Loss of XP on death !1

I'm going to be as calm as I can with this. I have to ask first, why is this even a thing ? Can you not think of a better way to punish us on death then to take away hours of work because your game is so complex that I cant build a character that is defensible against every single thing, you die and thats how it is. I am fine with my deaths as I learn from them but to take away my hard earned XP is beyond the pale. Why do you insist on punishing you player base with such absurd obsolete game mechanics like this ? I cannot fathom a reason for this.

Will there ever be a chance you will remove this utterly offensive penalty ? I cannot begin to tell you how so unfair and obnoxious it is to lose 5 maps worth of XP because you finally died to some BS that you couldn't prevent. Surely there is another way to make dying in this game punitive other than stealing our progress. There is just simply no reason to take our XP from us. It takes soooooooooooooooooooooo long to gain XP after 75 and you though it was a good idea to literally rob us of our hard earned time because you cant come up with a better way to make dying something yo want to avoid.

Its bad enough that while mapping,if you die you start us back at the city or hideout. This is annoying but I can accept it but not both. Please rescind this mechanic and replace it with a more reasonable penalty.

The Death Penalty can feel savage and brutally unfair, especially given the many cheese deaths can and do happen, either due to bugs; lag or desync

See here for a 100% bs death I suffered in Synthesis.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5joR-kwRw3w

The only learning to take away from that was don't do memory fragments if you don't want to risk losing xp.

But in spite of this, I don't think removing the penalty is the solution to the problem. If I'm being honest, more of my deaths have happened because I didn't understand the risk or my characters limitations. This painful process of learning has real value to players who are true grinders at heart (which I am).

The actual solution should be 2 fold:
1) GGG should work very hard to eliminate as many deaths due to lag/desync and bugs as humanly possible, as they will and almost certainly have lost players who get burnt from this.
2) Provide a new alternative league where players don't suffer a death penalty. That way, more causal players, or players who have a low tolerance for unfair deaths have a way to play the game that works best for them. This means you now have Hardcore; Softcore gets rebranded as Mediumcore; and a new Softcore is introduced.

Not that I have any expectation they will do this, but I think they would make a lot of players very happy if they did, without taking away the more challenging option for the true grinders. My only concern with this is that it would further split the player base, so whether the market place should be segmented between medium and softcore is not clear to me.

ps. On leaderboards, maybe include a death count, and maybe have a leaderboard ordered by lowest number of deaths (within level), so there is still an incentive to minimize deaths.

WOW that video ... yea thats rough man :( What a well thought out post, thank you for taking the time to read and reply ! I was thing, how bout if they are going to use the XP penalty at least let us claim it back where we died like Dark Souls does. If you die on the way then you lose it permanently.

I don't see why there's a loss of xp at all. We all know how long it takes just to go from level 79 to 80. And on top of that if you die it's going to take you 10 times longer to get back the xp you lost and make that 80th level.

ha. That death is ancient history and I've died many times since to things I would class just as unfair. I mean, your concern is not without merit, but removing the penalty is not the solution to the problem of unfair deaths, eliminating or minimizing unfair deaths is the actual solution.

As for the dark souls method, sounds intriguing, but I've never played the game so can't really comment, I can only say I don't think the solution should involve taking away the current system as you are denying a feature of the game that many players love. Instead they need to offer alternatives for players who don't want to play that way.

I digress, but one of the reasons I responded to your post is that on a wider context I have felt there are genuine negatives to the death penalty system beyond just the issue of unfair deaths. What I mean by that is it promotes a very boring style of play. You just grind maps and content that you know puts your character at a low chance of death, and that is hardly a compelling way to spend most of your time on the game. This becomes more and more of an issue as you level higher and higher since it takes longer to level and dying has greater consequences when you do die.

For this reason also, an alternative league without a death penalty may be warranted as it may allow players greater freedom for those that just want to push up to and beyond their characters limits because that is simply more fun for them.

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webgeo99 wrote:

I don't see why there's a loss of xp at all. We all know how long it takes just to go from level 79 to 80. And on top of that if you die it's going to take you 10 times longer to get back the xp you lost and make that 80th level.

I think it is almost pointless trying to argue whether there should be a penalty or not, because the fact is some players think this is an important and defining feature of the game while other players hate it. Like I said, the solution is to cater to as many players as possible, so offer them a choice. I mean, they do that already with hardcore and softcore, this is just adding another level of granularity.

How about this:

Orb of Resurrection

1) About as rare as an exalted orb, or maybe slightly rarer.
2) Gain 10-90% of experience lost from last death.
3) Can only be used immediately after dying, eg if you continue to earn any more xp after dying it can no longer be used.
4) You cannot chain them. ie. Once you have used it, you can only use another one after another death.

The 10-90% range could roll onto the Orb when it drops, which means their value on the market place would likely vary quite significantly. The way I see it by capping it at 90% it ensures you will always receive some level of punishment. I also understand GGG would be more likely to look at something like this if there was some rng involved.

That is a really sweet idea. The XP loss doesn't bother me in the slightest, but it would probably still be really exciting for one of those to drop.

XP loss on death... mmm... Let me start by saying it is unquestionably frustrating and enraging when it happens because of desync or fps drop. That having been said, as much as I too hate the loss of exp I do believe it offers incentive to be prepared and to not just throw caution to the wind because if you do the game will punish you for it. The issue I personally have with the exp penality is that the game offers you ZERO syntax upon death for what actually just happened. Because of this i'm more inclined to side with the removal of the penality as there is no justification for the punishment if your not being explicitly told what/who killed you, the damage that was dealt in numeric value, the damage type (cold/chaos/electric/fire/De-gen/etc.), and the amount that was mitigated if any by your own defenses.

The complete lack of a combat log or at least a death log is the real damning factor here. There is no way whatsoever for GGG to justify this on any grounds of challenging or rewarding when the very factors of whether you died or didn't are lost on the ignorance the player. It's ridiculous that we are expected to run back into a battle we just died from with some sort of enlightened approach when nothing was learned and we are doomed to repeat the same event. I've personally found I have to go scouring the web for guide info on particular encounters not because I want a play by play of how to fight the battle, but because I want to know what damage type the mob was dealing to me to begin with so I can better structure my defense for the engagement.

There is another option... Take for example a pass interference penality in football that would have otherwise resulted in a touchdown. The rules state you can't be given points because of a defensive penality, but they will half the distance to the goal. How does this apply to the game? Why not have us pay back the experience at half the rate. So rather then LOSING experience and regressing; the future experience gained will instead be taxed at 50%, meaning half of what you now earn goes to leveling and the other half goes to paying off the 10% total loss penality. In the end the results are actually the same (as you will be slowed by a % of the 10% lost). This is much less insulting and enraging if your progress is simply slowed, rather than having it removed. As a reminder you can half the distance or requirement for anything infinitly while never actually achieving the goal.