[3.10] Molten Strike Jugg (Thread restored for historical purposes)

Thank you for an amazing and cheap build. This is the first character I have ever gotten above level 51, so you may call me a noob.

Following this build, I have yet to meet a brickwall. I managed to kill 2 of the guardians very easily, namely minotaur and hydra. I pretty much oneshot mobs in t15 maps, and harbingers in t16 are the only encounters(besides the guardians) where I have to re-consider just standing in the middle of them, laughing, like a boss.

Guardians I couldn't kill, and high tier maps:
I haven't really upgraded my gear post-lvl70(besides Ming's Heart, which is frickin amazing), so that's what im looking to do now. I need to get ahold of that beautiful +40% blade flurry damage enchant. I know I can get a hold of better flasks, rings, amulet, but at least in those slots I understand the choices you've laid out for me in this thread.

Which brings me to the equipment slots I don't know what I'm going for.

NOTE: I know this is supposed to be a budget build, but I've got myself a little bit of currency now and all I want is better gear. This is why I, in some cases, compare some of the item choices I've seen in this thread to rare items.
It might be evident that rare items will be better in some slots, but I'm still fairly new so I gotta ask.



BEFORE you start reading the rest of this post, know this: I realized I was following an old version of this build. I've read every page of this thread and since found the latest version, and a bunch of tips. I have also included a summary section at the bottom of the post. You are more than welcome to just read that and give me a reply if you feel like it. The stuff in the spoilers are my trains of thought surrounding the different items.


A) Boots upgrade! Death's Door?
There is no damage and no life on these boots. I really want one or the other, or preferably both. The bleed immunity doesn't appeal to me at all. Am I looking at this wrong?



B) Belt upgrade! Belt of the Deceiver?
This belt is actually very appealing to me. Lifeloss is inevitable in the quest to upgrade your damage, but I feel there could be better belts out there in both life and maybe damage wise.
The only thing I can not find anywhere else is the reduction in damage taken on crits. Is this why you guys are using this belt? Or is it because a rare one would just cost too damn much?



C) Chestpiece upgade! Belly of the Beast vs. Carcass Jack

Before I start let me begin by saying that this is the itempiece that I have researched the least.


Belly appears to be the best defensive item. You've got life, armour, resistances.
The Carcass is obviously better for offense with the increased area damage.
Does the Carcass provide nearly the same amount of armour?
I don't know which item provides the most life, but it appears to not matter much.



SUMMARY:



Thank you all for being who you are, and for taking time out of your day to assist people using this build!

Lenghty Post you came around with.
I´ll try my best to answer as much parts of it as i can.

First off, almost all uniques are a trade off. You usually either get a unique feature (instant leech on Bleedseeker) on an item which is otherwise ok, but by far from best in slot in terms of offensive stats. BUT it is mandatory for this build to work when it comes to staying alive. We get Vaal pact, but are still able to use Life Flasks - for those of us who carry one - i only do as QoL in lab runs.
Some other uniques alot of us use are either in there for budget reason or because the offer something we would have to squeeze in elsewhere or would have to sacrifice points in the tree. Which basically comes down to jewel slots or life nodes.

So while writing this i had a look on my tree and some of the jewels i put in there quite a while ago.
While this build gets quite some resis from the tree there are no dedicated resistances only nodes like Diamond Skin.
I have one jewel with +10all resis. Leaves me with 109/110/116 while using biscos. And i have some jewels i need to upgrade :) Life with this setup is actually 6753. Only form of izario that seems to be able to 1shot me is 2H Mace with fonts and elemental essences up.

Guardians and Shaper: I am new to that content myself, guardians require some practice, Shaper seems to require alot practice and some Luck - Hello Vortex Balls spawning under my ass in Zana's bubble.

A) Death's Door.
Bleed immunity is fucking awesome. You don´t need to care for that hassle at all. Grind half minded, kill some sturdy mob you did not notice as corrupted blood, whirl to the next pack carrying 20 stacks, BOOM, dead.
Another think i started to like, not limited to Death's Door in general, is the +15 all resis. While it is not much it adds up in the end. With the uniques i carry i get an even plateau. On the chars i had/have that use alot less unqiues it was harder to balance resistances.
The 25 movement speed is also welcome, though not that important unless you went for cyclone.
Freeing up a Flask slot for an offensive flask is huge in terms of spike dps.

B) Belt of the Deceiver - can someone double check and correct me if that part is complete BS?
Again, Budget, all resis, some nice Damage, Life, Str which equals some more life.
Intimidation seems to act as a form of curse. It does not grant you damage, it takes the damage you deal to a certain enemy (after armor and resistances) and increases that damage taken by 10%.
And than there is that line: "You take 30% reduced EXTRA Damage from critical Strikes".
Well, what is a crit in poe. Your Critchance determines how often you crit, your critmulti determines how much extra damage you deal with a crit compared to your normal hit. I am not sure how high the crit multi of mobs and bosses is, but it does not seem to be awful high.
In Numbers, those are rough estimations to show conclusions. Neither do i have the exact numbers nor did i factor in diminishing returns for amour etc.:
Lets assume you have 5500 HP and the mob has a critmulti of 1,6, meaning 60% extra damage for the boss.
You get hit for most of that by a single crit, lets assume again, flat 5000 in you face (normal hit would be 3850 in that case). If you get rid of your Belt of the Deceiver, that damage 'in your face number' suddenly jumps to roughly 6150. Do you know of a Belt that offers near that much life to compensate that 650 points?
Guess you get where that is leading towards? Question here is yet another tradeoff. Do we have an item available that offers the same mitigation for crits or offers an adequate buffer for our Healthstat of choice?
Edit: When you pick the 'indomitable' node in the tree you can reduce the effects of crits even more.

C) Chestpiece.
You got the rough picture there.
First off, are you aware that the Inc Evasion/Armor/Energy Shield mods on items are local modifiers?
For Iron Reflex users Carcass and Belly are about same in mitigation numbers.
Belly offers more life, if you use alot rares with high Life rolls belly is by far superior to carcass in terms of life.
Belly has no offense though and is a bitch to color.
For high amounts of armour this the wrong build. To few nodes in the tree, no shield we use. Ask Poe-wiki about diminishing returns from armour and hugh single hits. It is next to pointless for really large phys hits. Good against alot of that small pokes from trash though :)
I only run 2 rare rings in my default setup, no stats on gloves, none on amulett. If you would go for really good astral plate with max life roll i would loose around 160 life compared to a belly. The more rare items with (high) life roll you use the more you benefit from belly.

Enough life is hard to say and depends on the content you want to run. If you run cancer maps with 2 damage modifiers, vulnerability and temp chains you end up with other numbers to "not get oneshotted"
As said before, i have 6753 life and that feels quite comfortable. If i swap my amulet in (89 Life, 24 Str) i end go to around 7150, if i had some nice spiked gloves with lots of life, str, damage and attack speed i would end up around 7500-7650 i guess.
My greatest enemy at this point is my lack of skill and knowledge/experience with certain fights. Those too get really dangerous when they join arms with their mate carelessness. Those have a drinking mate called volatile... :)
When i die in the Lab it is always to stupidity in trap passages - running alongside those fucking bladewheels is my favourite.

While you might be able to build something that does not get oneshotted in this game, this is definitive not the right build for such attempts.

Edit: Part b, added comment 'indomitable' note.

HTH.

Thank you very much for an informal and fast answer! Especially the part about crit damage mitigation made things clear for me.
I was only half-aware that inc. armour/evasion was local, I had forgotten that when I made the post. Thanks for clearing that up!

I am now convinced about belt of the deceiver. I already bought it and got it equipped. I figured I might aswell go ahead and buy me Carcass while im out shopping. For some reason I decided to buy a close to maxroll with 1 socket, and attempt to 6link it myself. I'm not sure if it'll be more/less expensive than buying a finished one..

I am still not convinced about the boots, but I think that is alright. Whatever suits ones gameplay. I haven't found bleeding to be annoying at all. However that extra flask slot is almost a necessity from what I understand..
Maybe that Bloodgrip Marble Amulet with "Moving while Bleeding doesn't cause you to take extra Damage" is enough to remove the bleed-flask?

I tend to throw maps with difficult mods straight into the trash.. Maybe I'm a bit of a wuss? You have at least taught me to not expect to be facetanking everything, not with this build.


Over to another matter, I decided to try these gloves instead of haemophilia. I am gonna miss the explosions :(
Now I know that frostwall doesnt belong there. I need someone with vorici 8 to help me get phaserun back into my CWDT!

Again, thank you!

Most people that question Death's Doors have never used them...

And I've never seen a single person who has used them, still question why they were chosen

That is why you never assume you understand how valuable in-game something is, not until you've actually experienced it first hand.

Don't ever assume something based on limited data. Test everything!

Ello girls and boys!

This I believe will be my final update/variant of the build for Harbinger league.

For those of you following the thread, you may have seen my previous posts regarding my work on a "Speed Mapper Cyclone" variant.

I am finally here to present the results and what I have personally been using for the last few weeks to map with.

So, submitted for your approval...

"Tazmanian Cyclone - Speed Mapper (upto T15)"



The variant is designed to primarily optimize two aspects:

1) Movement Speed
2) Weapon Range

As we all know movement speed is key to fast clearing. Specially for a build such as this one, relying exclusively on melee skills.

After much testing the clear winner is Cyclone. While Blade Flurry is clearly king when it comes to single target damage/boss killing, it is just not agile enough for trash clearing. So, even though my DPS output is much higher while mapping with BF, the clear speed is much slower than with the lower DPS output of Cyclone. This is just due to the fact that Cyclone can kill as you move with a couple of taps of the skill, while with BF I'm whirling to the pack, stopping, casting BF, releasing, and then moving on - a lengthy process by comparison.

BUT... Cyclone without optimization can feel quite clunky and annoying to play...

The first key to playing Cyclone is knowing that it works best by "tapping" the skill, instead of "channeling" it, like with BF. While channeling works and is easier to play, you do so at the expense of wasting time spinning when there is nothing left to kill. By "tapping" there will always be small pauses between Cyclone whirls, allowing you much more control on when you want to stop spinning and move on.

Another key to optimizing Cyclone is range. Most Cyclone builds rely on 2H weapon range, but as this build requires the pseudo-vaal pact provided by Bloodseeker, that is not an option. But several avenues to gain range as a 1H character abound, and so I incorporated several of them and thus surpassed the range of even 2H Cyclone builds:

1) Skill Gem - By purchasing a Cyclone lvl 21 I gain +4 range:


2) Scourge Replacement - I purchased ilvl 84 Imperial Claws and started crafting. What I managed to acquire is pretty much THE TEXT BOOK weapon for this build, either for Cyclone, BF or Reave. An incredibly lucky roll with Trans > Alt > Aug > Regal and then multi-crafted +2 range:


3) Amulet - I wanted to try to get as much range as I could, and because in testing the build doesn't require the dual curse DPS much while mapping (Youtube: T14 Springs Hexproof Test), I purchased this:


4) Jewel - Because I love using more uniques and I wanted even more range:


Why is weapon range important while Dual-Wielding and using Cyclone?

Because Cyclone bases it's AoE range on attack range:



Furthermore:



This means I DO take advantage of the multi-crafted weapon range, even though it is specifically bound to only one of my weapons.

Now, with range out of the way, the next thing to optimize is movement speed.

In order to achieve that, I've made several changes to gear and skills:

1) Helmet - Again, all about speed here. We want faster Cyclone and faster movement:


2) Skills - Again, speed, speed, speed. Poacher's gives us added flask charges and frenzy charges. These are additionally accumulated through Blood Rage. And well Haste just speaks for itself:


3) Flask - Because again, we want speed, and because we now have never-ending Frenzy Charges, an item most people consider total shit is utterly transformed into a thing of beauty, giving you not only a Quicksilver that lasts for a very very long time, but also a very very long lasting Onslaught (MORE SPEED!!!!), and because we are now using Poacher's for extra flask charges, it's pretty much up always! You'll want to get one with 30% speed and lowest %flask charges used:


That about covers all the changes related to optimizing Range and Speed. The remaining changes are just things that make sense or because there is little else I can change and it was a nice QoL addition:

1) This allows you to swap Haste > Hatred at bosses. If you feel this is unnecessary, and would rather just swap the gem manually from inventory, or just not use it at all, that is fine. It's not needed, I farm T15 bosses without switching to Hatred most of the time:

2) Ancestral Protector was not really benefiting in a meaningful way by the linking of Enhance+Empower, so I dumped both (I kept Protector, of course), giving me a slot to add Haste and Vengeance, which as you saw in the screenshots above, benefits from Range as Cyclone does, so a nice addition, but completely swapable for anything else you want:

I think that about covers the major changes in the variant. The PoB export below has all the details.

Also, that's was a pretty lengthy explanation! And by that I mean I'm going to take a break from the forum, and I'm probably not going to answer any of the regular questions:

"Why did you do that?
"Why didn't you do that?"
"Did you try X thing?"

Most likely the answer to all those will be either of:

"Because in testing that is what works best FOR ME!"
"Yes, I most likely already tried X thing"

So, unless I feel your comment/suggestion/question is a complete revelation; something utterly amazing I somehow missed, chances are I'm just going ignore it. If you can't figure out why I'm using Empire's an Knockback Support, tough cookies!

Here's the PoB export. I've once again used the "Item Sets" feature to create gear sets for boss killing, mapping and Uber Lab:

https://pastebin.com/0hDRHvKs

Some vids:

Youtube: T15 Colosseum Full Sextants Test 1min 30sec
Youtube: T15 Beachhead Boss 2min 40sec
Youtube: T13 Gorge 2min 20sec

That's all! I hope you enjoy it as much as I have...

Good luck monkey men! ;)


I'm out....

One last video (just recorded) of the new Tazmanian Cyclone...

A T15 Core (Boss fight), no vaal skills used and I don't even bother swapping out of Bisco's or Headhunter. I only swap Conc. in the middle of the fight, just to speed it up a bit more ;)

Enjoy!

Youtube: Tazmanian Cyclone - T15 Core (2min, Boss Fight, Not even trying)

@necrol

b)
That is not how reduced extra damage from critical hits works:
The amount of damage above a regular hit that the crit would cause, is reduced.

Default Crit Multiplier is 130%.
This means 30% extra damage from crit.
Reduce this extra damage by 30%: = 21% extra damage from crit.

So you get crit for 121% instead of 130% damage, meaning 7% damage reduction for crits.

To stay with your example:

Regular hit 3850 * 1,30 = 5005 damage from critical hit without BOTD
Regular hit 3850 * 1,21 = 4659 damage from critical hit with BOTD

346 less Damage with BOTD in this case, still very solid :)

Why do you use blasphemy poacher AND curse on hit gloves in your cyclone variant?

"

ZePample wrote:

Why do you use blasphemy poacher AND curse on hit gloves in your cyclone variant?

You have all the information you need. Read what I said about curses and then look at the PoB gear item sets in detail.

"

corosou wrote:

You have all the information you need. Read what I said about curses and then look at the PoB gear item sets in detail.

I saw the amulet on PoB, but during the videos with the build you still have that settup : without the amulet and with only 1 curse.