Nameless Seer Prevents Player Agency

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roundishcap wrote:

I mean I did like 1000 maps before I burned out mostly t16 with 250 quant. No seer. Ever.

Might as well delete him. Too rare.

You must have a broken copy of POE then. Seen him plenty and I dont even think I have ran 1k maps

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Mashgesture wrote:

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roundishcap wrote:

I mean I did like 1000 maps before I burned out mostly t16 with 250 quant. No seer. Ever.

Might as well delete him. Too rare.

You must have a broken copy of POE then. Seen him plenty and I dont even think I have ran 1k maps

Nameless seer comes and goes, I've gone days without seeing him.
Useless Theory: Unless there is a single server controlling his spawn rate, early in the league when there are hundreds and thousands of people running maps, he appeared often, every couple of days.
But now that server population has sunk, maybe he's not spawning as much... but still spawns, unless you are unlucky.

But that's like saying I play every league and never seen a mageblood or i've never had a mirror drop... that's just statistics.

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Mashgesture wrote:

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roundishcap wrote:

I mean I did like 1000 maps before I burned out mostly t16 with 250 quant. No seer. Ever.

Might as well delete him. Too rare.

You must have a broken copy of POE then. Seen him plenty and I dont even think I have ran 1k maps

Yeah, I find it REALLY hard to believe that someone could run 100 maps without seeing him, let alone 1000 maps. The Seer isn't that rare, and the RNG here isn't so crazy that bad streaks like this should be possible. I suspect some people are just failing to notice him when they are zooming.

Anyhow, maybe I've just been lucky this whole league... I think I've made 6 scry links on the atlas this league, and it never took me more than 30 maps to find him.

Anyhow; to say that the Seer "prevents player agency" is just objectively wrong. He gives players MORE choices than before. Sure, you actually have to GRIND to be given that choice, but it's still more agency than before.

Now... Should it be itemized? I don't know. If they made it itemized, would there actually be a point in having different cards drop from different maps? Wouldn't it just be easier to apply divination cards directly to maps? To make the House of Mirror card drop from Strand, you would actually have to USE a House of Mirror card on the map.

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Phrazz wrote:

Wouldn't it just be easier to apply divination cards directly to maps? To make the House of Mirror card drop from Strand, you would actually have to USE a House of Mirror card on the map.

This is a neat idea. Makes a lot more sense than the Nameless Seer version we have now. PLUS it would naturally come with the "downside" of rebalancing the drop rate against the card you are forcing onto a new map (which is a good thing) since you add an additional card into the drop rates. Trading access for rate. And while you can add ANY combination of cards in this scenario, it would naturally have steep rolloff for reliability once you throw on that 3rd/4th card on further dilute the pool in that map.

Ive met him couple times but honestly dunno what he does and how it works.

Im just an ape in cpu factory.

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jsuslak313 wrote:

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Phrazz wrote:

Wouldn't it just be easier to apply divination cards directly to maps? To make the House of Mirror card drop from Strand, you would actually have to USE a House of Mirror card on the map.

This is a neat idea. Makes a lot more sense than the Nameless Seer version we have now. PLUS it would naturally come with the "downside" of rebalancing the drop rate against the card you are forcing onto a new map (which is a good thing) since you add an additional card into the drop rates. Trading access for rate. And while you can add ANY combination of cards in this scenario, it would naturally have steep rolloff for reliability once you throw on that 3rd/4th card on further dilute the pool in that map.

+1, love this idea!

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Toforto wrote:

+1 Seer scrying option should be itemized, its such backwards design that you have to do a map with a bad layout and possibly an annoying map boss to find this rng npc and theeen you get to have fun in the game. Took me 2 days of non-stop grinding and probably over 100 burial chambers, had to keep swapping to Grotto cus I kept running out of burial chambers even with all the map drop nodes allocated somehow just to get him to spawn once so I can scry Brother's Gift onto Mesa(and that card dropped in burial chambers before I found nameless seer so that's just hilarious). It's also super unclear exactly what kind of monsters can spawn him, feels like strongboxes for example don't help at all.

We are playing the same game, right? The one made by GRINDING gear games.

1. The whole point is to let you have the option to run whatever map you want. Have you already forgotten the old days, of last month, when you were stuck running whatever map the div cards you wanted was attached to?

2. It is an optional, and marginal, benefit. You don't HAVE to scry anything. With the lower drop rates, there isnt even that much of a change to your profitsby skipping it, unless ofc you are specifically target farming div cards (which is not a great idea anyway these days)

3. Despite the above [excellent] points, please continue QQing. We all know salt fuels the RNG engines.

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TRPV1 wrote:

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jsuslak313 wrote:

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Phrazz wrote:

Wouldn't it just be easier to apply divination cards directly to maps? To make the House of Mirror card drop from Strand, you would actually have to USE a House of Mirror card on the map.

This is a neat idea. Makes a lot more sense than the Nameless Seer version we have now. PLUS it would naturally come with the "downside" of rebalancing the drop rate against the card you are forcing onto a new map (which is a good thing) since you add an additional card into the drop rates. Trading access for rate. And while you can add ANY combination of cards in this scenario, it would naturally have steep rolloff for reliability once you throw on that 3rd/4th card on further dilute the pool in that map.

+1, love this idea!

-1,

1. The current mechanic is awesome
2. Forcing you to use up a valuable resource to use the system does a few things, all negative IMO.

a) Forces a bias towards more common value drops.
Example: currently, based on value/drop rates, mageblood and nimis cards just barely beat out the cards that reward raw divine. Result, players have multiple valid near-optimal options. IF you had to factor in the initial cost of scry, and that cost is the card being farmed, it would take a huge number of maps run to make scrying any jackpot cards worth it. Result, everyone would just scry the most common divine rewards card. Farming The Fortunate may be effective, but its so boring. #PingsThatSing

b) If you take the above into account, and adjust drop rates to mitigate, then you instead are just contributing to the streamer/power-player wealth snowball effect. Example: Week 1, only the lucky and try hard players can obtain a jackpot div card. They scry that card and farm more of those cards. By week 2-3 when others start to show up to the party, the rich are already richer and the value has dropped on the card.


GGG, as usual, has already figured out and implemented a clever and seemingly balanced solution to this, with the nameless seer scry.

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Piousqd wrote:

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Toforto wrote:

+1 Seer scrying option should be itemized, its such backwards design that you have to do a map with a bad layout and possibly an annoying map boss to find this rng npc and theeen you get to have fun in the game. Took me 2 days of non-stop grinding and probably over 100 burial chambers, had to keep swapping to Grotto cus I kept running out of burial chambers even with all the map drop nodes allocated somehow just to get him to spawn once so I can scry Brother's Gift onto Mesa(and that card dropped in burial chambers before I found nameless seer so that's just hilarious). It's also super unclear exactly what kind of monsters can spawn him, feels like strongboxes for example don't help at all.

We are playing the same game, right? The one made by GRINDING gear games.

1. The whole point is to let you have the option to run whatever map you want. Have you already forgotten the old days, of last month, when you were stuck running whatever map the div cards you wanted was attached to?

2. It is an optional, and marginal, benefit. You don't HAVE to scry anything. With the lower drop rates, there isnt even that much of a change to your profitsby skipping it, unless ofc you are specifically target farming div cards (which is not a great idea anyway these days)

3. Despite the above [excellent] points, please continue QQing. We all know salt fuels the RNG engines.

Lol that doesn't mean this game should have pointlessly long and boring grinds. Also I only ever farmed cemetery for the 5 div card so I never had to run a bad map. And it ain't optional to a lot of people, it just feels nice to have the cards you want in your favorite map. Fact is Nameless Seer needs to be itemized, or like drop a scrying orb or something that just lets you scry any map to any map when you find him.

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Toforto wrote:

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Piousqd wrote:

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Toforto wrote:

+1 Seer scrying option should be itemized, its such backwards design that you have to do a map with a bad layout and possibly an annoying map boss to find this rng npc and theeen you get to have fun in the game. Took me 2 days of non-stop grinding and probably over 100 burial chambers, had to keep swapping to Grotto cus I kept running out of burial chambers even with all the map drop nodes allocated somehow just to get him to spawn once so I can scry Brother's Gift onto Mesa(and that card dropped in burial chambers before I found nameless seer so that's just hilarious). It's also super unclear exactly what kind of monsters can spawn him, feels like strongboxes for example don't help at all.

We are playing the same game, right? The one made by GRINDING gear games.

1. The whole point is to let you have the option to run whatever map you want. Have you already forgotten the old days, of last month, when you were stuck running whatever map the div cards you wanted was attached to?

2. It is an optional, and marginal, benefit. You don't HAVE to scry anything. With the lower drop rates, there isnt even that much of a change to your profitsby skipping it, unless ofc you are specifically target farming div cards (which is not a great idea anyway these days)

3. Despite the above [excellent] points, please continue QQing. We all know salt fuels the RNG engines.

Lol that doesn't mean this game should have pointlessly long and boring grinds. Also I only ever farmed cemetery for the 5 div card so I never had to run a bad map. And it ain't optional to a lot of people, it just feels nice to have the cards you want in your favorite map. Fact is Nameless Seer needs to be itemized, or like drop a scrying orb or something that just lets you scry any map to any map when you find him.

Grinding is part of the games core design.
Grinding by definition is long.
You don't have to farm that card, or any card. It is 100% optional, for everyone.
It does feel nice to have your favorite cards on the favorite map, you should thank GGG for giving you that option, with the Seer.