ELE LIGHTNING STRIKE - ALL T16s, Shaper, Uber Atziri, HOGM, Chayula, Elder
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Nice build continue the good work men !
But now i have a question.. we can use a mace with this build or just axe's ? |
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Probably going to give it a shot at Hardcore now.
Might make a few adjustments because the low Life really bothers me when looking at the skilltree. Running Shrine Piety with 2500 HP definitely is something I wouldnt do. Would be nice to know how often you actually died in endgame maps (you can also PM me the figure if you want). I am talking about hard rolled 73+ maps, mostly with Vuln + Increased Damage + Added Elemental Damage because thats one of my biggest concerns that when you get hit you die, no matter whether or not its just 1 out of 1000 hits. | |
" Yes! I have only taken a few axe nodes in the end game since I use Soul Taker axe, however apart from that the whole tree is focused on general melee physical damage and attack speed nodes - as such you can use sword, axe, mace, dagger, etc. as you like! If you want to get even further damage from the mace/dagger/sword - you may want to put a few points into the mace/dagger/sword damage clusters around duelist/shadow. Last edited by Ceryneian on Sep 8, 2013, 1:08:44 PM
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" nynyny - thank you for considering the build, please let me know how you like it. I have tried to demonstrate how strong survivability on this build is, and hope people can think outside the box and approach the game from a different perspective. About this low life issue (this has come up a lot in discussion). Yes it is a bit low, but the purposes of this build is to avoid damage (not tank damage), and then rapidly regenerate. If you are avoiding damage - you only need a large enough life pool to survive the occasional hit that gets through. If you are tanking damage - yes you need a high life pool. But this is not a tank build. I have been running on 2.6K - 3K health throughout the endgame. As you can see from the videos - this is enough health to survive consecutive bursts of extremely high damage - 2x Vaal's laser, 2x EK bursts, etc. Of course the more health, the better - but if you are focused on avoiding damage you only need to worry about: i) having enough health to survive a high hit that gets through, and ii) quickly getting back to full health If you are playing Hardcore, I doubt you will ever need to do a map with 2x unique bosses and other extremely hard mods, much less solo. However I have done these to show the strength of the build. I will give an honest summary of how this character has evolved, and where I died/faced difficulty as it would benefit everyone. TLDR: I have probably died 3 times in end game (level 66 - 87) by being careless in group play or being unprepared for how dangerous Vulnerability can be. Evolution of Character: - I had liked the concept of LeMing's Witch Dominatrix build - it scales very well (Dominating Blow means your minion damage is always as strong as the map itself) and has high block which also scaled well - as it is a fixed % that does not change with level/damage, etc. I realized block would synergize very well with evasion and dodge - since they are all focused on avoiding damage. I also realized that the best way to make an effective character was to have one that scales very well throughout levels, and also scales against damage - I started off with Aimlessgun's Ranger dagger build - this was a new evasion melee Ranger build and I gave it a try. Survivability through evasion was surprisingly good, however my DPS and crit chance were too high and I was killing myself on reflect, I also had issues against spells and was not using any spell block (only spell dodge). I dialed back the DPS and removed all crit from my build and switched to axe weapons. Reflect was no longer an issue. - Once I could wear Bringer of Rain - survivability went to a whole different level because of the Blind. I breezed from level 66 to level ~77 very quickly doing maps and Lunaris runs. At this point - I had extremely strong survivability against any physical damage - I was rarely getting hit. The hits that came through, I could absorb on my life pool. Honestly, I think I died maybe once by being careless in group play - I liked Block a lot, and began incorporating more into the build on the tree. Around level 77 I also began experimenting more with spell block. Before I was using evasion shoes with life and Eye of Chayula and Atziri's mirror. I usually swapped to Saffell's to do high spell damage bosses like Kuduku and Temple Piety. Spell block gave me incredible survivability against spell bosses and I had no issues with them, however I could not block regular attacks using Saffell's so I immediately began trying to incorporate more spell block into my regular build. I dropped Chayula and began using Stone of Lazhwar, I dropped my evasion shoes and began using Rainbowstrides. My spell block was then around 53% as it is in the main guide - At this point the mechanics of the build became almost complete, survivability was extremely strong against both spells and physical attacks - I had high evasion/dodge/max block and high spell dodge and spell block. I was pretty much immune to projectiles, hardly took any physical / spell damage. I don't remember dying once from level 77 to 86, and I quickly leveled - The only mod I had difficulty with was Vulnerability - it was dangerous because I was using Lazhwar instead of Chayula. If I got surrounded by a lot of mobs on a Vulnerability map - I would be block recovering/stun recovering a lot and would nearly die since I could not leech while block/stun recovering. So I was extra careful on these types of maps and used Enfeeble a lot to lower monster accuracy and damage - At this point I began stressing the build to see how far I could take it and did several very hard maps. The build scales very well as evasion/dodge/block are fixed % based to negate all damage - so I could do 2x unique bosses as easily as 1x unique boss - as long as my life pool could absorb the rare case of 2 consecutive hits from both bosses of high burst damage. Again I had no issues except for Vulnerability maps where I became more cautious. This is when I completed several hard maps solo which were all handled very well. I had difficulty on the 2x Vaal maps and 2x Weaver maps, the videos of which I posted. I avoided a lot of damage but still managed to survive all their high burst that got through my defenses. I realized that with higher spell block - Vaal and the Weaver would be a lot easier - I leveled to 87 and began trying to maximizing my spell block while keeping my max regular block. I took off Atziri's and used Rathpith's Globe. I took off Rainbowstrides and Meginord's and began using Sin Trek and a different belt to help with my int. and res requirement. My DPS dropped a little as a result - I then managed to get hold of two level 77 maps and I posted the videos - this was the first time I had set foot in a level 77 map, however I was confident in the build and wanted to test it on the highest maps possible. I did 2x unique bosses on both, the Piety one had increased attack speed and increased cast speed - I think these 2 maps best illustrate the strength of this build and also negate the "<3K life is too low / you will get one-shot" thinking. The maps combine both high physical and high spell damage. As you can see: i) I am essentially immune to Piety's ice arrows ii) I am avoiding a lot of her lightning attacks and melee attacks iii) When I get hit - my low 2.5K health pool is enough to take the hit iv) I then quickly regenerate back to full life. I do not intend to show off or anything, I am simply trying to demonstrate how strong the build is and how well it scales. A lot of people are saying evasion is bad, however that is not the case. Is this the most OP build ever? - No. But it can definitely hold its ground in the toughest of maps, and is incredibly fun. If you combine evasion with both high block (physical and spells) and high life - your character becomes nearly impossible to kill. The only downside to trying to increase your life - is that you will probably have to decrease your DPS. However, DPS is a form of survivability too - as every second you spend in a fight increases your chances of taking damage. Again, I'm open to any feedback/suggestions on the build as it could help us make it even stronger. Last edited by Ceryneian on Sep 8, 2013, 4:05:02 PM
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I dont have a lot of time right now so leveling goes very slowly.
I just wanted to let you know that in case this turns out to be safe, which is what it currently looks like while leveling and in your youtube videos, I will make the next step and will try to take my LL RF Pulser to the next level and base my new build around what you posted here. Basically a LL RF Block Acrobatics ER based Pulser. Will have to do the math whether or not Vaal Pact would be necessary, I would definitely feel safer with it though since I used to be able to two shot most 77 packs in 6 men parties with running barely any damage and I think that I require the instant leech since we ran maps like this one pretty frequently. So depending on that I would probably run something like or Its really just theoretical at this point though since I am not sure whether or not Shavronnes will actually be allowed in the new league and I dont know the restriction it will have. Last edited by nynyny on Sep 9, 2013, 4:58:43 PM
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" acrobatics = 50% less ES. enjoy @OP: Stacking evasion / dodge / block is nice, but the low hp is something that makes you prone to a one shot scenario. With bosses with vuln, -res, extra ele, extra dmg, boss dmg, gmp. EDIT:/ just noticed you have no armor whatsoever, and 2500 hp. Something like carnage or stormflay with extra dmg, boss dmg, vuln ... you just cant risk doing at all Last edited by mvm199 on Sep 10, 2013, 5:45:13 AM
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How is this build better than an armor-based build?
Armor does not scale as well as evasion against high-damage enemies. Armor reduces damage based on the following formula: Reduction = armour / (armour + 12*incoming damage) As such the % amount of damage that armor can reduce gets smaller and smaller as the damage size increases. This is not a good scaling strategy and most hard hitting bosses can have such devastating attacks that your armor becomes almost negligible. This is why an evasion approach (combined with Blind) can be so much more effective and can scale much better than an armor approach as it still gives you a chance to completely avoid the large hits (evade + dodge + block). This is also why Endurance Charges are a part of this build - the damage reduction from each Endurance Charge is a flat % reduction against all physical damage, regardless of how high the damage is. This is a strong strategy and scales very well. FALSE, people like you spread this nonsense about armor! Yes, the damage reduction gets smaller with a bigger hit and the SAME amount of armor, but an armour stacking character will have tons of armor at his disposal, which can mitigate the big hits very well! Generally, it was always my opinion that if you can get max block, why the hell bother with dodge and evasion? Its enough avoidance, with evasion builds you gimp yourself on a 2-3k hp loss (which is HUGE vs things like shrine / crem / precinct bosses or the craziest rolled maps) and you end up with close to no physical reduction outside of a granite, which means one shots WILL happen. You should get max block easily if you arent a 2h/dw build, and focus on endurance charges and armor from then onwards. Your build vs extra dmg, boss dmg, vuln carnage, he hits for ~2500 with ~60%. This isnt even a crit, and no damage aura rare around. perfect granite and 3 charges and enfeeble Enfeeble is reduced damage, and 17% because of 50% reduced boss effect. 60% increase - 17% = 43%. 2500 x 1.43 = 3575. 3575 vs 6k armor and 12% physical reduction = 2717 life. x 1.3 = 3532 from vuln Tell me, what is going to save you when it checks for a hit against you? LOH and life leech cant revive you from a one shot. In the meantime, 35k armor before granite and 5 charges reduces the same to 1287 (1565 with 3 charges, you would have survived easily). With vuln, average of 1800 dmg taken! Almost 2k damage reduction! And this on a build with max block and 4k hp because I choose marauder tree, so more str = more base life and generally evasion chars get 140% hp while mara gets 200%+. And i didnt even pop a granite! lol ANYWAY i dont need to do anything except leave this here, a vaal pact evasion / blind build who got one shot with more hp than you got. On just an extra dmg carnage, not even vuln / extra ele + -res / boss dmg mods! http://www.twitch.tv/xdjamkx/b/458769553 Last edited by mvm199 on Sep 10, 2013, 5:44:40 AM
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" Thanks for the comment, I've been trying to explain that more life on this build will be ideal, however you do not need a crazy amount of life if you are avoiding damage - which is the defense focus of this build. Last edited by Ceryneian on Sep 10, 2013, 8:16:43 AM
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" It seems you are contradicting yourself here and confirming that armor does not scale. There is no "nonsense" people are spreading about armor - the formula speaks for itself: you basically need to stack an obscene amount of armor to be able to mitigate the big hits, if you did not stack enough armor - your armor basically becomes useless against those large hits. " There are different ways to use block. I like combining block with dodge and evasion - because all three are focused on avoiding damage. I see you are a strong advocate of armor-based builds - that's fine. Those who want to play high armor, high HP tanks can find those builds easily in the Marauder section, and there are even some here in the Ranger section. However this is not a TANK build. I think it is far better to avoid damage, than to try eating it all up. I believe avoiding damage is a much smarter approach. These are different styles of play and each works well. Evasion with high block and good life is an extremely strong build, and people need to stop downplaying evasion and saying it is not viable for endgame. It seems the only issue with my build that you have is the low life - which I understand. However, I have tried to demonstrate that you do not need insane life to do end game maps. If you are playing Hardcore and worried about dying - you will need to play smart (move out of avoidable hits, etc.). You will also probably not be doing any insane maps with 2 unique bosses, -res, etc., much less solo - however this build still fairs well in such maps. Last edited by Ceryneian on Sep 10, 2013, 8:37:10 AM
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" No you havent, you picked specific maps where the dmg output wouldnt put your 2k hp to a real test. Basically you have to reroll a lot of maps because of the oneshot scenario these builds are prone to. Dodge alone is the worst thing to have when you already have evasion blind and block with ondars guile ... its a massive overkill. You lose 50% of any armor you might have for it? Need it to travel to spell dodge? Weak, spell block is enough and can get up to 75%. Double bosses alone is nothing that impressive. A combo of 3 to 4 any of the following with maps like precinct, colonnade, shrine, crematorium, dark forest, spider forest, jungle valley, gorge, canyon, maze etc -max res / ew extra ele dmg extra dmg boss dmg vuln I didnt contradict myself about armor, i showed you how useful it would be to stack it vs the really big hits when ppl say it isnt. There are certain combinations of bosses and monsters that hit for 3k alone, after enfeeble (Heard of a crazy spinecrack with vuln -res extra ele and boss dmg hitting a 6k es / hp AA tank for 3k+ after enfeeble). Your scenario with low to no armor: 2k life and hit for 2k+ damage My scenario: Hit for 1-1.5k with 4k pool You have block blind and evasion ... I have max block ... with 3-4x the ehp when i get hit for spike dmg ... but which one do you prefer? And of course you can play what you want, all I said was block is enough avoidance in my eyes. I would want a big buffer (hp or es pool) and real mitigation after that (armor) for when i actually get hit. |
