PvP Feedback - **GGG Balancing Ascendancy classes for PvP is a MUST before release ! - Forum

" Oh so i get it, it isn't a big deal if my firestorm can now ignore 100% of your resistances, very logical indeed. I'm actually wondering if you know what ignoring resistances means, it's not 100% increased damage, it's MORE. Okay, let's talk about math. Lvl 21 penetration support - 38%. lets say target has 75 max res, you will deal: 100-(75-38) = 63% of your tooltip damage 'ignore target resistances' mean you deal 100% of your tooltip damage 100% is 158.7% of 63% its literally 58.7% more damage compare to using penetration. Yes it isn't a big deal if 9k ehp target will die in your firestorm in 1.2 sec down from 1.8 sec Last edited by EFBBBF on Dec 10, 2015, 5:32:22 AM	Posted by EFBBBF on Dec 10, 2015, 5:30:09 AM Quote this Post
For the record of this thread i also want to mention more about the current ''OP'' build that everyone faces in PvP right now and which dominates 70% of the pvp top ranks. Explosive arrow, since you dont need to mentally try to attack players and can simply stack everything on walls or neaby objects it is very easy for them to take advantage of the 30% MORE damage as arrows travel with this skill. And i can only imagine this getting tremendously worse as these builds will be able to use this notable effectively by simply shooting on walls from a distance, people keep asking and saying how broken that skill is and how it needs adjustments, well it didnt get adjusted, it's getting buffed by a LOT. IGN:Hauntworld - ICU Omniscient PvP guild ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- PvP Low life crit caster / Gear -->/1829851 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- HLD PvP tournaments -->/1576295	Posted by hauntworld1 on Dec 10, 2015, 5:31:08 AM Quote this Post
" EFBBBF wrote: " Oh so i get it, it isn't a big deal if my firestorm can now ignore 100% of your resistances, very logical indeed. I'm actually wondering if you know what ignoring resistances means, it's not 100% increased damage, it's MORE. Okay, let's talk about math. Lvl 21 penetration support - 38%. lets say target has 75 max res, you will deal: 100-(75-38) = 63% of your tooltip damage 'ignore target resistances' mean you deal 100% of your tooltip damage 100% is 158.7% of 63% its literally 58.7% more damage compare to using penetration. Yes it isn't a big deal if 9k ehp target will die in your firestorm in 1.2 sec down from 1.8 sec As far as i know people have been saying how elemental penetration gems are a bit overpowered, yet you're trying to make me think 100% penetration is fine. I dont even want to argue with you on this anymore, i saw enough. IGN:Hauntworld - ICU Omniscient PvP guild ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- PvP Low life crit caster / Gear -->/1829851 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- HLD PvP tournaments -->/1576295 Last edited by hauntworld1 on Dec 10, 2015, 5:37:04 AM	Posted by hauntworld1 on Dec 10, 2015, 5:34:25 AM Quote this Post
" hauntworld1 wrote: " missuse wrote: Well I for one think they overdid the whole ascendancy marketing. Even if you take PVP out of the equation some ascendancy classes are way overturned for PVE. That means they will have to over-tune PVE to compensate, but how to achieve this when some ascendancy classes are defense oriented while some are DPS oriented. This will either be a game where u have to play in a group of 3+ with a tank, a support and a dps class or PVE will be trivial. I can only conclude ascendancy classes will be substantially toned down before release. Even if they are not, I welcome them as a new toy since the HLD meta is getting stale. as for viable builds, well it all depends how u define viable. Builds that can essentially compete in the top tier with others, semis are the ones that can but will struggle more. I completely agree with the PVE part of your post, but i can only conclude on the PVP side that you are willing to let pvp decrease and welcome a bunch of 1 shot fest top-tier plays, things wont be competitive at all, it will all be down to who hits the other first in order to kill. The damage potential is going to be so huge that it would make no sense to even try to stack some defense, the game of dodging and blocking will be increased and even builds like Qbot who relies on being tanky to survive and kill over time is going to be useless with those damage outputs. The meta might be stale right now but in order to have things balanced you sort of need to have a liner stale meta, it is impossible to keep things in order if it shifts dramastically like this, no one has the funds, wealth to afford to constantly adjust like this and especially people who will find their builds completely destroyed by this. Taking the mullaxul 2hsword exemple here again, he lost sword bcr cluster, god knows he isnt going to get any huge increase in dps from ascendency i highly doubt, so i can only conclude that this will only make people quit in the end and you're going to be stuck with an even worst stale meta with even less builds to play with in pvp. I actually expected you to be on my side on this, seeing as you're welcoming such metabolism is disapointing me a bit. As for GGG tuning down ascendency before release, i highly doubt. PVP is already now a 1 shot (or very fast mutlishot) fest. Who can do this from a far has the advantage over one who can't (bow, caster vs melee) and who can do this without even hitting you (EA) is on top of the food chain. This is crap. Transforming crap can produce a different kind of crap or can produce fuel for instance. If its another kind of crap then we are already used to it by now, but there's a very small chance things might improve. I don't want to judge things so far ahead, especially things that can and will change multiple times in the way they are executed before release. EDIT: The fact of the matter is that PVPers in PoE are quite delusional. PVP is just a minor aspect of the game GGG made for the hell of it, without intention of "evolving" or "balancing". Some evolving happened due to pressure of a part of community, but obviously the amount of players that participated in the PVP seasons did not compensate the effort GGG put in preparing them. Hence races have new seasons but PVP does not. We might as well accept it for what it is. 20-30 players posting in this subforum will change absolutely nothing when GGG has thousands of people hungry for new PVE content. items shop: 364086 ign: [ICU]missuse if you like to HLD, add me inactive in game atm, PM me if you need something. Last edited by missuse on Dec 10, 2015, 6:01:12 AM	Posted by missuse on Dec 10, 2015, 5:47:30 AM Quote this Post
The only way i can see Ascendency classes in pvp is by disabling it temporarily and GGG taking measures into tweaking the numbers seperalty from pve with on a beta realm, but letting things go on it's own is the worst thing to do with such changes, it's just obvious guys. It is more than obvious that such boosts cant be let on it's own like this, yes missuse the current meta is borderline 1 shot at the moment, but letting it getting worse is not what we want. It will need tweaking and balancing, but letting it get part of the live realm is going to be atrocious yet making even MORE players quit the game and pvp. I really dont think players are willing to wait again in order for GGG to fix such things, we already know how fucking long it takes for GGG to fix something as simple as a skill being too strong, i can only imagine such mecanisms taking ages for GGG to properly balance and especially when it comes to pvp. By no means i want to play in such meta while waiting for it to get balanced, people are going to get frustrated, their builds getting destroyed and you want them to wait even more ? Better quit than waiting and playing in such evironnement. GGG Has to ATLEAST do a minimum of balance, and i really hope they do so before release. IGN:Hauntworld - ICU Omniscient PvP guild ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- PvP Low life crit caster / Gear -->/1829851 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- HLD PvP tournaments -->/1576295 Last edited by hauntworld1 on Dec 10, 2015, 11:52:53 PM	Posted by hauntworld1 on Dec 10, 2015, 5:50:49 AM Quote this Post
" I dont even want to argue with you on this anymore, i saw enough. No need to argue :D especially not in that way. People still remember those flicker-acro-block 'gods of arena', 'kill my build and win 10 exa', they got nerfed and disappeared forever. Ascendancy classes are indirect nerf to your cherish build. Fear not, you will be remembered. peace Kappa Last edited by EFBBBF on Dec 10, 2015, 6:00:29 AM	Posted by EFBBBF on Dec 10, 2015, 5:54:45 AM Quote this Post
" EFBBBF wrote: " I dont even want to argue with you on this anymore, i saw enough. No need to argue :D especially not in that way. People still remember those flicker-acro-block 'gods of arena', 'kill my build and win 10 exa', they got nerfed and disappeared forever. Ascendancy classes are indirect nerf to your cherish build. Fear not, you will be remembered. peace Kappa Suposing you are reffering to my build getting indirectly nerfed with ascendency, as far as i know next patch is the BIGGEST buff i've ever recieved and is pretty BS. 100% Res pen on crit while giving me a free gem slot because i can now remove fire pen, firestorm gem buffed by 20% at lvl 20, i cant even remember a bigger buff than this in my whole poe experience. IGN:Hauntworld - ICU Omniscient PvP guild ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- PvP Low life crit caster / Gear -->/1829851 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- HLD PvP tournaments -->/1576295 Last edited by hauntworld1 on Dec 10, 2015, 6:04:19 AM	Posted by hauntworld1 on Dec 10, 2015, 6:02:56 AM Quote this Post
" missuse wrote: " hauntworld1 wrote: " missuse wrote: Well I for one think they overdid the whole ascendancy marketing. Even if you take PVP out of the equation some ascendancy classes are way overturned for PVE. That means they will have to over-tune PVE to compensate, but how to achieve this when some ascendancy classes are defense oriented while some are DPS oriented. This will either be a game where u have to play in a group of 3+ with a tank, a support and a dps class or PVE will be trivial. I can only conclude ascendancy classes will be substantially toned down before release. Even if they are not, I welcome them as a new toy since the HLD meta is getting stale. as for viable builds, well it all depends how u define viable. Builds that can essentially compete in the top tier with others, semis are the ones that can but will struggle more. I completely agree with the PVE part of your post, but i can only conclude on the PVP side that you are willing to let pvp decrease and welcome a bunch of 1 shot fest top-tier plays, things wont be competitive at all, it will all be down to who hits the other first in order to kill. The damage potential is going to be so huge that it would make no sense to even try to stack some defense, the game of dodging and blocking will be increased and even builds like Qbot who relies on being tanky to survive and kill over time is going to be useless with those damage outputs. The meta might be stale right now but in order to have things balanced you sort of need to have a liner stale meta, it is impossible to keep things in order if it shifts dramastically like this, no one has the funds, wealth to afford to constantly adjust like this and especially people who will find their builds completely destroyed by this. Taking the mullaxul 2hsword exemple here again, he lost sword bcr cluster, god knows he isnt going to get any huge increase in dps from ascendency i highly doubt, so i can only conclude that this will only make people quit in the end and you're going to be stuck with an even worst stale meta with even less builds to play with in pvp. I actually expected you to be on my side on this, seeing as you're welcoming such metabolism is disapointing me a bit. As for GGG tuning down ascendency before release, i highly doubt. PVP is already now a 1 shot (or very fast mutlishot) fest. Who can do this from a far has the advantage over one who can't (bow, caster vs melee) and who can do this without even hitting you (EA) is on top of the food chain. This is crap. Transforming crap can produce a different kind of crap or can produce fuel for instance. If its another kind of crap then we are already used to it by now, but there's a very small chance things might improve. I don't want to judge things so far ahead, especially things that can and will change multiple times in the way they are executed before release. :/ Tbh even with 100% pen on crit, It won't mean much in terms of pvp, few very players can crit in pvp (enfeeble, blind, belt and anti crit wheel) Even without those, trying to get in range to hit me is pretty hard. I don't think those Ascendancy numbers are absolute, Ggg can easily slap a pvp limiter on it. The way I see it, is that everybody gets some cool stuff :) Everybody fears change, Me included! I'd feel pretty smug, when everybody blames a class for being "broken" though!:3 Haunt aren't you a 100 witch? [Gear & Club] ¯\(°_°)/¯ #1 Professional Afk Club /2133058 [Hideout] New Oriath /2505008 [Pvp Trophy] PVP #1 EU & US EA /1591888 \| \| BM EA /1431163 [Dead] PSC La /1682118, Build BM PA /1296491, BM IG LL ST /1121092, Shop /874905 "God's in his Heaven, All's right with the world!" IGN: Libritannia Last edited by 1Tokimeki2003 on Dec 10, 2015, 6:06:32 AM	Posted by 1Tokimeki2003 on Dec 10, 2015, 6:03:43 AM Quote this Post
" EFBBBF wrote: Ascendancy classes are indirect nerf to your cherish build. Hostility towards hount is quite unwarranted. He can and will change his build to adapt to the new meta as will all who like to PVP, the only things he is talking about is that he would like more than 1-2 options. But it wont be much worse than we have now, since its: If you want to beat all on STD HLD you have 1 option, Hf. items shop: 364086 ign: [ICU]missuse if you like to HLD, add me inactive in game atm, PM me if you need something. Last edited by missuse on Dec 10, 2015, 6:16:49 AM	Posted by missuse on Dec 10, 2015, 6:07:26 AM Quote this Post
I think it's pretty normal to fear such big changes Lib, with how much whining you have seen from people saying how OP ea is and hating on you i can only see things get worst when you are receiving 30% more ea damage and even more AOE. " Haunt aren't you a 100 witch? My witch is 92, i have a 90 templar and a 90 shadow so i can easily adapt to those new classes like i want yet i dont even know what the witch ascendency class will bring. I know this sounds pretty lame my main being level 92 after 4 years, but u can judge by yourself that the only thing i did is flipping, trading, theorycrafting, respeccing and pvping. " EDIT: The fact of the matter is that PVPers in PoE are quite delusional. PVP is just a minor aspect of the game GGG made for the hell of it, without intention of "evolving" or "balancing". Some evolving happened due to pressure of a part of community, but obviously the amount of players that participated in the PVP seasons did not compensate the effort GGG put in preparing them. Hence races have new seasons but PVP does not. We might as well accept it for what it is. 20-30 players posting in this subforum will change absolutely nothing when GGG has thousands of people hungry for new PVE content. I completely agree with your above post missuse ^, but i feel better atleast trying to contribute than keeping my mouth shut, it's actually a part of the reason why pvp does not flourish, because players only post unfundamental and unconstructive feedback while having no facts to support their arguments. If everyone would put their pants and contribute i'am pretty sure GGG would have more data to work with and end up better geared in order to balance everything out. I encourage everyone again to keep posting constructive thread related posts and keep any hostility away from this thread, the main purpose of this is compiling data so GGG has atleast something to look at in order to balance in the future... IGN:Hauntworld - ICU Omniscient PvP guild ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- PvP Low life crit caster / Gear -->/1829851 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- HLD PvP tournaments -->/1576295 Last edited by hauntworld1 on Dec 10, 2015, 6:18:39 AM	Posted by hauntworld1 on Dec 10, 2015, 6:07:30 AM Quote this Post