[3.25] Ice Dancing Queen - Icestorm/Cyclone/CI - Viable For Everything

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WinterHiko wrote:
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webas wrote:
pob
Spoiler
https://pastebin.com/DeJidYz3


So far i can tank maps..shaper beam..elder...

I killed normal eater of worlds but uber eater is just almost one shots me... and his laser beam one taps me.

And the OP gets hit for 3k ES or less while i get hit 3times as hard... why is that?

Any help? I dont think there is much to improve on my gear - so.... why is that fight straight up impossible? It feels i would need to be TWICE as tanky to stand a chance... is this build incapable of doing it? Let me know!



Can't look at your PoB right now but took a look at your profile.

You can +20% quality your belt for a chunk of intelligence. you could also get a +15% implicit (+18% with quality) instead of a +12% one.

Using a hybrid EV/ES armor is preferable to a pure ES one, as you get 1ES per 6EV on chest.

Synthesized rings could boost your intelligence quite a bit and with it, ES and damage. You can also use Shavronne's Revelation in the left slot for a surprising amount of ES.

You can also invest in a +int +dmg per 15 int amulet instead of Astramentis to get more dps.

Making room for Hatred could get you 20-25% more DPS. You can free a slot if you can nab a Cold to the Core/Wish for Death Megalomaniac, as you won't need Culling Strike.

One point into Mana Mastery would proc Polymath, which is nicely efficient for a single point.

Your Watcher's Eye could be upgraded. For bossing in particular, +max mana as ES with Clarity is better than ES on hit, as tanking bigger hits will be more useful than regenerating ES. Damage taken recouped as mana could be changed for either flat damage on Hatred or elemental penetration on Hatred, if you fit it in. It's another big chunk of damage. Enlighten would be necessary, but would also free up two skill points on the right side of tree.

If you can manage your mana reservation without the ES mastery in the middle, you could change it to max mana as ES.

You have two Rumi's concoction. I do not believe they stack. You might be better off with another type of flask, like +20% EV or The Writhing Jar for bosses invulnerability phases (lets you leech).



As for the fight against Uber Elder itself, it's hard to simply face-tank all attacks and you can't one-phase them because of all of the HP gating going on.

Keep your eyes firmly on Shaper. He can hit like a truck with beam, balls and slam. Elder's attack that can hit you hard are telegraphed through the ghastly ground for several seconds and are hard to miss. The rest of his attacks are usually not enough, so you need less attention on him. Shaper, on the other hand, can suddendly prepare a slam and he's not as evident to spot as the ghastly floor. He can also hit you from off-screen if you're not keeping a close eye on him.

Shaper turns towards where he'll teleport next. Make sure you follow him so he doesn't surprise you from off-screen.

Once you get into the portal phase, Frostblink a lot while you destroy them. Prioritize staying mobile so Shaper doesn't get you, as the portals don't move and your Ice storms will continue dealing damage even if you're not constantly casting. You could also switch to Cyclone if you prefer for that part for even more mobility, but you lose a lot of DPS.

Last League, I farmed Uber Uber Elder a bit. I had 15k ES and 700k Shaper DPS (so about 200k on Ubers). Just to give you an idea of the very top end when you have unlimited budget (I was very lucky and dropped a Ring of Kalandra I sold for over a mirror, so currency was not a problem). Even then, I had to be careful in that fight and could get killed every now and then. It's one of the thoughest fights in the game, second only to Uber Sirus IMO (/$%?/$? eternal ground degens). Practice helped a lot, though.



Hope that helps!


Very informative.. 2 rumi is because in many situations i need to use it and there are no rares just packs of magic mobs...

I will try to think if i can fit hatred.. also what your idea about skitterbots?

I suppose i could run lab in hopes of reduced mana enchant for some aura...

I think this build weakness is lack of armor - evasion is often negated by some sort of enemies thats why I picked pure ES armor.. <- can you comment on this?

I tried simulacrum and while i killed and got voices i was out of portals by wave 28/29... it was insanely fun to see tankyness but it was sketchy at best.. Probably the best would be some sort of more block.. no idea... So far... red maps.. normal elder, normal shaper, normal world eater, normal exarch is no problem...

however sometimes even guardian can delete me if block doesnt proc. I guess from now the upgrades are going to be quite expensive. Im not sure about how much my build has dps but im somewhat satisfied.
I swear if they make some maven "Simon says" insta-death minigame, sirus, exarch ball minigame then i wont play poe2.
You don't need a second Rumi, just activate the first one. The enchant that triggers is does not prevent manual activation.

I think I tested Skitterbots and Hatred gives more damage. We already chill via Vortex/cold damage, so half of it isn't very useful, and Hatred gives flat damage and a hefty more modifier. Plus, Hatred gives access to affixes on Watcher's Eye who are also a big chunk of damage. For the same reservation effiency, I believe Hatred is superior. It also has an alternate quality that gives you +duration of chill and freeze. Do try it out in PoB! That's the only way to be sure for your build.

Armor is a weird stat. Small amounts of it are not very useful. The bigger the damage of an attack, the less damage reduction % it gives. The tooltips in PoB and in-game with a %dmg reduction are misleading. That means that it's better to either go all-in or not at all, especially if you don't have any trouble while mapping.

Evasion is a very good stat. Against multiple enemies, it more or less acts like damage reduction. Against larger enemies, it can save your life. We mitigate big hits via the massive health pool. Armor character usually end up at 5k-6k HP/ES, while we easily bust 10k and can reach 15k. Having twice as much HP/ES is the same as 50% damage reduction, plus you can leech twice as fast.

As for your chest piece, a good EV/ES body armour will give you more ES than a flat ES armor and add a lot of evasion for essentially free. There was a discussion much earlier in the thread.

Regarding Simulacrum, even at the height of the build, you need to move around and keep an eye out for the uniques in waves 25+. They hit hard. Dodging attacks with Frostblink is key. I was able to complete a couple 30 waves simulacrum last league, but never with all 6 portals. You need a *lot* of damage to reasonably melt those.

I misspoke at my DPS in the last post. I meant average hit. It's the only simple measurement because of the nature of the storms (of which you can have up to 5 at a time). Against mobile opponents, you can assume between two and three storms active at a time. There was some discussion in the Scion thread about how to calculate DPS with the amount of storms and I believe full five storms DPS was around 43 times average hit? You only get that if you pre-fire before the fight (like Conquerors).

How much is your average hit in PoB for the self-ast staff? Can't check right now, I'm not home. Make sure you checked all the applicable options in configuration and choose "pinnacle/guardian" as an opponent.
Last edited by WinterHiko on Dec 20, 2022, 12:59:04 PM
Loving the build so far!
How are we dealing with stuns now?
I see on the old pob that there is stun avoidance on the brute force/ fertile mind gems, is this possible now with jewel changes?
I have taken the stun threshold is based on ES mastery that has helped a bit.
Do I need to get some stun avoidance on gear now aswell as any rare jewels?
There's also a notable on small cluster for 40% stun avoidance while channelling, think it's worth investing in?
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Aedesia wrote:
Loving the build so far!
How are we dealing with stuns now?
I see on the old pob that there is stun avoidance on the brute force/ fertile mind gems, is this possible now with jewel changes?
I have taken the stun threshold is based on ES mastery that has helped a bit.
Do I need to get some stun avoidance on gear now aswell as any rare jewels?
There's also a notable on small cluster for 40% stun avoidance while channelling, think it's worth investing in?


You cannot have any implicit on the conversion jewels now, as they are pre-corrupted.

If you want stun avoidance, there's the flask or affixes. You can also path you tree differently to get the Tolerance nodes.

For the channelling staff, though, Awakened Cast while Channelling makes you immune to stuns. It's really for leveling or for self-cast.

I haven't used stun avoidance myself and have not noticed any problems during clearing. We have a natural 50% chance to avoid from having ES and some recovery with The Stampede. It has proven enough for me.
"
WinterHiko wrote:
"
Aedesia wrote:
Loving the build so far!
How are we dealing with stuns now?
I see on the old pob that there is stun avoidance on the brute force/ fertile mind gems, is this possible now with jewel changes?
I have taken the stun threshold is based on ES mastery that has helped a bit.
Do I need to get some stun avoidance on gear now aswell as any rare jewels?
There's also a notable on small cluster for 40% stun avoidance while channelling, think it's worth investing in?


You cannot have any implicit on the conversion jewels now, as they are pre-corrupted.

If you want stun avoidance, there's the flask or affixes. You can also path you tree differently to get the Tolerance nodes.

For the channelling staff, though, Awakened Cast while Channelling makes you immune to stuns. It's really for leveling or for self-cast.

I haven't used stun avoidance myself and have not noticed any problems during clearing. We have a natural 50% chance to avoid from having ES and some recovery with The Stampede. It has proven enough for me.


Thanks dude. I have been messing around with energy leech support for clearing (in place of elemental proliferation) I think I'm feeling the lack of freeze.

Thanks for the tips!
"
Aedesia wrote:


Thanks dude. I have been messing around with energy leech support for clearing (in place of elemental proliferation) I think I'm feeling the lack of freeze.

Thanks for the tips!


Elemental Proliferation is surprisingly useful. It's an immense defensive upgrade while clearing. I wouldn't remove it personally. Hypothermia is also a nice boost, while providing a chunky 29% more damage.

While Energy Leech sounds great on paper, it provides either 24% or 38% more damage (depending on whether or not you're full ES, which you will be most of the time but not always), while other damage support gems often hit that 38% unconditionnally. For instance, Awakened Cold Penetration gives you 39% resistance penetration, which is usually at least 39% more damage, plus a chance of cold exposure for additionnal damage. Concentrated effect costs you area of effect, but gives you a plain 39% more without any conditions.

All in all, I think Elemental Proliferation is one of the best gems in the channelling setup, but if you don't mind the loss of freezing, I'd replace Energy Leech with Awakened Cold Penetration or, more cheaply, Concentrated effect.

EDIT : Do two "more" modifiers on a single gem stack additively or multiplicatively? If it's the latter, Energy Leech would top at 41% more damage (1.24*1.14=1.4136) instead of 38%. Doesn't change my point, but my calculations might have been off.
Last edited by WinterHiko on Dec 20, 2022, 5:16:00 PM
hey guys i need some help can someone look at my gear and help me out with why i just take so long to kill bosses and like hydra i cannt take down his enegery sheild befire he phases out
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actkilla wrote:
hey guys i need some help can someone look at my gear and help me out with why i just take so long to kill bosses and like hydra i cannt take down his enegery sheild befire he phases out


Helmet and Body armour could have +% intelligence, which would help quite a bit. You can craft +%attributes on chest if you have an open suffix.

You were missing a ring when I looked.

Getting 6%int implicits on rings would also give you a bunch of dps. If you're on a budget, consider corrupted Heup of all with that implicit. It's a good upgrade.

The two implicits of gloves could be unnerve on hit and dmg per int, it really makes a big difference and doesn't cost too much.

I can't look at your tree right now (I'm on mobile), but make sure you have Cold to the Core cluster jewels and conversion jewels if you don't already. Same for a good Watcher's Eye and two Split Personnalities.

Try to fit in Hatred, it really makes a big difference (20-25% more damage).

All in all, this is a int stacking build. Getting more damage is a matter of getting more int and more effects that scale on int.
Well, let's see how the 3.20.1 changes to Sanctum work... you lose less resolve when in melee range...

Oh that's working nicely -- the freeze from the cyclone staff works great.
Last edited by Graiaule on Dec 21, 2022, 12:54:49 AM
Is the crafting shown on the scion page still working after harvest nerfs?

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