[3.6] Acid Molten Strike Assassin - Uber Elder-viable Poison Build

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SHEPUUURD wrote:

The best way for this build to go against physical oneshots it with damage shifts (Taste of Hate, Lightning Coil, etc.) and percent-based reduction (Endurance Charges, Arctic Armour, Gruthkul Pantheon, Basalt Flask).
Against elemental oneshots, the only thing you can really do is to stack high resistances, either with Loreweave or via Purities and Flasks like this guy does it (this is a really good example of how to go at deep delving btw).

Thanks, your post is exactly what I was looking for. I like the way that guy is built a lot, though I'm a ways from being able to afford some of that kind of stuff. It gives me a direction to build toward though. Think I'll start by trying to fossil craft a good body armor. Once that's done I can sell the 6L loreweave and hopefully use that to pay for some of the other stuff.

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grandanes wrote:

_Tiem can you share a PoB of your gear or something similar? Curious how you're getting that much survivability and damage.

https://pastebin.com/6zSWa2W4

I still have room to grow.

Need better abyssal jewels and better rings. I have them in Standard but in Delve I've mostly been trying to roll a better claw not to worried about stuff I already have :)

Temp chains on the gloves would be godly. I could drop the blasphemy setup for more layered defenses.

Crafting better stats on me helm is on the list too. Some cool stuff can be done with fossils this league.

OP had about 65k total poison damage with the same setup as I recall. Claimed to do Uber Elder. I'm almost triple that.

I'm cruising depths of 250 and melting everything no real issues so far after shifting to Loreweave.

Some interesting stuff there _Tiems. To be fair, though, your DPS claims are a little disingenuous. First, you're not accounting for OP having 4 more projectiles, which due to PoB's issues with molten strike is an invisible 40% more multiplier while you get an extra link in VP that does show up on per ball DPS numbers. Similarly, OP's numbers assume WT isn't going, while yours assumes your AP is.

The non-ele as chaos mod on the neck though was a great idea that I had completely missed.

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grandanes wrote:

Some interesting stuff there _Tiems. To be fair, though, your DPS claims are a little disingenuous. First, you're not accounting for OP having 4 more projectiles, which due to PoB's issues with molten strike is an invisible 40% more multiplier while you get an extra link in VP that does show up on per ball DPS numbers. Similarly, OP's numbers assume WT isn't going, while yours assumes your AP is.

The non-ele as chaos mod on the neck though was a great idea that I had completely missed.

Disingenuous how? I just said that my poison damage per projectile was higher. You're comparing 10x163k vs 14x106k. I'm not a math whiz but 1,630k is bigger than 1,484k. More damage with VT and way less lag.

Also, not 40% with GMP. That's an assumption you make based on the reasoning that they will all hit. They won't and even if one miss, there goes your damage in comparison.

My AP is up nearly all of the time. Dropping it is quick and the range is good. You drop and move through the depths. When there's a break, drop another. Seems legit that I should include it. With that said, AP only amps AS, damage numbers don't change so it's pretty irrelevant for this discussion.

And you should check again, OP has Wither listed at 15 stacks. That's why I've been quoting 60k damage because without Wither, that's what he's got, which is charitable given that that's with Coralito's up. Without it, it drops to 49k (with Frenzy Charges). With Coralito's up, I get 202k.

Not sure how my values are remotely "disingenuous" but ok.

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_Tiem wrote:

Also, not 40% with GMP. That's an assumption you make based on the reasoning that they will all hit. They won't and even if one miss, there goes your damage in comparison.

Actually, no. The number of projectiles won't affect your effective chance to hit.
40% more projectiles always means you're hitting 40% more often, no matter if your chance is 10% or 100%.

I think you’re confused as to how projectiles work. Chance to hit is always 100% thanks Lycos. But projectiles have to make contact. Since it’s a random spread they all don’t. So no, you’re not hitting all 14. Not even close. You’re often not hitting all 10 either. Moreover while your chance of multiple projectiles hitting exist, they are reduced because of the projectiles dead zones. Which means more projectiles aren’t necessarily better, especially when it comes to single targets like bosses. You’re way better off with fewer but harder hitting magma balls.

Read up on how MS works.

He knows how it works. The spread of projectiles is determined by AoE modifiers. Number of projectiles doesn't change the spread. Therefor if the enemy hitbox is big enough to get hit by half the projectiles on average, you still gain 40% more damage from 40% more projectiles. If you spray 10 projectiles and hit with 5, or 14 projectiles and hit with 7, that's still 40% more damage. You can change the hitbox size to whatever you want, the proportionality will still hold.

The deadzone you're talking about is only a restriction that prevents projectiles from landing too close to the MELEE HIT and not to each other, so it has no effect on how adding projectiles scales up your damage.

The biggest argument against GMP is lag, honestly.

Hi, can someone please tell me if this claw is better than wasp nest, im not so sure because of the low attack speed:



Btw thanks for the guide.

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magicrectangle wrote:

He knows how it works. The spread of projectiles is determined by AoE modifiers. Number of projectiles doesn't change the spread. Therefor if the enemy hitbox is big enough to get hit by half the projectiles on average, you still gain 40% more damage from 40% more projectiles. If you spray 10 projectiles and hit with 5, or 14 projectiles and hit with 7, that's still 40% more damage. You can change the hitbox size to whatever you want, the proportionality will still hold.

The deadzone you're talking about is only a restriction that prevents projectiles from landing too close to the MELEE HIT and not to each other, so it has no effect on how adding projectiles scales up your damage.

The biggest argument against GMP is lag, honestly.

AoE affects both the distance of the projectiles from the point of contact and their explosions. Deadzones apply to each magma projectile and that means they will never overlap, which means the more you have, the less will hit unless the target's hit box is enormous.

Your math is wrong. Or rather the principles that hold it together are. You're not proportionally scaling the skill through more projectiles. Just because 5 out of 10 hit does not mean 7 out of 14 will. What even logic is that. The projectiles erupt from the point of contact randomly around a 270 degree circular radius. Each projectile has a deadzone to minimize overlap and abusing projectile stacking. You can fill up that 270 degree radius but each projectile will simply occupy a free zone to make the spread larger but still remain even.

If you have 10, 5 may hit. In that case, if you have 14, 5 also may hit. It depends on the targets hit box and it also depends on the random nature of the spread. The biggest argument against GMP is if losing 40% damage off each projectile is worth adding 4 more. The answer imo is no, it's not. I get statistically more projectiles will invariably hit with GMP, but remember that all are significantly weaker.

Play how you want but at least understand the skills and mechanics you are playing around.

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_Tiem wrote:

Play how you want but at least understand the skills and mechanics you are playing around.

You should heed your own advice here. Adding additional molten strike projectiles always places those projectiles inside of an area determined by AoE modifiers. Adding X% more projectiles therefore always increases average projectile density by X%, and thus average amount of projectiles expected to land in a monster's hitbox by X%. There are no deadzone concerns, except of course for the melee hit deadzone - but that doesn't factor into this.

You're wrong about GMP's damage penalty also. It doesn't apply to poison. That's why it is a sensible gem choice for poison molten strike, but not for direct damage molten strike.