What happened?

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kuciol wrote:

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Aynix wrote:

No, they would not. Some vocal minority would, some people will always hate but that doesnt rly count. Thats just ur assumptions based on a situation that never happened. I dont follow Ubisoft (nor any AAA studio tbh) but from what I know they never made "small scale game". They are well known for same thong as almost every AAA studio nowadays - releasing copy paste bugged, unfinished games and charging full price for it.
Same situation with Diablo 2 - those people who say that Diablo 2 is still great game are vocal minority that usually didnt play the game for past 10 years or more and just remember it being good when they played it last time.

Every D2 resurrected topic on any forums begs to differ. Poeple recommend it instead of D3 and D4, and thats not issolated issue when the game for today is lacking in every aspect.

I dont deny that games are a lot of times bugged as hell , unfinished etc but my point is THEY ALWAYS WERE. We just tend to remember the good ones. Games in old days had even less of everything and players are just blinded by nostalgia.

My point is not that in old days games were not bugged. My point is that AAA games are bugged garbage while indie/AA games are better than ever.
As for the D2 Ressurected situation. Its the vocal minority who will praise D2 as greatest game of times no matter what. And you know what? They still bought D3, D4 and they still will buy Diablo 5, even if it will be worse than Diablo 4 was. They will buy the game, play it and complain that it isnt Diablo 2.

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Aynix wrote:

My point is not that in old days games were not bugged. My point is that AAA games are bugged garbage while indie/AA games are better than ever.
As for the D2 Ressurected situation. Its the vocal minority who will praise D2 as greatest game of times no matter what. And you know what? They still bought D3, D4 and they still will buy Diablo 5, even if it will be worse than Diablo 4 was. They will buy the game, play it and complain that it isnt Diablo 2.

Indie games are also bugged, in the old days games were bugged as hell. Even Tetris had bugs. Games became more complex so there is more bugs, its just that simple. They were also always cashgrabs, go check any aeria games, gameforge or webzen game. Hell Aeria even had event around spending money every 2 weeks called tiered spender where last tier was at 100k $ (yes it not a typo). Name 1 game that was free of bugs, even game breaking ones. I cant but well i started playing only when i got my amiga 600. And guess what? Even those games had bugs, lesser , bigger but always some.

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kuciol wrote:

We just tend to remember the good ones. Games in old days had even less of everything and players are just blinded by nostalgia.

I don't think so. You could spend a lot more time in older games than new games. Finishing them took longer than the pretty short new released garbage, and even a second or third playthrough was more thrilling while new games get straight up uninstalled after one playthrough. A couple of days me and my friends talked about Total Warhammer for some reason and all including myself think that 2 is better than 3. Most of the community thinks the same way but we all just play 3 cause of the larger multiplayer options and not because the game changed into something better.
If you look across the board a lot of people prefer older games over the new junk, look at D4 lot's of folks is just unhappy with it.
Pretty much every new game these days is just a rushed product with heavy lack of content, but lot's of paid dlc's to add missing essentials or content for a hefty price on top of the already chunky basegame price.
Like BG3 was the only good game release for quite a while now but I guess that's mostly cause
Larian Studios is one of the very few remaining game devs with the interest to put game and content quality over profit min-maxing.

Look at wow, people are more into the classic version rather than the cheap budget rushed new dlc.
Lot's of people liked the older FFXIV versions more cause they are unhappy with the changes made in the last two dlc's. Game pretty much turned into mostly a "VR" chat cause people have no interest in the watered down classes, or crafting. They play the story content, take a look in the less offered content and jump back into character emote touching in the main towns or housing area.

Same with like every other mmorpg, back in the days you had plenty of content to even sit down for an entire day if you wanted to. You had enough dungeons, raids, side content, crafting or just pvp in open world or battle grounds to fill your time with.
Even multiple gearing choices for whatever you desired to play around with.
You had your consistent large version patches with plenty of new stuff and the smaller patches in the time between big patches.

Nowadays you get 2-3h of stuff in mmorpgs with barely any side stuff or pvp at all. Stuff like crafting, gathering, pvp bg's or meaningful gear progression don't exist. Instead you get a really cheap gear upgrade system, if even that, and a lot of stuff in the cashshop to skyrocket your progression instantly.

But honestly it's not that hard to tell that you never touched any of the good games during the golden days to actually realize that games offered a lot more, and better content years ago for just half or even less of nowadays prices.

The only improvement over the years is the graphic of games, but a fancy looking game is still going to be nothing but trash if it simply lacks basic essential.

You are just wrong. Its YOU who doesnt play new games. Retail WoW has a lot more players than Classic, D3 and 4 have a lot more players than D2 and so on. You have exceptions to this like in everything but by the most part new things are better when compared 1 to 1 to the old stuff. Try playing something that was considered good 20 years ago but something that you never played you will know what i mean. The problem is within the players not games by the most part. Newer games dont have anything you havent done in some way in other games so you compare them to not how it trully is but how you felt about it 10-15-20 years ago.

Yea i dint touch games during old days because i dont agree with you, good argument you got there. I played super frog when it came out, earth worm jim, sacrifice , gothic, daggerfall, half of the worms series, boulder dash, need for speed, tibia, mu online. Those were deffinitely not made in the so called "golden days".

Oh I do play a lot of the new games with some exceptions and I do regret that I wasted my money on pretty much most of them. A extra fine dinner at a restaurant would have been a better choice over a new released game lol

It's just lacking content if you don't get the same amount of playtime out of a new game compared to older games. I don't have to really delve deep into a one by one comparison to actually see and feel the less content. A simple comparison of the playtime is more than enough to realize how deeply watered down games are these days. It just gets worse once you start to compare the amount of content you had in older games vs what new games offer. Or if you look at how simplified most stuff is these days, no depths, no flavour, no nothing.


Even the new PayDay is just yikes, not to mention all the server issues and unfixed bugs coming with it. I was lucky enough to get a refund on this shit and my friends went back to play some PD2 instead of the newest one lol.

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kuciol wrote:

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Aynix wrote:

My point is not that in old days games were not bugged. My point is that AAA games are bugged garbage while indie/AA games are better than ever.
As for the D2 Ressurected situation. Its the vocal minority who will praise D2 as greatest game of times no matter what. And you know what? They still bought D3, D4 and they still will buy Diablo 5, even if it will be worse than Diablo 4 was. They will buy the game, play it and complain that it isnt Diablo 2.

Indie games are also bugged,

Maybe those you buy, I dont buy garbage. For past 10 years I play pretty much only indie/"small" games when not playing PoE and they were always peak quality, even if it was early acess" they already were better quality than AAA games on release.

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Pashid wrote:

I don't think so. You could spend a lot more time in older games than new games. Finishing them took longer than the pretty short new released garbage, and even a second or third playthrough was more thrilling while new games get straight up uninstalled after one playthrough.

You are just plainly wrong. If you look at garbage, you will find garbage. There are indie games that I bought and played for hundreds or even thousands hours.
Just to give you few examples: ARK Survival Evolved, have around 2k hours in it. Soulstone Survivors closing to 700h in it. Hollow Knight played it for around 200h. And there is so much more games that I bought for 5-10$ and spent 50-100h on it. Stop looking at mainstream games and maybe you will realize there is entire gaming market with great games out there.

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Aynix wrote:

You are just plainly wrong. If you look at garbage, you will find garbage. There are indie games that I bought and played for hundreds or even thousands hours.
Just to give you few examples: ARK Survival Evolved, have around 2k hours in it. Soulstone Survivors closing to 700h in it. Hollow Knight played it for around 200h. And there is so much more games that I bought for 5-10$ and spent 50-100h on it. Stop looking at mainstream games and maybe you will realize there is entire gaming market with great games out there.

Non of the games you've listed was released during the last few years tho.
In fact ark is almost a decade old and the latest "relevant" dlc expansion is also 2 years ago. Not to mention that the game started out pretty great but really degraded more and more over each expansion. Like wtf just look at Genesis. On paper nice for the lore but Gen1 was somewhat okay to play but Gen2 was just terrible game play wise. All the free maps past Gen2 are okay, but also not great, which is kinda sad since 90% of the work is made by the community and the last 10% of wildcards work didn't really polished up the maps either. The game used to be a lot better during and before Aberration. Extinction was pretty alright, minus all the bugs that never got fixed at all. It's still fun to play these days but just thanks to mods, but these are pure community effort and nothing we can thank the game devs for. And yes that's the opinion of someone with about 8k hours in it.

I don't say that every game is entirely garbage these days, but they simply for sure can't really compete with the quality of older games. 10 bucks for 50-100h is not a bad deal, but considering the fact that you could spend way more hours in older games without the need to move over to a different game makes it quite different tbh.
I've played a few indie games myself and had some fun with them. But it's still nice to have a good game for a good price which is simply able to hook you up for a longer time and not just for a week or two depending on how much you play.
That's what I used to like about the old mmorpgs simply cause they kept you busy for months and you always had something todo. That's what I liked about ark, it kept you busy for a damn long time. that's what I kinda still like about PoE, a league doesn't really last that long but ti still gives you a fare amount of hours in every league to enjoy, or to work towards something on a "long term".
That's simply something most games lack these days, they don't have the itch of long term, or simply lack the content or story to keep you busy for more than just a couple of hundred hours.
Older games always felt really fun to replay while some of the newer games already get quite boring after the first playthrough.

I mean you sure had your fun with your 50-100h in your games, but you pretty sure would have liked to see more of the games to enjoy a couple more hours of whatever you've played.

You can't really compare indie games with larger games because they do have different budgets, knowledge and the amount of devs, but the sad fact is that pretty much most of the game companies turned their business into money min-maxing. And sadly most indie games are nothing but a pure money grab as well. They show off a great start but start to ditch their game as soon as enough money gets in via early access, and so on.
Best examples are Valheim, Frozen flames and many more.
Frozen flames no idea as they seem to at least put a bit of something in ever here and there, just really slowly which is quite questionable giving that they have somewhat of a good budget to work with.
Valheim made a freaking tons of money and never used it for the game. Instead they turned the game into "maintenance" mode and patch in some random nonsense instead of using the money they've earned to improve their pretty solid base.
And most other games are good, but they are simply really short and lack content cause nobody ever really had any interest to invest the earned money to improve a solid game even more.

Go look at destiny 2 and gw2. They were paid games. Now they are free and even gave free expansions with prime loot.

Dude, Soulstone Survuivors is from last year. And lets not pretend like you are talking about last few years. You are listing ONLY MAINSTREAM GAMES and thats your problem. Stop looking at trash mainstream games thinking its only games that exists. You are looking at the worst of the worst and complaining that there are no good games.
You are going to a restaurant with dog poop and rotten food because its popular meanwhile there are 10 restaurants out there with great food that you dont notice.
Stop following trends. Stop listening to streamers/critics what game you should to play. You know why mainstream games are garbage? Because gamers have no self respect and game devs know about it. Why would they waste money and time to make great game when they get more profit from making some random, half assed, unfinished, rushed piece of garbage? (if you consider time + money investment vs money earned)
Thats exactly why AAA games will get only worse and indie/small games will get better.