The 3 easiest Div factories all have 1 thing in common

"

Pathological#1188 wrote:

Most scams in existence rely on inept or lazy end-users, that doesn't make them not scams. The fact that the game makes you mouseover items does not make it less of a scam.

If scams didn't work, people wouldn't scam. If scams led to bans, people wouldn't scam. If GGG said "no scamming" tomorrow, the practice would be dead in the water tomorrow. At that exact point onward, every trade that came from the website could be immediately checked against the trade that took place.

The singular reason GGG allows scamming is because they would have to pay someone to follow up on the reports, and it's easier to let the community continue blaming victims like in this thread.

I have never, ever been scammed in PoE, and I can still say with complete certainty that there is zero reason for scamming to exist in PoE. It is a bad choice to allow it.

Now try to think rationally and lets play out your scenario where GGG bans people for clicking "accept trade".

You're saying that you agree the trade window prevents scams and so scammers rely on lazy/inept people in order to scam (your own words), i.e. people who don't bother reading and just click accept blindly.

So, lets say you get "scammed" in this way and you report the other guy.
GGG bans him.

Ok, what happens when someone exits a map with a full inventory to do a trade and accidentally ctrl-clicks the wrong wand into the trade window and the other user clicks accept without reading because he's lazy.

Neither of these 2 ppl are deceptive scammers, but suddenly, maybe a minute later the guy who got the wrong wand, realizes it when equipping it and then reports the other guy for trade scamming.

?

This is a very real scenario that literally happens and how should GGG prove when someone DECEPTIVELY tries to trade the wrong item, vs someone making a legit mistake?

And what level of responsibility should fall on the guy for accepting the wrong trade without reading the item HE wanted to buy?

Oh ok, see? this is why GGG has very normal and adult rules...
Rules that say, you are responsible for checking items in trade when you buy something and click "accept trade" ... and if you don't bother doing that and you end up with a fake item, the fault lies not in the system, but in YOU.

i wonder why governments require motorcyclists to wear helmets and fine those who dont wear them.

surely motorcyclists are adults that can make conscious decisions to check things properly and never ever make mistakes in their lives.

but i ll guess i ll never know. people should be responsible for their mistakes. who needs safeguards amirite?

:D

1. Run breach
2. Run breach with a build that clears the screen
3. Run breach with a build that clears the screen and has IIR

"

exsea#1724 wrote:

i wonder why governments require motorcyclists to wear helmets and fine those who dont wear them.

surely motorcyclists are adults that can make conscious decisions to check things properly and never ever make mistakes in their lives.

but i ll guess i ll never know. people should be responsible for their mistakes. who needs safeguards amirite?

:D

litagation, and possible stain on taxpayer (the governments money) when they dont pay their hospital bills. It's not out of some moral imperative or concern for people.

The only bad thing that can possibly happen to GGG is losing potential money the person might have spent if getting scammed leads them to quitting the game forever, which is unlikely.

"

BossOfThisGym#2062 wrote:

"

exsea#1724 wrote:

i wonder why governments require motorcyclists to wear helmets and fine those who dont wear them.

surely motorcyclists are adults that can make conscious decisions to check things properly and never ever make mistakes in their lives.

but i ll guess i ll never know. people should be responsible for their mistakes. who needs safeguards amirite?

:D

litagation, and possible stain on taxpayer (the governments money) when they dont pay their hospital bills. It's not out of some moral imperative or concern for people.

The only bad thing that can possibly happen to GGG is losing potential money the person might have spent if getting scammed leads them to quitting the game forever, which is unlikely.

maybe for the old players yes. old players grew with poe and got hooked as they played for years.

ggg put so much hard work and effort into making poe2 accessible its weird that they would introduce a reason for players to rage quit.

if they just solved it, it would shut people like me up and everyone else that shares the same sentiment for that matter. which also "reduces strain on taxpayers" since ggg doesnt need to deal with players ragequitting or posting about them getting scammed.

so in a way its similar where its not necessarily out of moral imperative. but as of concern for people? ggg should be more concerned as more happy players can be converted to more happy payers.

"

AintCare#6513 wrote:

"

exsea#1724 wrote:

i wonder why governments require motorcyclists to wear helmets and fine those who dont wear them.

surely motorcyclists are adults that can make conscious decisions to check things properly and never ever make mistakes in their lives.

but i ll guess i ll never know. people should be responsible for their mistakes. who needs safeguards amirite?

:D

most of such regulations are just PR/liability protections/or sources of income for the government unfortunately. ever wondered why a 'chopper helmet' is ok even tho its a literal metal can? and they don't even check certs on most helmets? that shit is on you, together with a proper jacket

depends on government i guess. in my country a lot of things need to be certified by the government.

but i do agree, sometimes things are just PR and out of "to make things easy".

i m pro weed but my local gov classified weed as a drug similar to hard drugs such as heroin or cocaine. you can hang for carrying large amounts of weed.

"

AintCare#6513 wrote:

"

exsea#1724 wrote:

depends on government i guess. in my country a lot of things need to be certified by the government.

but i do agree, sometimes things are just PR and out of "to make things easy".

i m pro weed but my local gov classified weed as a drug similar to hard drugs such as heroin or cocaine. you can hang for carrying large amounts of weed.

edit- i think i know where you from and im a bit jealous lol

thats good i know few countries check certs for most things, and have pretty robust legal systems. but most others are for show and sell illusion of safety to some extent. also in my country weed is ok but there is a good amount of scientific data showing its harmful for ppl under 25, so there is that

if you say jealous then i think ure thinking of my neighbour. lol
i m from the malaysia. good food cheap lifestyle but poor currency exchange and if you're not "local local" you have a lot of "hard caps".

most non "local locals" in my country aspire to migrate to our neighbour.

"

exsea#1724 wrote:

"

Tumulten#3988 wrote:

1. Dupers/exploiters get banned.

2. How can you even scam on the currency exchange? It tells you value of stuff and even if you where to accidentally list it for wrong price there's no way for a scammer to guarantee he will be the one to buy it.

3. If you get scammed that way its your own fault

1. agreed
2. agreed
3. look at the victim blamer lol.

its 2025 and we still have people blaming scam victims

Overlooking currency being swapped during a trade with divine is clearly worth being blamed for .

"

AintCare#6513 wrote:

"

exsea#1724 wrote:

if you say jealous then i think ure thinking of my neighbour. lol
i m from the malaysia. good food cheap lifestyle but poor currency exchange and if you're not "local local" you have a lot of "hard caps".

most non "local locals" in my country aspire to migrate to our neighbour.

ah you are correct, didn't expect that answer lol. in that case i'm surprised about the regulations for road safety being so diligent.

they dont really check tbh. most officers just care about you wearing a helmet.

heck in malaysia you're supposed to get a roughly 60USD fine for smoking in eateries but after the first few months ZERO enforcement.

"

oestergreen#1184 wrote:

"

Pathological#1188 wrote:

Most scams in existence rely on inept or lazy end-users, that doesn't make them not scams. The fact that the game makes you mouseover items does not make it less of a scam.

If scams didn't work, people wouldn't scam. If scams led to bans, people wouldn't scam. If GGG said "no scamming" tomorrow, the practice would be dead in the water tomorrow. At that exact point onward, every trade that came from the website could be immediately checked against the trade that took place.

The singular reason GGG allows scamming is because they would have to pay someone to follow up on the reports, and it's easier to let the community continue blaming victims like in this thread.

I have never, ever been scammed in PoE, and I can still say with complete certainty that there is zero reason for scamming to exist in PoE. It is a bad choice to allow it.

Now try to think rationally and lets play out your scenario where GGG bans people for clicking "accept trade".

You're saying that you agree the trade window prevents scams and so scammers rely on lazy/inept people in order to scam (your own words), i.e. people who don't bother reading and just click accept blindly.

So, lets say you get "scammed" in this way and you report the other guy.
GGG bans him.

Ok, what happens when someone exits a map with a full inventory to do a trade and accidentally ctrl-clicks the wrong wand into the trade window and the other user clicks accept without reading because he's lazy.

Neither of these 2 ppl are deceptive scammers, but suddenly, maybe a minute later the guy who got the wrong wand, realizes it when equipping it and then reports the other guy for trade scamming.

?

Require the reporting party to attempt to contact the other party first and wait 24 hours before actioning. Freeze reported currency to account on report so it cannot be traded away before resolution. Restrict number of reports to 1 per (day/week/month) to avoid exploitation.

"

This is a very real scenario that literally happens and how should GGG prove when someone DECEPTIVELY tries to trade the wrong item, vs someone making a legit mistake?

As per above; if someone refuses to clarify or resolve the reported trade, it becomes actionable.

"

And what level of responsibility should fall on the guy for accepting the wrong trade without reading the item HE wanted to buy?

None; the system should be automated so that you get specifically what you buy at the price the seller lists it for. This is the only reason scams can exist at all.

"

Oh ok, see? this is why GGG has very normal and adult rules...
Rules that say, you are responsible for checking items in trade when you buy something and click "accept trade" ... and if you don't bother doing that and you end up with a fake item, the fault lies not in the system, but in YOU.

Normal adult rules that are specifically protected against in real life, because people fail all the time and shouldn't lose their life savings as a result when someone else decides to exploit it.

Scams take advantage of human psychology, and they work. As I said; the MAJORITY of scams rely on the victim willingly giving away their property to a bad actor by failing to do appropriate checks and balances, and they are still protected by law. The idea that you should just "not get scammed" is demonstrably nonsensical and entirely ignores reality. There will never be a time that people don't fall for scams; the only way to combat them is to ban them, put measures in place that forcibly stop them (that don't rely on human error not happening, because it does), and action accounts that partake in them.