Breach and Legacy as Core Game Mechanics

Do you have noticed that PoE is becoming a very unstable game? I mean, not unstable technically, but in its concept. For those who played PoE since its beggining we are seeing constant modifications that impact original concepts. Of course, changes are needed, but I think we are seeing changes that probably will not be permanent in any point or any league, unstable changes, test changes, never permanent! Almost all builds must be changed to be playable at these days in new leagues for starter chars!

Imagine the impact caused by the ES nerfs in 3.x.x!

They are constantly making changes that are dramatic and every time a league patch is made cause a grande expectation and the question: My current build will work in a new league with a starter char?

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Augusten wrote:

the problem with Zana old system, from my experience i never used it because it's way too f******* expensive (sorry for the language but that's what i feek about it). same thing i'm not trading, Solo Self found means that i don't have tons of Chaos Orbs to waste on so many things. this game tends to push to consumme that currency for anything, change an item, use Chaos, change a map, use chaos, use Zana, use chaos?, 4 of them? seriously? when trading, you end up with tons of Chaos (hundreds easily, a thousand sometimes).

Yes and no. Since you mentioned SSF, yes, I agree, completely. Far too expensive. But then again so are other aspects of end-game.

But in terms of non-SSF, no, it's not expensive. I blow 4c easy for each tier 14 or 15 map I run now at end-game in Legacy. I've probably blown through 300 chaos so far on just mapping. But then again I earn that chaos in trading. Ancient reliq keys earn 100-120c, and every time I see a trial I run it to earn 12 chisel or 6 chaos. And that's not mentioning the other items I turn over quickly on a regular basis, from leaguestones to high tier, 8-mod maps. You need currency sinks in the game, and right now some of those sinks still payout big time. So no, it's not expensive, even for a filthy casual like me. ;-)

This.
To add my thoughts, I'm sad about the lagacy stones not making their way into the core game, but I sort of understand it.
I'm more sad about not keeping Reliquary keys, as I haven't found a single one yet and I was looking forward to it. The RNG must be silly, I have found 2 exalts during the league so far...
And as for Breach, I'm quite happy it will be even easier for me to not engage with those. That league was for me maybe the 2nd worst. I honestly think its mechanic is dull: just click to kill everything without any thinking and hope your dps is high enough in order to not be overhelmed. And the breach uniques, needless to say, most of them are not that good without the upgrade, which is not accessible for an average player. Also, I found two of them (IIRC) during the whole league, the same ones...

A little sad that the legacy stones won't have any effect after the league, I haven't been able to play much at all this league due to real life matters but friends and guildies were saving me up leaguestones to be able to experience the league after it ended.


Keeping them out of maps would be fine, but restricting them in general makes the entire thing a wash in my opinion. And no other league has ever been totally useless after it was over.


Keys aside, I've been here a long time, those hold zero value for me as I have a ton of the legacy items already even many of the alt art legacy items.

I'm okay with Breach because Idc about it much, but the stones not working really sucks GGG, hopefully you realize that and start to understand established players don't give a flying fk about you providing "less options" to a casual or a starter. IDC about them or their experience, I have supported since day 1 wtf about my experience? Or is my money and input not good enough for you guys anymore?

I still fail to see how breach is "Intrusive" in any way. It is optional to open one, unlike beyond. If you are playing HC, great now your character wont die at the start it'll die at lvl 65+... oh wait, how is that better? Lowering it to 10% and making it only appear at maps, while it means new players wont die so fast at the start, it also means they wont know what it even IS until they reach maps at which point they probably wont be prepared for one either way.

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Zom3ie666 wrote:

[...] but for legacy i'm just disappointed.

i really enjoyed that mod. overall the leaguestone micro-management is not that overwhelming, when i see Zizaran and Ziggyd complaining about that i'd like to remind everybody that those guys give the feedback of people playing POE 8hours a day almost everyday. i'm not sure that they reflect the average player.
i've got a job, a family, i play at night and weekend and when i have time to play i like to be able to push the game mechanism toward what i enjoy most : i love prophecy and perdandus, especially on Solo Self Found mode, a little boost of chance with loot box etc... customizing the game makes it really enjoyable.

the problem with Zana old system, from my experience i never used it because it's way too f******* expensive (sorry for the language but that's what i feek about it). same thing i'm not trading, Solo Self found means that i don't have tons of Chaos Orbs to waste on so many things. this game tends to push to consumme that currency for anything, change an item, use Chaos, change a map, use chaos, use Zana, use chaos?, 4 of them? seriously?

Yep, exactly my thoughts. With leaguestones there's a great possibility to customize the game as you want it. For every player who loves Perandus there's someone who swears on Talisman, or prefers the Beyond experience whenever possible. And I just don't know why should it be gated behind a several chaos orbs fee per map, not to mention the fact that only a couple of Zana "league mods" have been traditionally available to choose from. It's just such a great idea - to be able to customize the game based on the content you find most enjoyable, without having to sacrifice significant amount of extra currency - that it makes me sad you're basically abandoning the chance to implement it.

I think it's quite evident that players who don't have the time to no-life PoE everyday tend to be disappointed, because they feel this was an option to get more from the game, especially in terms of diversity, while players who game several hours a day tend to have a different viewpoint, because a) most of them have enjoyed the past league mechanics thoroughly and b) they're more eager to see totally new content. I'm generalizing of course, but that's the impression I've got from reading posts and talkings with friends ingame. This being said, I honestly don't know why you're making many aspects of the game more "casual gamers" friendly, and at the same time refuse to grant more players access to what the game has to offer.

As for the potential cons, I don't think it will lure people away from temporary leagues, because these provide an extra incentive of fresh economy, new starting line for everyone, and brand new mechanics. And when it comes to leagustones being overwhelming, well, nobody says they can't be adjusted, and I'm actually omitting the fact that the more complex the game is and the more it has to offer, the more interesting it seems (at least to me). Anyway, thanks and gl with 3.0 .)

no leaguestones? YOU FUCKING SUCK

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Zom3ie666 wrote:

HI guys

Dear GGG

cool for breach, i agree with your choice.

but for legacy i'm just disappointed.

i really enjoyed that mod. overall the leaguestone micro-management is not that overwhelming, when i see Zizaran and Ziggyd complaining about that i'd like to remind everybody that those guys give the feedback of people playing POE 8hours a day almost everyday. i'm not sure that they reflect the average player.
i've got a job, a family, i play at night and weekend and when i have time to play i like to be able to push the game mechanism toward what i enjoy most : i love prophecy and perdandus, especially on Solo Self Found mode, a little boost of chance with loot box etc... customizing the game makes it really enjoyable.

the problem with Zana old system, from my experience i never used it because it's way too f******* expensive (sorry for the language but that's what i feek about it). same thing i'm not trading, Solo Self found means that i don't have tons of Chaos Orbs to waste on so many things. this game tends to push to consumme that currency for anything, change an item, use Chaos, change a map, use chaos, use Zana, use chaos?, 4 of them? seriously? when trading, you end up with tons of Chaos (hundreds easily, a thousand sometimes).

Adding one mod to one map for 4 chaos orbs vs being able to add up to 3 differents mods for a legacystone, i'm sorry it's not faire trade at all, not even close.
why not using another currency for once ? you add one mod, it can't cost "that" much for no result garantee at all.

you just removing one aspect of the customization, and removing the fun of it.

it's just my feeling about your choice GGG. i would like you to reconsider backing up to Zana old version, i love legacy as it is.

thanks for the game.

subscribing to this ...
GGG what is happening? i actually feel sorry i spent so much money supporting you. Built up my expectations regarding legacy leaguestones for standard league, since i'm not making a living like ziggyd and others by playing your game. Why the fuc.k would i care he's tired playing 25 hours out of 24/day and he grows tired or bored, and have to suffer because 0.00000000001% complain that they get tired because of so many stones? Most of us have a life and would like to enjoy the game on our own pace considering we supported you also, just like your favourite streamers who promote your game. Start listening to your comunity, not just to your top advertisers and streamers.

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arkolyno wrote:

GGG what is happening? i actually feel sorry i spent so much money supporting you. Built up my expectations regarding legacy leaguestones for standard league, since i'm not making a living like ziggyd and others by playing your game. Why the fuc.k would i care he's tired playing 25 hours out of 24/day and he grows tired or bored, and have to suffer because 0.00000000001% complain that they get tired because of so many stones? Most of us have a life and would like to enjoy the game on our own pace considering we supported you also, just like your favourite streamers who promote your game. Start listening to your comunity, not just to your top advertisers and streamers.

The problem is, you're a small fraction of the community as a whole, so when you claim GGG isn't listening to the community, what you really mean to say is that they're not listening to the 1% (pick any number to represent the complainers) like you. I'm in the other 1% (again pick any number) who are enjoying PoE and the changes. The bulk of people are either not vocal (ie: content) or don't feel strongly enough to argue about it either way (ie: again, content). Sure, there are some changes that piss me off too, but overall GGG is doing something right considering its success so far. So please, stop trying to pretend like you speak for the whole community.

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cipher_nemo wrote:

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Augusten wrote:

the problem with Zana old system, from my experience i never used it because it's way too f******* expensive (sorry for the language but that's what i feek about it). same thing i'm not trading, Solo Self found means that i don't have tons of Chaos Orbs to waste on so many things. this game tends to push to consumme that currency for anything, change an item, use Chaos, change a map, use chaos, use Zana, use chaos?, 4 of them? seriously? when trading, you end up with tons of Chaos (hundreds easily, a thousand sometimes).

Yes and no. Since you mentioned SSF, yes, I agree, completely. Far too expensive. But then again so are other aspects of end-game.

But in terms of non-SSF, no, it's not expensive. I blow 4c easy for each tier 14 or 15 map I run now at end-game in Legacy. I've probably blown through 300 chaos so far on just mapping. But then again I earn that chaos in trading. Ancient reliq keys earn 100-120c, and every time I see a trial I run it to earn 12 chisel or 6 chaos. And that's not mentioning the other items I turn over quickly on a regular basis, from leaguestones to high tier, 8-mod maps. You need currency sinks in the game, and right now some of those sinks still payout big time. So no, it's not expensive, even for a filthy casual like me. ;-)

So do you think it is ok to spend 4c on Tier 1 map? I assume you wouldnt do that. Zana being soft locked out of most map content is just dumb in my opinion.

Zana needs rework, at least with its prices.