[3.11] Shaper = Stunned, Tidebreaker Heavy Strike Stunner Build

I'm a little surprised by your choice for the ascendant. wouldn't slayer and jugg work better for the build? still taking path of the duelist, and roughly the same tree as your Ascendant.
We now get stun and chill immune, in addition we have an easy way of generating endurance charges and with champ that gives us extra damage. The accuracy seems nice, but i'm not convinced its enough to drop RT.
With slayer we get Culling strike which is a huge boost to bossing, plus we're immune to phys reflect and we can leech properly.
It would be missing Melee splash, which would hurt clear speed, but could be counteracted by using a second weapon with sunder, much like with the berserker.

I'd be really interested in your thoughts on this ascendancy choice.

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brightwaha wrote:

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Cloud_69 wrote:

Heya there!

So tom new league is starting and as i fell in love with this build on Abyss league will be playing again now.

Last league with berserker and swap weapons for sunder clearing was my choice.

What you think now with the revamped ascendancies ? Which is the best overall option for bosses?

Map mobs/bosses are deleted anyway with whichever path you follow so the question is which acsendancy will be the best option for shaper and maybe uber elder(dont think we can manage it though as there will be 2 bosses in the room)?

I believe all ascendancies can stun-lock Shaper with good gears, and the only real challenge is Uber Elder.

We are still not too sure how the boss fight will play out but, if they can be positioned close to each other, Slayer with 100% splash is going to crush both of them.

If they are always standing apart and there are ranged mobs nearby, then this fight will be pretty disastrous. I think Slayer is still the best option in this case...

If both Shaper and Elder have lower hp, low enough that our Sunder has chances to stun them, then maybe Berserker is the best option.

I don't know, we will need to know more about the fight to see how this build performs against Uber Elder.

Yeah for sure we will need more knowledge for this fight's mechanics but still last league it was between slayer and berserker.

And if money was not issue then berserker was the better option as with higher dps we could stun shaper easier than slayer.

This league with the changes we end up with which acsendancy as the better option over all? Is it still zerker or now slayer or sth else better? In you opinion always. As you are the best person to answer that question, i am asking because i will be starting a char based on your answer.

hi!im going this build again in next league.

but i cant decide what is best way for Slayer's tree.

which is important for stun build?20% culling or unending leech?

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DeathSabreZn wrote:

I'm a little surprised by your choice for the ascendant. wouldn't slayer and jugg work better for the build? still taking path of the duelist, and roughly the same tree as your Ascendant.
We now get stun and chill immune, in addition we have an easy way of generating endurance charges and with champ that gives us extra damage. The accuracy seems nice, but i'm not convinced its enough to drop RT.
With slayer we get Culling strike which is a huge boost to bossing, plus we're immune to phys reflect and we can leech properly.
It would be missing Melee splash, which would hurt clear speed, but could be counteracted by using a second weapon with sunder, much like with the berserker.

I'd be really interested in your thoughts on this ascendancy choice.

The Ascendant - Champion / Elementalist choice offers roughly 35% more damage: 27% more damage from 30% increased damage taken by enemies(Intimidate + Taunt + Shock); 6% more damage from Herald buff and ele penetration. 1.27 * 1.06 = 1.35.

When comparing Scion to Berserker or Slayer, we also need to take consideration of 5 additional passive points from Scion ascendancy tree, which will go to Harrier notable, offering 22% attack speed and 1 jewel socket. I value these as around 15% more damage. 15% more on top of 35% more is 55% more(1.15 * 1.35 = 1.55).

It's less than what Berserker offers(around 70% more damage) but Berserker has some survival downsides. Compared to Slayer version, this Ascendant version will have higher DPS.

If we ever ascend to Slayer it's for the unending leech. We already have Culling from the mace passive wheel so this ascendant option doesn't really offer any DPS(besides 20% increase damage, which is equivalent to 2.3% more damage).

Juggernaut offers chill immunity which is nice, but that's it... We are already gaining endurance charges(due to Tidebreaker) and we don't really need more. This ascendant option also offers no DPS.

This build needs to get DPS from ascendancy, so I don't really see much point in ascending to Slayer or Juggernaut. If unending leech is desired then ordinary Duelist Slayer is just better in my opinion.

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Cloud_69 wrote:

Yeah for sure we will need more knowledge for this fight's mechanics but still last league it was between slayer and berserker.

And if money was not issue then berserker was the better option as with higher dps we could stun shaper easier than slayer.

This league with the changes we end up with which acsendancy as the better option over all? Is it still zerker or now slayer or sth else better? In you opinion always. As you are the best person to answer that question, i am asking because i will be starting a char based on your answer.

To be honest, I am also having trouble determining which class to play after the changes. I think Berserker, Slayer and even Scion are all great.

Berserker remains the most aggressive class(DPS and mobility); but it has more survival downsides now.

Slayer now has insanely Heavy Strike + Ancestral Call + Impact combo for clearing, and Overwhelm buff means good Shaper stunning performance as well.

Scion is a lower DPS Berserker without survival problems, or a higher DPS Slayer without Impact or Overwhelm or unending leech. This choice also seems powerful to me.

If you desire an absolute answer from me, I would say Berserker, just because the DPS and mobility feels good. But you have to keep in mind that even I myself am not sure about this answer.

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elipei wrote:

hi!im going this build again in next league.

but i cant decide what is best way for Slayer's tree.

which is important for stun build?20% culling or unending leech?

This question is like asking, what's more important, offense or defense?

Personally I lean towards 20% culling and picking Overwhelm as well, but I also know people who are huge fans of this unending leech thing.

You can try both of them out, it's just a matter of several regret orbs(if you can't afford these in a new league maybe go for Bane of Legends and Overwhelm first).

This build is good for HC?

If I am not wrong, innervate support doesn't work with totems. Can consider using it with herald of ice or orb of storms?

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Lavandyr wrote:

This build is good for HC?

I wouldn't say it's a "good" Hardcore build, but it's definitely viable.

Personally I haven't played Hardcore too much(lvl 80ish) but I have heard from many people having success with this build in Hardcore. Just recently, I watched a friend of mine leveling past lvl 90 in AHC in just a couple of days.

However, there are 2 big problems with this build:

1. Tidebreaker and Kaom's Heart are very expensive in Hardcore.

2. This build relies on stunning, so it's rippy under bad frame rate or latency.

That being said, if you have plans to farm Uber Lab, this build has great potential for early league Uber Lab farming, which is some pretty good business in Hardcore.

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Chochalos wrote:

If I am not wrong, innervate support doesn't work with totems. Can consider using it with herald of ice or orb of storms?

Many Many thanks for point this out.

This is exactly the reason I put "This is currently only a theory-craft." at the beginning of my Scion Variant section - so that I don't feel too ashamed.

Now I need to reevaluate different choice. Orb of Storms is fine... but it's another skill and another gem slot to be used... so I don't know.