the atlas tree is used to "fix" league content.

to me ideally league content should ALWAYS be rewarding and desirable to run AS IS. instead, ggg went the other way around and made it so the league mechanics are WORSE by default and needs fixing in order to make it more rewarding or feel better.

to me the atlas tree should be more about choice rather than fixing. a good example is disabling beyond bosses but allows players to keep summoning beyond demons. that is an interesting choice. it is something players can consider opting into. harvest's crop rotation is also an interesting choice. it changes how you interact with harvest content.

on the flipside. getting more harvest juice is NOT a choice. if you're running harvest, you'd be dumb NOT to take it. it is not interesting. if you're running harvest, taking ALL the harvest nodes (except the crop rotation ones) are compulsory.

there a lot of illusion of choice in POE1's atlas tree. POE2's atlas tree gives more real choice when talking about league specific tree. where you can make things harder/easier or change the behaviour of the mechanic.

despite singing praises to poe2's atlas. i will have to criticize it as the "base tree" (non league) is pretty bland and doesnt feel too impactful. there are a few nodes that change the experience a little by making the game harder for more rewards but its nothing that screams "interesting choice".

"

Axzantos#6012 wrote:

[Removed by Support]

sorry did i miss something? anyway if its in regards to my signature, it was removed because i was fucking pissed at ggg for splitting poe2 from poe1 back then.

i understand why now and i support their decision of the split after jon kept mentioning how it was to fix melee in poe2.

beyond that i m not sure what support removed

You just described the entire reason Atlas trees can be reallocated, OP. Congratulations!

"

Axzantos#6012 wrote:

[Removed by Support]

Sorry but.....no. That's not what happened. You need to abide by the courtesy rules of the forum, same as anyone else. No reporting is necessary. No censoring of opinions ever happens on this forum....GGG wouldn't waste their time when they can easily just ignore it. There are hundreds of posts per day, perhaps even thousands. This one opinion is not worth that kind of focus. The posts are being moderated because of the exact reasons given in their messages to you.

It is quite interesting to see that, rather than attack the counterarguments that multiple people have levied in this thread, you are attacking the people and moderators instead.

Opinions are great and wonderful: public forum, back them up, defend them. Ideas, not people. Unless the people truly deserve it lol.

"

Axzantos#6012 wrote:

I did not edit anything, you reported me, and it got removed, i got a warning if i would discuss it further i would get a punishment. Anyways, i'm out of here, are you going back on your main account now? Goodbye!

Ha, I wonder if he thinks I'm cowmoo275 after that statement. That'd be funny.

Anyways, I took his statement to fact and respected his desire to not care for my opinion, so I didn't reply anymore. I still read the others' feedback and giggled a little, not gonna lie.

We have 3. Thats enough. come on man.

This is the epitome or slippery slope. I dont know why people dont see that.

Nobody will ever be happy. Its an endless loop of people with their hand out begging.

deleted

"

cowmoo275#3095 wrote:

They are human and, more than that, they are game developers in the same genre. OF COURSE they have played D3 and D4. And they make choices for THIS game based on the things they believe are NOT good in those other games.

We could see that in Kalandra's loot nerfs and then their trade manifesto and so on and on.

Don't assume devs are omniscient. They ARE human not machines they often think what is good for the game, which does not mean it will be.

They believed 0.2 will be amazing if they nerf loot and player power by 70% and we saw the reception of that.

Ask yourself why we have ruthless? Because devs players will enjoy challenge. Did they?

That said, I can actually understand devs in that regard. As a writer, I came across a tons of feedback from my readers and experienced firsthand how they tried to "write" my stories. Sometimes their vision ran against mine and it was annoying as hell.

But, in the end, if you don't have financial luxury to write for yourself, you write for the market.