More Forsaken Masters Information

How people have a problem with the 1500 fuse price tag is beyond me when Chris explicitly stated it's relative to the overall odds of getting a 6-link from one orb of fusing. If the odds are 1/1400 then the price of 1500 makes complete and utter sense. If you use them one by one, you might get lucky, you might not. Do it long enough and it will work out to 1 6L every 1400 fusings. If you don't want to deal with the gambling, you pay a premium to know you're getting a 6L.

People are not being punished for being casual or not having as much time or anything else, since the price is directly tied to the existing odds they're gambling with right now.

Seems really awesome. Looking forward to it.

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Ypokrator wrote:

No i am dead serious. Not everyone 24/7 and for sure i am not a bot. Need sleep , food and real life. You do it in two weeks (which is impossible), i do it in 1,5 month.

So youre complaining that you'll get a 6L half way through the 3 month leagues?

B.

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Archwizard wrote:

How people have a problem with the 1500 fuse price tag is beyond me when Chris explicitly stated it's relative to the overall odds of getting a 6-link from one orb of fusing. If the odds are 1/1400 then the price of 1500 makes complete and utter sense. If you use them one by one, you might get lucky, you might not. Do it long enough and it will work out to 1 6L every 1400 fusings. If you don't want to deal with the gambling, you pay a premium to know you're getting a 6L.

People are not being punished for being casual or not having as much time or anything else, since the price is directly tied to the existing odds they're gambling with right now.

Arch, theres a whole section of behavioural economics dedicated to this phenomina :)

its often summed up in the final stage of the gameshow 'who wants to be a millionaire' where the contestant has the option to guess at the final answer (at 50/50) for payoff of 1M or 32k, or walk with 500k.
Mathematically the payoff for guessing is (1M + 32k)/2 = 516k
the payoff for walking is 500k
thus you should guess.

Most people will walk.

There are a number of reasons (or rationales, at least) for this, but what it boils down to is an individuals own risk tolerance, or risk aversion. The average person is risk averse (in the case above this cen be quantified as a number > 16k).

So this really comes down to one thing:
How often will you 6L?

if its a lot then run fuses
if its once then just pay the vendor.

B.

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Iao wrote:

Hello Chris.

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Chris wrote:

Passive Tree Changes

The Shadow area now has a physical and an elemental section (rather than melee vs. spellcaster). This means that you don't need to decide on the attack vs. spell choice until much later in your character's development.

Groups of elemental and weapon passives for the Witch, Shadow and Ranger have been improved so that they're more impactful and on more desirable routes.

There are plenty of other tree changes that we haven't described yet. We're still iterating on the tree and making more changes. We'll be releasing more information about the tree's new layout closer to release.

Since I don't have a direct way of suggesting this to you guys anymore, I'll say it here. It seems that much of the passive skill tree changes have left generic "projectile damage" and "spell damage" nodes out in favor for damage-type specific nodes. I think this is a bad choice that prevents characters that don't focus on specific damage types, but types of damage delivery.

Pigeonholing us into a choice between damage types rather than damage delivery-types reduces build diversity. For example, there have been builds cropping up that focus on stacking projectile damage increases to amplify Added Chaos Damage. Personally I think that's very cool.

Not only do I think you should reconsider this choice but I think you should also consider the inclusion of generic "melee damage" nodes. This could provide inspiration and means for new build types and gives another way to specialize in chaos damage for say Viper Strike. And if you were to put these anywhere, wouldn't the Dexterity/Intelligence area of the tree be the best place? GGG, please let me know what you think.

On another note, opening weapon specific nodes to damage types other than physical damage would also be very interesting. For example, "increased claw damage" nodes for people focusing on using the lower tier claws with implicit life gain on hit rather than life leech. This isn't as important as the above, just something to think about.

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Chris wrote:

Skill Balance and Mana Costs

We've rebalanced many skills in 1.2.0. Some of the less-frequently used skills have received power buffs. Almost all skills have dropped in mana cost.

I don't mean to pry, but are Shield Charge, Sweep, Explosive Arrow, Viper Strike, and Summon Skeletons among the list of those changed? If not, I hope they are looked at soon.

Thanks for reading.

This is a very interesting post. I hope GGG read it.

I have to agree with the majority regarding the fusings/6L debate that I see the cost as being absolutely fine. I'm very new to end-game, and I typically get around 8 alts per dom run (so 1 fusing per 5 minutes) + whenever I make a chaos recipe (maybe every few runs) + the uniques and decent rares I pick up for trading.

It can seem pretty daunting at first because of the sheer number, but when you crunch the numbers, that's AT LEAST 10 fusings per hour; so AT MOST 150 hours of gameplay and you have a 6L.

That's with 130 IIR, 0 IIQ.

It's a game by grinding gear games. It's about grinding. It's about spending time reaching these goals. If 6L were more easily accessible, then something else would have to be introduced that's difficult to get to give the hardcore players something to grind for - and then it's a never-ending cycle because the casual players want THAT new thing too.

Great stuff!

I like the masters being able to be spawned in maps.

All I run anymore are maps, Shipyard, Shrine, Courtyard and Palace. Being able to pick up these masters tasks and level something up on the side will be a nice break from the usual speedy clears.

Can't wait!

The deterministic crafting is GFG too. Sometimes rolling on off colors is just retarded and brutal on hands. Don't want to spend an hour trying to carefully roll. This new crafting system is welcomed!

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Archwizard wrote:

How people have a problem with the 1500 fuse price tag is beyond me when Chris explicitly stated it's relative to the overall odds of getting a 6-link from one orb of fusing. If the odds are 1/1400 then the price of 1500 makes complete and utter sense. If you use them one by one, you might get lucky, you might not. Do it long enough and it will work out to 1 6L every 1400 fusings. If you don't want to deal with the gambling, you pay a premium to know you're getting a 6L.

People are not being punished for being casual or not having as much time or anything else, since the price is directly tied to the existing odds they're gambling with right now.

the reason is that it should be easier to get 6l than spending 25 exalted worth of fusing on an item, especially when you could otherwise buy an entire character with some very good items for the same price. i've played for several months, sometimes hours every day, and have yet to accumulate much more than 10 exalts worth of items. good currency is rare, and good items are incredibly rare, so basically new players will have to play for months before being able to afford a 6l item.

does it seem reasonable for the chance to get 6l to be 1/1400? how long does it take to find 1400 fusing orbs? to find 1400x4 jeweller's orbs and vendor them? 1400x4x2 alts? it seems only fair that either the master's fusing cost be a significant benefit, or the chances of getting 6l should be improved. if the master's fusing cost would be less than the chances of 6l'ing, it should require some very challenging quests that require full parties using teamwork. otherwise it would go greatly appreciated by many if the chances were in the players favor rather than randomnesses favor. a 1/1400 chance to 6l makes players rely on random luck and great wealth. tabula rasa is a great item to help poor people get their 6l, yet it lacks so many attributes that other armors can provide, and basically no single support gem can make up for the loss of armor/eva/es/life/res and the other great mods armor can provide.

i'm not complaining about GGG's decisions, but if they made the game favor the poor rather than favor the rich, new players wouldn't feel so far behind the rest of the rich veterans. there are many good ways to help new players. increasing the chances of finding currency, the chances of finding items worth using (honestly, high level maps give almost as many vanilla items as normal questing maps), and by improving the items available at vendors. masters selling good and unique items will be a great help, but it's much more fun to find good items while playing.

while it is something to consider that good items being rare makes finding them that much more fun, currency find-rates and relative values have gotten rather odd. exalteds are incredibly rare, yet it costs somewhere around 150 exalteds to buy a mirror of kalandra. so to make a copy of an item costs about 150x more than most items cost. also, chaos orbs are very rare, but you have to find or trade for 30-33 to be able to afford an exalted, and while they grant the benefit of adding a stat to any rare item, the price make it so that primarily wealthy players can afford to do so.

in summary, it would be nice if the game were balanced so that new and poor players would have better chances of acquiring and improving good items.

thanks GGG