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Th4tGuy89 wrote:

I had tried to do Uber Elder twice, both times with desecrate giving level 81 corpse at max, and none of my gems had quality. I got some better gems and qualitied the ones i had that were high enough level.

Ive just killed Uber Elder, although i died on the last portal at the same time as him, so i dont think it counts! I saw a jewel drop too.

Is the animate guardian meant to survive UE? I saw that you didnt have it in your video, and mine died before shapers first phase?

Also i lost 2 spectres at one point. The highest area i can access is 82 in the mines, will that be the reason why they died? The damage is insane but the toughness of the spectres, for me, was a little bit low.

Again, thanks for the great build, i really enjoyed it. Judging by the changes we've seen so far for 3.8 i dont think spectres alone will be a viable build for endgame :(

Level 81/82 spectres should be OK, but you need to be more vigilant with keeping them out of danger. You need to use Convocation at the right time to keep them out of shaper's beam, for example. Also be careful with ground degens. They are the number 1 danger to minions.

The AG can die if you're not careful. They don't leech so only rely on passive regen to survive any hits, so you really need to have a nice controlled fight. If the fight gets a bit hectic because there's degens/anomalies everywhere, then you can possibly lose it because it's standing on a degen and/or it takes a shaper's beam to the face.

My brain is damaged by those changes :]]

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Rebur wrote:

Yeah I'm wondering if Empower Level 3-4 will now be better for Specters than either Elemental Focus or Controlled Destruction. Empower Level 3 give Level 85 Specters and Empower Level 4 give Level 86 Specters.

It really depends if GGG has changed the monsters scaling or not.

Currently, damage seems to be about an additional 4-5% per level. You can test this yourself in PoB. Start a new character and add Raise Spectre with no supports. Then add any spectre. Then step up their level.

So, say if you want to use Pledge of Hands, then highest level is 83. Test with Solar Guard because the Slave Driver workaround adds flat damage. So, you get a basic SG with 1202 dps. Link Empower 4 to get to 87, and you have 1450 dps. 20% more. Life goes from 29995 to 38827 for 29% more.

Thats because the current spectre Gem does not change the actual Spectre's level. All it does it give a little bit 'more' damage and HP with +gem level.

You need to test the difference a level 79 SG and a lvl 83 SG because the new Spectre gem actually increase base Spectre levels with +gem.

So, basically we would take:

1. Mindless Aggression.
2. Unnatural Strength. We must take this to get our spectre level over 80.
3. Commander of Darkness. Need this to res cap spectres.
4. Bone Barrier*

Essence Glutton:
Could be good for the Wand & Shield build, since it has Desecrate on a trigger. Replacing Blade Vortex with Spell Cascade to get max corpses per cast.
For Pledge of Hands, we can make use of this with cwdt 1 and desecrate 1 with spell cascade. IC at level 1 as well (still 25% reduced damage, so it's fine). Every hit that does more than 528 damage will pump out 15 corpses. That should be enough to feed Feast of Flesh and/or Essence Glutton.

Plague Bringer:
Could be good for the Wand & Shield build, since it has Desecrate on a trigger. Replacing Blade Vortex with Spell Cascade to get max corpses per cast.
For Pledge of Hands, we can make use of this with cwdt 1 and desecrate 1 with spell cascade. IC at level 1 as well (still 25% reduced damage, so it's fine). Every hit that does more than 528 damage will pump out 15 corpses. That should be enough to feed Feast of Flesh and/or Essence Glutton.

Mistress of Sacrifice:
Limited usefulness.
For Bone Offering, 25% reduced effect + 30% reduced effect (if using Acrobatics) for about 15% block chance.
For Flesh Offering, about 20% increased cast and movement speed.
For Spirit Offering, if using Acrobatics, energy shield is usually quite small, especially if using rare chest instead of Vis.

Bone Barrier:
If the description is in addition to Bone Armour, it gives some nice defensive bonuses. If the description is just describing Bone Armour, then it should be a Gem.

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Max_zero wrote:

Thats because the current spectre Gem does not change the actual Spectre's level. All it does it give a little bit 'more' damage and HP with +gem level.

You need to test the difference a level 79 SG and a lvl 83 SG because the new Spectre gem actually increase base Spectre levels with +gem.

In PoB, you can change spectre level independently of gem level:

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zenrom wrote:

My brain is damaged by those changes :]]

Why is that? Too amazing?

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kayella wrote:

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Max_zero wrote:

Thats because the current spectre Gem does not change the actual Spectre's level. All it does it give a little bit 'more' damage and HP with +gem level.

You need to test the difference a level 79 SG and a lvl 83 SG because the new Spectre gem actually increase base Spectre levels with +gem.

In PoB, you can change spectre level independently of gem level:

Thats weird.

Using an Spectre build of mine my TVs do 383k DPS per totem at lvl 84. At level 88 they do 480k. That's about 25% more.

Spectre (monsters) seem to scale at less crazily then Skeletons and Zombies.

A level 20 base Skeleton does 1500 DPS but a level 30 Skeleton (possible with a +1 gem +2 support staff) does 4000 DPS.

Look at that 20 million DPS Zombie/Skele build in another thead just that +2 alone from Ascendancy add 143k DPS per Skeleton and a 115k per Zombie.

Got the feeling 3.8 might be the Time of the Zombies and Skeleton. Until the nerf in 3.9 anyway.

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Max_zero wrote:

Using an Spectre build of mine my TVs do 383k DPS per totem at lvl 84. At level 88 they do 480k. That's about 25% more.

Spectre (monsters) seem to scale at less crazily then Skeletons and Zombies.

A level 20 base Skeleton does 1500 DPS but a level 30 Skeleton (possible with a +1 gem +2 support staff) does 4000 DPS.

Look at that 20 million DPS Zombie/Skele build in another thead just that +2 alone from Ascendancy add 143k DPS per Skeleton and a 115k per Zombie.

Got the feeling 3.8 might be the Time of the Zombies and Skeleton. Until the nerf in 3.9 anyway.

The other support gems and stuff from the passive tree (and charges) will make the level change seem bigger. We got the same thing in 3.6 when i86 zones were possible. For this build, PoB was reporting overall 15% more damage going from 84 to 86. But the baseline was still 4% more per level.

I think what's missing when people consider minions is "DPS quality".

PoB DPS numbers are somewhat misleading, especially for melee minions, because it just takes the average damage and multiplies that by the attack rate. PoB can't take into account something like a boss simply moving out of the way. If the boss has a high move speed, melee minions will lose a lot of DPS just trying to get close enough to hit.

For example, I tried doing a 660-depth Aul with Enhanced Vaal. With all my gear in standard, I can get a PoB single hit of 2mil shaper and 2 APS for 4mil shaper DPS each. But, they did zero damage to Aul because they couldn't even get to him to hit in the first place.

This is just anecdotal, but another issues I found with melee minions is that they seem to body block each other. When I was experimenting with Enhanced Vaal and Spiders, I noticed that the EVs weren't hitting as much when the spiders were surrounding the bosses.

DPS quality affects ranged spectres as well. For example, Slave Drivers use an instant hit aoe spell, so every monster under the spell's aoe is hit as soon as their spell is cast. Compared to SGs, where the fireball has to travel a distance during which it can simply fly past any/all monsters. Also the fireball will explode on the first thing it hits so any monsters behind will be unaffected.

Lastly, say if you compare Slave Drivers with Zombies, no amount of Zombie movement speed can match SD's ability to cover the screen with instant hit aoe. If you compared with Solar Guards, they can clear up to 2 screens away.

i think this is actually nerf spectres....

-soul weaver seems to be pretty bad.
so dissapointed
what different between % increased max life and % more max life?