Cleave

"

Vipermagi wrote:

...I don't get it? Why is it a downside that the only AoE increase for any AoE skill is a downside specifically for Cleave?
(also, you worded that somewhat poorly, since you flat-out stated you could only use AoE/Conc :P )

Ground Slam also has 70% Damage Effectiveness and that's not a problem either.

GroundSlam has an arguably slightly larger area of effect. It can also stun.

The only supposed advantage of Cleave is meant to be that it takes both weapons into account with a 40% penalty. Something I find really crappy in comparison to a possible permastun.
To be on par with other attacks of the type, it needs either a slightly less penalty for dual wielding, a larger AoE or some additional effect.

As for the gems, I referred only to the fact that given Cleave's range is inferior to other melee counterparts and that Cleave has to actually compensate with gems what Ground Slam and other AoE's has roughly for free *with* additional effects.

The other part that it's only those gems that can help - this is some less Cleave issue, more of a melee skills vs ranged skills issue, that ranged skills can use chain/pierce/multiple projectiles/lesser projectiles/fork/AoE/Conc, while melee's can use only AoE/Conc to boost their AoE potential. Don't even get me started on spell totems and ranged totems. No melee counterpart here either.

"

VictorDoom wrote:

i got to about 220k dps on diamond last ladder with this skill, id say its pretty good :)

I would like to know how you achieved that.

"

Unacceptable wrote:

"

VictorDoom wrote:

i got to about 220k dps on diamond last ladder with this skill, id say its pretty good :)

I would like to know how you achieved that.

http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/55044

that is the full build, i used very high of elemental damage gear, and invested points in it on the tree, very fast attack speed, high critical multiplier and diamond flasks.

This video is at around 80-100k dps on flask, doing double vaal:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BMqWlYDxm8Q&feature=youtu.be
(you can see the gear in this video, i hover my mouse over it)

aand a screenshot too from CB:http://i.imgur.com/Q0Gtp.jpg
you can find more of them as the dps progressed through the thread.

this is on of the reasons diamond flasks are out of the game.
but even without flask i achieved around ~45-50k on cleave

Just a note or question rather. It's been brought up a few times through out this post but maybe not so plainly.

You can cleave with a sword 1-handed with a shield. You can cleave Dual Weilding and you get a dmg penalty, and rightfully so.

And I understand that you can't cleave with a dagger...after all it so short. lol

But while dual wielding a dagger/sword combo what is stopping you from preforming the cleave with only the sword and not getting the DW penalty? Instead of the current model of if you have a dagger you cannot preform the skill period. Why isn't it considered a 1-handed cleave?

Why can't a special case be made?

Has cleave changed with this patch? Or just the animation of the duelist with cleave?
I think the skill looks weird now, with a little pause between every attack.
I don't remember exactly how many attacks per second I had before the patch, but I seem to remember that I had more. Has it even become slower?

Or am I just imagining things?

"

golem09 wrote:

Has cleave changed with this patch? Or just the animation of the duelist with cleave?
I think the skill looks weird now, with a little pause between every attack.
I don't remember exactly how many attacks per second I had before the patch, but I seem to remember that I had more. Has it even become slower?

Or am I just imagining things?

I noticed the same thing, thought I was crazy.

The new Duelist animation looks worse in my opinion. Looks like cleaving with one weapon when dual wielding. Also makes discerning the hitbox even harder. I've always had a hard time figuring out just where cleave hits as it seems to not hit too close to the character but also WAY outside of the animation's range. This new animation exacerbates the problem.

I can't really put my finger on it, but my enjoyment of using Cleave as my main attack has suffered. It doesn't look as fun anymore.
With 3.35 attacks per second it sometimes even looked like the cleave was going back and forth, now there is always that akward pause inbetween, that makes it choppy.

The templar animation on dual wield cleave is even more horrible.. psoted about it quite some time ago.. no response..

liked the old one better, now my duelist attacks with only one weapon when i cleave while dual wielding.