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This is sad to me, and while I quickly am getting sick of coming here and posting
Yeah that sentiment is definitely shared about the bullshit you keep spewing
Thank you, your opinion is important to me.
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My implementation of the innocent until proven guilty is based solely on Blackstone's formulation. And while I disagree (and have written a paper to this end) on his ratio, I believe that more damage is done to a community by hanging an innocent man, then by letting a guilty man walk when there is not sufficient evidence.
My comment about providing incentive was purely based on Mano's analogy and in no way is a legitimate suggestion.
I stand by my concerns that a potentially innocent player is being harassed and persecuted for something he may not be guilty of. I don't take a moral stance on much, but this is not right in my opinion.
If it really bothers him that much he could easily prove his innocence by streaming some of his races. Plain and simple.
You don't get to bitch and complain about being unfairly accused, when you refuse to take even to most trivial steps in demonstrating your innocence.
Imagine the following scenario in a court (since this is how you like to analogize the situation).
Judge: "Were you present at the time the murder was commited?"
Defendant: "No, I was elsewhere."
Judge: "Can you prove that you were elsewhere?"
Defendant: "Sure, but I don't want to. I'm innocent until proven guilty."
Only the judge (GGG) hasn't said anything yet have they?
When did we elect the community judges? Because I don't remember casting my vote for terrex, mores, and cwu.
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Posted byActingrudeon Nov 23, 2014, 7:01:31 PM
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This is sad to me, and while I quickly am getting sick of coming here and posting
Yeah that sentiment is definitely shared about the bullshit you keep spewing
Thank you, your opinion is important to me.
"
"
My implementation of the innocent until proven guilty is based solely on Blackstone's formulation. And while I disagree (and have written a paper to this end) on his ratio, I believe that more damage is done to a community by hanging an innocent man, then by letting a guilty man walk when there is not sufficient evidence.
My comment about providing incentive was purely based on Mano's analogy and in no way is a legitimate suggestion.
I stand by my concerns that a potentially innocent player is being harassed and persecuted for something he may not be guilty of. I don't take a moral stance on much, but this is not right in my opinion.
If it really bothers him that much he could easily prove his innocence by streaming some of his races. Plain and simple.
You don't get to bitch and complain about being unfairly accused, when you refuse to take even to most trivial steps in demonstrating your innocence.
Imagine the following scenario in a court (since this is how you like to analogize the situation).
Judge: "Were you present at the time the murder was commited?"
Defendant: "No, I was elsewhere."
Judge: "Can you prove that you were elsewhere?"
Defendant: "Sure, but I don't want to. I'm innocent until proven guilty."
Only the judge (GGG) hasn't said anything yet have they?
When did we elect the community judges? Because I don't remember casting my vote for terrex, mores, and cwu.
Who said this is a democracy?
#1 Victim of Murphy's Law.
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Posted bySlixSCon Nov 23, 2014, 7:08:27 PM
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Who said this is a democracy?
My sentiments exactly. So people need to stop treating it like anyone's opinion other than GGG's matters. And let them do their job.
Last edited by Actingrude on Nov 23, 2014, 7:15:03 PM
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Posted byActingrudeon Nov 23, 2014, 7:14:29 PM
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@Actingrude
In most "real" sports, the competitors have to prove that they don't cheat, in form of unannounced dope tests for example. Innocent before proven guilty applies but the burden of proof is basically on the athletes side.
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Posted bySa_Reon Nov 23, 2014, 7:22:47 PM
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Who said this is a democracy?
My sentiments exactly. So people need to stop treating it like anyone's opinion other than GGG's matters. And let them do their job.
Because the only alternative to democracy is totalitarianism? TIL
#1 Victim of Murphy's Law.
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Posted bySlixSCon Nov 23, 2014, 8:20:37 PM
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[removed by support]
"Banned"
Last edited by Michael_GGG on Nov 23, 2014, 9:57:56 PM
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Posted byterrexon Nov 23, 2014, 9:41:07 PM
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This is the saddest one for me. Mano I have always thought of you as an intelligent and dedicated poe player. During this race season I have seen a change in your stream personality and now your forum posts that I do not like.
You take yourself way to seriously and think you are way too important.
[removed by support]
Now, what do you have to say about that?
anything is everything Last edited by Michael_GGG on Nov 23, 2014, 9:57:41 PM
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Posted byManoceanon Nov 23, 2014, 9:48:33 PM
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Thread locked and some links removed under the name & shame policy.
To respond to a few things raised in the thread:
We don't mind feedback that includes concerns about cheating; but we do mind if it's referencing someone specific (for reasons provided elsewhere, witch hunts etc, it's just generally not a good idea) anything on this specific level should be sent to us directly everytime.
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See your problem is that you naively believe that "innocent until proven guilty" applies to the online world, more specifically competitive games.
In online gaming, more specifically PoE, we don't have the faintest idea how many people are actually cheating, it could be a minority, it could be a 50/50 split, or it could even be a majority. We just don't know. (especially in the absence of any concrete negative consequences)
I don't see how "We just don't know" translates into it being okay to publicly accuse and defame either.
Presumption of Innocence should be more than just 'the majority are innocent'; it's the only way to produce measured and fair verdicts. Presumption of guilt is already a punishment in itself before any official verdict, so pretty much anyone who's accused ends up punished to some degree or another regardless of the investigation (which is shitty imo)
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[removed by support]
Now, what do you have to say about that?
In Actingrudes defense since this has been locked:
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I hope he does cheat, it would be pretty sad to think he worked hard to get as good as he is just to have this happen.
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Posted byMichael_GGGon Nov 23, 2014, 10:27:05 PMGrinding Gear Games
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