Pvp Tier list

25% life don t mean shit in this meta tho and Like icedeal said GS build get multiplicated damages from each new jewels.

Keep in mind such ranged build if for wealthy people probably using kaom legacy too.

14 jewel vs 12 jewel:


980 increased vs 720 increased.

260 increased damage vs 25% life?

i'd go for %260 increased.

Well with all the 2.4 nerfs it's finally confirmed, EVERYONE is going secondary damages. Now that's something no one was expecting...

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IceDeal wrote:

Well with all the 2.4 nerfs it's finally confirmed, EVERYONE is going secondary damages. Now that's something no one was expecting...

It's a consequence of block/dodge/regen being too prominent.

It kills options.

Remove those factors and suddenly you can use other skills again.

It's actually the opposite, remove secondary damages and suddenly those defenses options become relevant. We already have efficient tools to deal with them but for sur it's easier to bypass those entirely and slam another more multiplier on your links instead of BCR.

Secondary damages are just boring brute force damages that you can't play around (making fights one shot fests). I wouldn't mind if it was melee only but as we know the best one are ranged wich make it even more stupid. It is a massive flaw in this game pvp system an has been my number one complain since years.

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IceDeal wrote:

It's actually the opposite, remove secondary damages and suddenly those defenses options become relevant. We already have efficient tools to deal with them but for sur it's easier to bypass those entirely and slam another more multiplier on your links instead of BCR.

Secondary damages are just boring brute force damages that you can't play around (making fights one shot fests). I wouldn't mind if it was melee only but as we know the best one are ranged wich make it even more stupid. It is a massive flaw in this game pvp system an has been my number one complain since years.

I completely disagree.

If BCR was the only way to bypass block, then numerous skills would simply be unable to kill block/regen tanks. They'd be all over the place and only the 1-2 shot skills (without secondary like flameblast for example) would be viable.

No one should get to sit there and tank damage indefinitely.

I guess it's more a regen issue than block tho. That and heavy flask use make metas stale and boring.

Life regen is the least of anyone's concerns. It literally doesn't do shit in 9:10 circumstances.

-Aegis + block = problem

-Es recharge for instant full ES if you don't engage them within like 1-2seconds = problem but it's ok in non troll build situations.

-Zerphi's is a problem, this isn't "life regen" it's basically health flask on roids.

-Pathfinder is a problem, because while that side of the tree already has amazing anti PvP passives i.e dodges/status avoidance/evasion/flask nodes. You now get even my powerful synergy with all of the above + full status immunity,unlimited flasks and paired with unique flasks max block+max dodge+max healing potential. If you put a pecking bird near your 12345 keys and let it just automatically wobble back and forth healing. You'd go pretty far in PvP especially if you don't actually use a skill and just auto detonate shit from your anus.

It's true PvP is in a better place today then it was a few weeks ago. GGG has yet to properly deal with secondary damage (it should be 1/2 or even 1/4 what it is now compared to the initial hit). So we're still left with Pathfinder (potato mode PvP) and Explosive Arrow no aim required wall spammage ( huuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuur ). I knew at 50% buff + it's existing PvP damage buff that Fireball would be a problem. Leave it to people to use it as mostly an aoe overlap skill instead of something else. Always have to have that instant kill power in this game, rarely does anyone even try to achieve a more solid build. It's all about those 14 spectrum's and being off the screen. What's xx% life when you get 900% dmg you say...ya that right there says the meta is fucked.

aoe secondary damage cant be blocked in game. EA deals more damage than any mirrored item set can offer with only few damage investment. totally ridiculous, totally downgrading fact about pvp.

fireball's secondary cant also be blocked. there are even more skills but i cant recall their names rigt now.

in short, all aoe secondary damage forms should be blockable, dodgeable.(if they are attack based they can be evadable and dodgable)

this is the most important thing that has to be fixed at the moment.

BCR has to be white gem. (we already suggested this many times)

Yes at one point early on I was on the same page with BCR being a white gem. If you think about it from a balance perspective though, it's good that its green. It leaves a green socket in most peoples 6links, green gems generally suck. This is keeping the damage potential down on a lot of builds and that's a good thing.

I don't feel everything should be block/dodge-able. There's builds in this game that can't comfortable do either. It would just be a buff for the already strong builds in the game abusing Rumi's, using a shield or that are basically right next to Acrobatics. The real answer is to completely reduce secondary damage output by a significant amount. Why should it do as much or more then the initial hit? 25% of the initial hit would still make it viable because of the stack-ability of most of these skills, just not as abusive.

There was that rumored change pre 2.4 where each additional arrow did like 33% or something. That could apply to any multi projectile be it caster,bow or melee and I think it would pan out well. Unlike most people bitching I do know melee is viable in the right hands. If you completely crap on everything else it'll be path of melee, so something like this has to apply to melee as well.

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Rupenus wrote:

aoe secondary damage cant be blocked in game. EA deals more damage than any mirrored item set can offer with only few damage investment. totally ridiculous, totally downgrading fact about pvp.

fireball's secondary cant also be blocked. there are even more skills but i cant recall their names rigt now.

in short, all aoe secondary damage forms should be blockable, dodgeable.(if they are attack based they can be evadable and dodgable)

this is the most important thing that has to be fixed at the moment.

BCR has to be white gem. (we already suggested this many times)

The rule basically applies to projectiles that explode. EA, FB, KB, Arctic Breath, etc.

Then you've got LA and whatever the rule is for stuff like bear trap.


@Mulla; Making a shit damage, shit AoE, block pen fire ball isn't gonna yield much of a build. You're throwing away all its current potential to fit an idea of what PvP should be like while everything else is still out there. And then that fireballer can't deal with shit.


@Rup: The only way I could agree with all damage being dodgable/blockable is if the only way to heal up in PvP was through leech. Otherwise it's just gonna be a shit fest of high ass life pools with life flasks or twice as high ES pools with retarded regen. Everyone stacking block/dodge and most spells being garbage/unusable.