[3.15] Eye of Winter ES/LL Self-Cast Occultist

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Tombreaver wrote:

Also since flat damage adds to each shard, i guess we should stack as muc has possible? maybe even replace hatred with wrath? we dont scale too much %cold anyways

We still do like 99% Cold Damage with a little help from the Chaos damage on Gloves. Hatred stand alone is heaps better than Wrath...plus don't forget about Watcher's Eye. Hatred has some bonkers affixes on Watcher's Eye.

Boy, does Unleash make things feel wacky... I swear, it feels like I do less damage, but that could just be RNG screwing me over on crit rolls.

o.O

Unleash is what makes the whole build do such tremendous damage. Not quite sure why you're feeling the opposite

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arkon9944 wrote:

o.O

Unleash is what makes the whole build do such tremendous damage. Not quite sure why you're feeling the opposite

Well, of the 100 times I've cast it on packs, I swear that only 20 of those times it felt like anything hit. Again, I could just be getting screwed by RNG, lag or whatnot, but without it or even with Spell Echo, things feel more accurate.

Maybe I need the ring to make things Chain to feel better. Who knows. Guess I'll give it another go once I hit 68.

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DarkenX wrote:

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arkon9944 wrote:

o.O

Unleash is what makes the whole build do such tremendous damage. Not quite sure why you're feeling the opposite

Well, of the 100 times I've cast it on packs, I swear that only 20 of those times it felt like anything hit. Again, I could just be getting screwed by RNG, lag or whatnot, but without it or even with Spell Echo, things feel more accurate.

Maybe I need the ring to make things Chain to feel better. Who knows. Guess I'll give it another go once I hit 68.

Very strange. Spell Echo does 90% with both EoWs. Unleash with just one extra does 100% + 80% (roughly) which is the same damage. If you cast with more than 1 Unleash seal it's WAY more damage than echo.

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arkon9944 wrote:

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DarkenX wrote:

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arkon9944 wrote:

o.O

Unleash is what makes the whole build do such tremendous damage. Not quite sure why you're feeling the opposite

Well, of the 100 times I've cast it on packs, I swear that only 20 of those times it felt like anything hit. Again, I could just be getting screwed by RNG, lag or whatnot, but without it or even with Spell Echo, things feel more accurate.

Maybe I need the ring to make things Chain to feel better. Who knows. Guess I'll give it another go once I hit 68.

Very strange. Spell Echo does 90% with both EoWs. Unleash with just one extra does 100% + 80% (roughly) which is the same damage. If you cast with more than 1 Unleash seal it's WAY more damage than echo.

It's not about damage, but the fact that it seems like none of the projectiles are hitting anything when I Unleash. I don't know why, but I died several times in a row to a basic mob pack I was kiting around with it, and again to an Expedition mob pack.

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DarkenX wrote:

Well, of the 100 times I've cast it on packs, I swear that only 20 of those times it felt like anything hit. Again, I could just be getting screwed by RNG, lag or whatnot, but without it or even with Spell Echo, things feel more accurate.

Maybe I need the ring to make things Chain to feel better. Who knows. Guess I'll give it another go once I hit 68.

Very strange. Spell Echo does 90% with both EoWs. Unleash with just one extra does 100% + 80% (roughly) which is the same damage. If you cast with more than 1 Unleash seal it's WAY more damage than echo.

It's not about damage, but the fact that it seems like none of the projectiles are hitting anything when I Unleash. I don't know why, but I died several times in a row to a basic mob pack I was kiting around with it, and again to an Expedition mob pack.

I'm not gonna lie. I haven't tried Spell Echo on this skill in about a week from before I had some crazy gear. I just threw a level 1 Spell Echo instead of Unleash and I kinda like it lol.

I might do some science, respec a bit and buy a crazy expensive large cluster jewel and see how I like it. With a low level Spell Echo the boss damage was most certainly lower than Unleash, but I wonder how much that has to do with the gem being low level and having the wrong large cluster for it.

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DarkenX wrote:

It's not about damage, but the fact that it seems like none of the projectiles are hitting anything when I Unleash. I don't know why, but I died several times in a row to a basic mob pack I was kiting around with it, and again to an Expedition mob pack.

Would you care making your profile public? i could take a look at your gear/setup.

I used unleash since the leveling and it felt pretty good from there. Did oyu take the unleash nodes on the tree?
Also, you say you struggle with epxpedition mobs; but you have to consider what mods you put on them.
Sometimes getting mobs with a lot of spell block/dodge can make them impossible to hit, and its not unleash's fault

I hit up PoB during the downtime to do all the theorycrafting.

Unleash out performs Spell Echo by about 15% more damage overall.

What I did so you know...

I replaced the Unleash gloves with gloves that are listed for 7ex which are nearly perfect for using the Spell Echo version.

I replaced the Unleash Large Cluster Jewel with a Cold Damage Large Cluster Jewel which goes for about 20-25ex.

I also respeced the points out of Thunderous Salvo and put them into Nimbleness.

So in the end you would end up spending this to change the build to Spell Echo.

30c Dodre's Malevolence Gloves to 5-7ex Fingerless Silk Gloves with up to +50% inc damage against chilled enemies.

A 2-3ex Seal Mender large cluster for a Cold Damage Cluster which is worth 20-25ex.

And Awakened Unleash which is about 2ex for a 7ex Awakened Spell Echo.

A total difference of 5ex for Unleash to 35ex+ for Spell Echo, only to lose about 15% overall damage.

I will admit I ran a few t14-16 maps after you mentioned Spell Echo and here is how things 'felt' for me. Clearing regular trash felt a bit faster using Spell Echo, but the Expedition mechanic felt worse. The boss damage was severely lower also. Again, this was NOT using the changes listed above, but even with all that gear I don't feel like that gap would close.

So if your goal is to just speed farm maps and not really worry about killing the big bosses, going spell echo is probably going to feel better. But when it comes to smashing the big baddies, I don't think you can replace Unleash.

EDIT: There are also 2 other things to take into consideration. Spell Echo is a mana hog and will run into no mana very easily.

And more importantly, something which cannot be measured in PoB. Spell Echo only does it's damage if you stand still and become a machine gun turret. Unleash GAINS power while you take a moment to avoid damage, then cast a spell.

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Tombreaver wrote:

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DarkenX wrote:

It's not about damage, but the fact that it seems like none of the projectiles are hitting anything when I Unleash. I don't know why, but I died several times in a row to a basic mob pack I was kiting around with it, and again to an Expedition mob pack.

Would you care making your profile public? i could take a look at your gear/setup.

I used unleash since the leveling and it felt pretty good from there. Did oyu take the unleash nodes on the tree?
Also, you say you struggle with epxpedition mobs; but you have to consider what mods you put on them.
Sometimes getting mobs with a lot of spell block/dodge can make them impossible to hit, and its not unleash's fault

If it's not, I have no clue what to do on that front. And yes, I do have the Unleash nodes. I'm still in Act 4 and can't seem to land much on regular mobs nor bosses. I swear I had to have thrown hundreds of EoWs at Malachai before I got past his first phase alone...

I don't know what you guys did or are doing, but for me, Unleash is like shooting buckshot at a gnat. It should hit with all the times I fire it, but it just isn't likely to on my end. I may just give up on both gems, if this keeps up. Find something to replace it with, increased crit chance or something of the sort.

This league has been terrible to me, thus far into it, so nothing surprises me anymore.