Why is nobody asking for Detonate Dead to be nerfed ?!

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DarthSki44 wrote:

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Bleu42 wrote:

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cadust wrote:

If the skill is too strong and the game lacks challenge, don't use the skill.
There's no point in nerfing the skill just because YOU think it doesn't appeal to YOUR preference

Because like it or not, even when you're playing single player, competition is part of arpgs. Overtuned skills that trivialize the hardest content cheapen the accomplishment for everyone else.

If you disagree that's fine, but nearly every single arpg developer agrees. That's why they nerf things even in single player.

While competition exists, it's a small subset of players. The random dude playing RF in Chicago doesn't care that another rando in Boston playing TS with friends is making nore Div per hour. That's just a false narrative. Unless you are intentionally searching out grievances, or like playing the victim, this just isn't a thing.

So this is much more of a nuanced topic. When I say 'competition' like I did, I don't mean directly. Most players play solo, they aren't in 'direct' competition. But they ARE in a type of competition, it's just not direct, but it IS there.

Take GGG's stance on not increasing drop rates for SSF. I think they feel the same about what I'm talking about because they themselves said that increasing drop rates, even if it's for a completely solo mode, devalues those same exact drops for people in trade. Why is that? Because rare items don't just feel good to find, it ALSO feels good because you know other players *haven't* found it, and they WANT to find it. Same goes for beating a hard boss. Part of that competition I'm talking about comes into play when you beat that boss, knowing that there's other players who haven't but they want to.

You can find this in quite nearly every other game. Why DID it feel good to walk around Ironforge in WoW with your Thunderfury? Because you were showing off to all the other players who didn't have it, and wanted it. Even though it made zero actual impact on them that someone else from another guild that they never interacted with had a special item, it DID have an impact; it was competition.

It's not a 'false narrative' as you put it. It's part of being human. We're always in competition with others in some form, even when the subject has zero actual impact on us. PoE is no different.

simple its actually not that crazy (its an OP HC skill that gives 6-8million dmg whith minimal passive investment allowing much better defensive investment) and it requires 2 buttons.

So no one in SC trade gives a fuck. This is the same narrative as Seismic trap whenever .01% of players were actually using it.

They hear Ben complain they pretend to be expert HC racers and start parroting Ben.

Same deal as Boneshatter which is actually pretty ass as a bosser. QUin bitches that "number bigger than other skills" and eventually all the parroting will get Boneshatter nerfed and we'll have 2 melee skills that are remotely worth bothering with instead of 3 (LS and MS being the two)

They've heard expert HC players complain that they feel "forced to play it" because of bigger number in PoB and (in the case of mostly people who are not Ben) "pretend competition" that POE players all indulge in every 3 months where we all pretend there's some urgency or advantage to be gleened by anyone but a handful of .001%'ers.

This same annoying cycle continues no matter what, when the best skills are barely able to kill an Uber in 20 minutes we'll be complaining about the one that does it in 19 minutes being OP.

Meanwhile 80% of them are fully incapable outside of trade league which turns the game into "play only the meta builds"

and the "Game of Moloch" race to the bottom continues until someone at GGG wakes up and hits the brakes and starts using some objective metrics to balance skills.

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Senju_Hyoketsu wrote:

People still thinking softcore trade is a PvE game and one shouldn't care about what others play...

An economy trade league is PvP by definition. You compete for currency, resources and items in a capitalistic environment. You fight with and through your purchasing power.

People are choosing to play the best builds (DD for example) early on in order to gain an advantage over others. And an advantage you have.

So by not balancing the game, specific skills and builds have huge advantages... when the game is supposed to have 260 skills, yet check poeninja and see the 20% of DD

Wake up.

(and don't bring up other games modes, when 95% of people play softcore trade)

while you are right in reality DD is not even top 5 skill ppl use, and 3 out of top 5 used skills last league did get nerfed(boneshatter, srs, tornado shot)

What would be the point? DD is good starter, yes but its not something people are thrilled to play or something really op. If they nerfed it people would just move to another thing like explosive trap or EA champion, if they nerfed those you would just swap in DD for VD and have the same playstyle. If they nerfed all starters you would be here complaining that there is no good starter build and everything feels like ass to play. As good as DD is its not in a spot requiring a nerf.

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Aynix wrote:

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Senju_Hyoketsu wrote:

An economy trade league is PvP by definition. You compete for currency, resources and items in a capitalistic environment. You fight with and through your purchasing power.

The thing is, reasources are endless. SOmeone else dropping 10 divines doesnt mean tyhat now you cannot get those 10 divines. Thats why it will never be "PvP' as real world economy.

Someone dropping 10 divines means he's buying the item you need before you and you will pay your item more because of that or not at all.

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TorsteinTheFallen wrote:

Someone dropping 10 divines means he's buying the item you need before you and you will pay your item more because of that or not at all.

League is 4 months, there is no rush. Wait a day, get 1 div more and buy the item. Wait a week and it will be cheaper most likely. Its not competition, you dont have to get to finish line asap.

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kuciol wrote:

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TorsteinTheFallen wrote:

Someone dropping 10 divines means he's buying the item you need before you and you will pay your item more because of that or not at all.

League is 4 months, there is no rush. Wait a day, get 1 div more and buy the item. Wait a week and it will be cheaper most likely. Its not competition, you dont have to get to finish line asap.

Wait a day price went up 20%... You don't want to wait one month to be able to progress with your char.
It's a race either you're willing to acknowledge it or not, it's there.

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kuciol wrote:

What would be the point? DD is good starter, yes but its not something people are thrilled to play or something really op. If they nerfed it people would just move to another thing like explosive trap or EA champion, if they nerfed those you would just swap in DD for VD and have the same playstyle. If they nerfed all starters you would be here complaining that there is no good starter build and everything feels like ass to play. As good as DD is its not in a spot requiring a nerf.

RF says hi.

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TorsteinTheFallen wrote:

Wait a day price went up 20%... You don't want to wait one month to be able to progress with your char.
It's a race either you're willing to acknowledge it or not, it's there.

More like dropped by 50%. Meta uniques are insanely expensive during first few days when everyone wants then and there are abrely any on the market. Few days and they are dirt cheap.

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Aynix wrote:

RF says hi.

RF is different because its the most uninteractive skill there is. GGG doesnt like killing by walking. Same reason cyclone and perma minions got gutted. DD is not so much better than other starters and its hotkey intesive build.