Ideas for Merc Mechanic Going Core

Been thinking about this more as time goes on, and my views have changed a bit. I think they COULD go core and it would be an exciting addition to the game. But a few things are necessary that I and others have already pointed out. I want to add a few things to the list.

1) We need skill customization. The complete random nature of both finding the RIGHT archetype, but then also the RIGHT combo of skills, as well as the RIGHT combo of supports is just too many layers of RNG for a mechanic that will no longer be in every map. Maybe have the mercs come with a set of randomly generated "skill points", which can then be allocated by the player using a preset list of possible skills and supports. The skills can be weighted in terms of skill point cost: with more desirable skills such as auras costing a lot more skill points. Higher level supports cost more points than lower level supports, etc.

2) We need growth. Doesn't need to be game-wide, aka find a merc in Act 1 and use him all the way until red maps....BUT we need some sense of progression. Similar to the above idea, perhaps have mercs also spawn with "level potential": a stat that allows them to level up a certain amount of times, awarding stat and damage upgrades and/or skill points. For example, you can find a merc in act 1 with 5 "level potential" that allows them to level up 5 times before maxing. This can keep them under control while also allowing us to use a well-rolled mercenary for slightly longer before they get trashed by simply being unable to keep up with both our power and the content they are in.

3) Infamous Mercenaries need to be.....far more special and far more rare. As far as I can tell, the only difference really is that they come equipped with a unique item (usually garbage and useless) and potentially an item with an "infamous" mod. There should be a lot more to them, and they could become the "chase unique" of mercenaries. Maybe they have a unique infamous skill. Maybe they have higher skill and level points. Maybe they could even roll as a different stat archetype(?!) than their non-infamous counterpoints. Maybe they simply have an additional special stat like "Resistance modifiers on equipment equipped to this mercenary have 50% more potency".

There is so much potential here that its really sad that GGG, after so many years of considering mercenaries and KNOWING that they were a desired mechanic, basically took the easiest route yet also the worst possible route with them, making them unkillable AND ultra-powerful AND almost completely static entities, not to mention almost 100% reliant on RNG. Often, we see comments on these forums that give GGG a pass because "well, they only had x months" or "they were focused on PoE 2".....but those don't really fly because who ever said they only ever think about ideas within the timeframe of a single league? It would make far more sense that they have been mulling ideas for YEARS before implementing them officially into new content. The balancing is what takes place in the short timespan....not the idea creation and development.

As a side note.....infamous modded gear needs to have a unique border color or SOMETHING so that we can see them immediately and be able to check the item, without being forced to check every single goddamn item every single time we encounter a mercenary (assuming we want a mercenary mod).

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cowmoo275#3095 wrote:

As a side note.....infamous modded gear needs to have a unique border color or SOMETHING so that we can see them immediately and be able to check the item, without being forced to check every single goddamn item every single time we encounter a mercenary (assuming we want a mercenary mod).

Should be already in the game rn. Sorry for derailing with your side note.

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TRPV1#7216 wrote:

Should be already in the game rn. Sorry for derailing with your side note.

I mean....most of what I wrote in this thread should already be in the game right now lol. To me it's mostly intuitive design based on things that GGG has already created in the past...But yes, this one was just an extreme oversight (and uber easy fix) by GGG. They could have made it an "infamous influence"-like effect so it was immediately obvious there was a special mod.

I don't want to have to go to poedb and look up all the possible infamous modifiers THAT way: I would have loved to find them organically, but I'm not wasting my time every map looking at every mod of every piece of gear. Especially when, if I'm not mistaken, the game doesn't pause when you are interacting with the mercenary.

I don't understand why everyone considers the Doryani merc such great power creep...

You could already do the same exact thing before this league - you just had to play with other players to do so. The power was already there. It's not new. All it did is move from multiplayer to single player.

That being said, I vote -100 res limit.

Regarding Doryani -> generally prevent Merc res going into negatives. This would still allow Dorayni to work as a "Ignore Lightning Res" item which is pretty strong. Capping Merc res will be easier that way but also encourages using more interesting affixes on the gear. It's not like capping res on the merc is hard in any way currently either so I don't see it as a big issue personally if they can't go into negatives.

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XxFasterBlasterxX#5138 wrote:

I don't understand why everyone considers the Doryani merc such great power creep...

You could already do the same exact thing before this league - you just had to play with other players to do so. The power was already there. It's not new. All it did is move from multiplayer to single player.

That being said, I vote -100 res limit.

Because probably 99% of players never ever play with other people. And it is exceedingly tough for "humans" to remain in radius of each other. But a mercenary bypasses all of that, and doesn't need to be geared for the downside.

A "player" wielding Doryani needs to craft their ENTIRE CHARACTER around the negative lightning resistance. A merc need only slap it on and do nothing else.

-100 resist limit, 0 resist limit......these are still MASSIVE power creep that you guys aren't comprehending. And that is mainly that the Mercenary does not need to deal with the downside of HAVING that resistance like anyone else would. The tradeoff no longer exists and its just an immense power increase for literally no reason. Imagine if WE ran around with 0 resistances in maps, what would happen? Even if we ran around with like 65 resistances, what would happen? THAT is the true problem here. And that is the "power creep" aspect of this: free Doryani massive damage boost with no opportunity cost.

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cowmoo275#3095 wrote:

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XxFasterBlasterxX#5138 wrote:

I don't understand why everyone considers the Doryani merc such great power creep...

You could already do the same exact thing before this league - you just had to play with other players to do so. The power was already there. It's not new. All it did is move from multiplayer to single player.

That being said, I vote -100 res limit.

Because probably 99% of players never ever play with other people. And it is exceedingly tough for "humans" to remain in radius of each other. But a mercenary bypasses all of that, and doesn't need to be geared for the downside.

A "player" wielding Doryani needs to craft their ENTIRE CHARACTER around the negative lightning resistance. A merc need only slap it on and do nothing else.

-100 resist limit, 0 resist limit......these are still MASSIVE power creep that you guys aren't comprehending. And that is mainly that the Mercenary does not need to deal with the downside of HAVING that resistance like anyone else would. The tradeoff no longer exists and its just an immense power increase for literally no reason. Imagine if WE ran around with 0 resistances in maps, what would happen? Even if we ran around with like 65 resistances, what would happen? THAT is the true problem here. And that is the "power creep" aspect of this: free Doryani massive damage boost with no opportunity cost.

Ok you're right about that, they do need to be affected more by -res.

Either way, I'll be veering away from Doryani merc builds in the near future even if it's kept the same. I played it most of this league, and the area of effect is small enough that you have to keep hitting the command button to position your merc (not a giant deal, but I'm tired of it). It's particularly terrible if you're trying to do massive area damage, as you'll do a ton where they're standing and almost nothing everywhere else.

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XxFasterBlasterxX#5138 wrote:

as you'll do a ton where they're standing and almost nothing everywhere else.

Much like marks, Doryani is not really for clear...its for massive damage boosts on single targets like bosses. Plus those are the targets where it has an unnaturally high effect because they are the only enemies that actually HAVE inherent lightning resistance to begin with, which you then turn completely off and invert. The AoE doesn't matter in those settings. Ex: Maven has 50% lightning resist, so Doryani gives you at least 50% MORE damage against Maven versus most other enemies

That's really why its a problem: you can bet future bosses will get WAY chonkier and have more immunity phases because of things like that. Everyone without that level of damage boost is gonna be SOL.

Its always been ridiculously strong: the only thing that stopped the complaints flooding the forums was the opportunity cost also being exceptionally high, not to mention the knowledge gap of "how to deal with -200% lightning resistances?" that less experienced players simply cannot handle. Merc interaction ERASES this entirely and thus.....endless Doryani complaining now.

The only people who want mercs in the core game are random forum posters, often people who barely ever get to maps.

None of the "good" players think this is a good idea, because they understand that Mercs are some of the most obscene powercreep we have ever seen.

And that in itself would be fine, if it could be dialed back - but as long as they can equip any player item, they will always cause a massive build disparity because of Doryanis etc.

Personally, I hope they never become part of the core game. There are so many better systems that are rotting in the graveyard. I'd rather see crucible trees than mercs in the core game.

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PrimordialDarkness#3913 wrote:

The only people who want mercs in the core game are random forum posters, often people who barely ever get to maps.

What?