Upcoming Patch and Melee Buff's Effect on PVP
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For lvl28 melee was broken before the patch and will be even more broken after the patch... so basically nothing changes. Except for the fact that the already weaker builds now die faster and do less dmg.
We have to be aware that playing anything else than melee is simply for fun but will never be competitive, at least not until the most broken nodes (which happen to be piled up in the south-western area of the passive tree) get fixed. The whole concept, especially with the upcoming changes, just makes no sense anymore... I mean just read it. Physical nodes get buffed, so especially Marauder/Templar/Duelist get their dmg increased, which resuslts in all characters needing less HP and therefor hp-nodes being reduced, which not only will make witches, rangers and shadows die faster to physical but also make them more vulnerable to stun (which you can either counter with a node without downsides that also is in the Maremplist-area [Unwavering] or a unique amulet that reduces your hp even further), thus increasing the efficiency of armor (what I dont get is that armor is less effective when the hits are bigger and due to physical being buffed... ah, but nvm, maybe I just jump to conclusions) which is also the preferred defensive concept and has the most nodes to increase it in the Maremplist-area. Regarding armor the Ranger is a borderline case due to IR but witch and shadow are simply fucked. Evasion? Simply useless, not because Evasion itself is bad, but because RT can bypass it completely. Energyshield? Getting reduced, like HP, therefor not really useless, but less effective than before. Graniteflask? Getting nerfed by 25%. To sum it up: The only remaining effective defensive concept is the natural defence of melees - Armor. And from this it should be obvious that the Shadow is clearly overpowered, so it is absolutely justified to nerf his attackspeed. From 12% on a single node to 3%! 75% reduction! That shall teach that OP-shadow! Seriously... you want to play lvl28 PvP? Roll Maremplist! And while you are at it, go melee. Build-diversity my ass. Hold on to yer shite load o´ bloody barnacles on me arse-cockles, me hearty!
IGN: Trapsdrubel |
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" ^ lol another case of basing all your theories on low lvl pvp not taking the bigger picture into consideration at all... there are many viable non-melee in 28pvp, it also seems as if your basing all your opinions off of cookie cut builds/strats..? This upcomming patch makes perfect sense and most agree it is a great patch addressing many issues.. try and see things from other perspectives :P Last edited by Greenbake#1447 on Jun 5, 2013, 3:39:59 PM
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melee is much stronger in 1v1 than it is in 3v3, i can think of a 3v3 team that could be almost unbeatable and it wouldnt even need 1 melee build......
IGN: High____Lander | xDominus
40 Arena pvper: Bleed_Pig Guild: <HERB> THC |
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physical builds will be better than elemental builds
incorporating chill and crit in builds will probably be the new cheese ES is probably now worthless since physical nodes will be worth selecting (es/life nerf too) depending on the life nerfs and physical damage buff, shadow could potentially be the best It's quite obvious that GGG has neglected lv28 pvp for yet another patch, without any consideration of the changes outcome As far as melee being broken, maybe the damage values are a bit too much, or quite possibly casters are just under powered. As for archers, the damage is fine, although mainly revolving around elemental damage, i believe the main problem remains on the mechanics of the game. The way the game plays for ranged is just horrible at the moment, i feel absolutely no possibilities for agility and zoom the fucking camera out. plz " idk about this.. enlighten me? " Cannot think of a situation where those characters could be better than a standard ele melee, sadly I believe i can 1v3 those Last edited by exmse#1126 on Jun 5, 2013, 4:07:03 PM
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_pvp_'s RoA bow build firebrands summoner and my CC templar (DrDankins).
IGN: High____Lander | xDominus 40 Arena pvper: Bleed_Pig Guild: <HERB> THC Last edited by oowarpigoo#5382 on Jun 5, 2013, 3:52:45 PM
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" idk where the problem is with basing my opinion on low-lvl pvp in a thread about the effects on pvp of the upcoming patch, specifically stating that I am talking about low-lvl pvp, in the pvp-section of the forum. I never said those changes were not good for PvE, from that point they make perfect sense, but for lvl28 pvp they are a real bummer. And plz, the next time you mark a specific part of a quote, make sure to take the context into consideration. Speaking about context... ofc I am talking about cookie-cutter. Because first, I clearly stated I am talking about competitive builds (I play the, as far as I am informed, only lvl28 Wand-char so I think I know about viable non-melee builds that will NEVER stand a chance against a decent melee) and second, like it or not, the actual cookie-cutter builds ARE melee AND are Templar/Marauder/Duelist (as I pointed out). Regarding the statement of the 3v3 "Allstars" team... I highly doubt you would stand a chance against a team of Soggypocket, SlowAndSteadyFisting and Milkbeard for example, but this is just theoretical speculation... @exmse: I don´t think melee in and of itself is broken, ofc not, that statement would be stupid. What I mean is, that melee (and especially Maremplist again) has access to some combinations that use the mechanics so good, that neither ranged nor caster can stand a chance per se and THAT makes it broken.
Spoiler
- They have access to three mobility skills that also deal considerable dmg (desync-blades, desync-slam with AoE and Multi-Fucker-Strike). That itself is no problem but the thing is that especially ranged chars have access to none of these. Not a single one! They are limited to quicksilver flasks, which either wastes a complete slot or consumes a charge of a Warding-flask just for some quick repositioning.
- Maremplist can completely negate Evasion, thus rendering one of the basic defensive concepts utterly useless, which is btw. the natural defensive concept of Rangers and Shadows and they only have access to nodes increasing Eva (while REanger being borderline, but IR consumes some points) - Melees with swords can reduce block by 15%-45% (depending if Ranger or Maremplist), which is no concept for bow-users anyways. - They have more access to more effective resist-nodes (Diamond Skin, Body and Soul, Celestial Walker VS Nullification, Frost/Light/Firewalker, Crystal Skin) with Maremplar being the only two that can increase their maxres, which is still huge after the nerf, because it lowers the incoming elemental dmg by 8% (assuming unmodified resist) - Templar and Duelist have the most effective Blocknodes (2x 15% allres with 4/20 Shieldmastery and Spellblocking on its way or Whirling Barrier which provieds 10% block with a 2handed weapon(!!) for Templar, 6/20 Shieldmastery and Derwish for Duelist) - Maremplist having the most effective Armor increase, which also happens to be the only efficient defensive concept for lvl28 pvp - The most accessible and effective hp- and hp-regen nodes, with Discipline and Training being the most effective hp-node (at least for lvl28) on the whole tree - The most effective ES-node with Body and Soul (20%AR/20%ES/10res) compared to Nullification (10%ES/10res and 10%EVA which could as well be not there due to RT) or Arcane Focus (18% ES, which is a joke in itself, that the natural ES-class, the witch, does not have a single node that is not even more but only as effective as the notable ES-passive from the templar) And this was just about the defence, I will not talk about Catalyze, the multiplicative dmg-increase of blockreduction, Elementalist/Celestial Walker and Chill Duration. The thing is, each single point is not a problem in itself, but the combination of all these aspects makes it problematic. It leads to the point where melees, and especiall Mara/Templar/Duelist simply have more life, more defence, more dmg, more maneuverability, more everything by default. The upcoming patch will widen this gap and now I will roll a melee-templar, just to prove my point. regards Hold on to yer shite load o´ bloody barnacles on me arse-cockles, me hearty! IGN: Trapsdrubel Last edited by Azdrubel#6242 on Jun 5, 2013, 6:57:20 PM
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meh
I Stream PvP Twitch.tv/GrindcoreTHRALL THE STORY OF MY Descent into the Abysmal Afterlife( HC to SC, too Stronk!) http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/346754 PK massacre, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ldz09uBZ-ug Last edited by GrindcoreTHRALL#3263 on Jun 10, 2013, 9:43:59 PM
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You're not wrong but alot of what you said is irrelevant. Also i think wanders are the best ranged class at the moment and depending on the upcoming changes, quite possibly as viable as any melee.
The convenience of generally desired nodes for templar/mara/dualist is possibly too strong. The problem lays within the tree though, and will probably never be ideal for level28 pvp. What is op with melee - Hp regen HP nodes Catalyse static blows Resolute Technique Perma Stun crest of parandus wakes Flicker and whirling blades Weapon elemental damage % on items facebreaker mitts ~~ -block can be perceived as op, but the fault still lies with base block, specifically crest being stupidly stwong No item/tree possibilities for evasion,es , witches, shadows, rangers and two handed builds come even close to how well the list above scale together. If i am to play an evasion based character, i have incredible mana issues as i am unable to use bloodmagic, neglecting hp regen nodes for evasion Last edited by exmse#1126 on Jun 5, 2013, 5:46:11 PM
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" you forgot swords being the only weapon to penetrate block. I Stream PvP Twitch.tv/GrindcoreTHRALL
THE STORY OF MY Descent into the Abysmal Afterlife( HC to SC, too Stronk!) http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/346754 PK massacre, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ldz09uBZ-ug |
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" This was bullshit and I apologize. Maybe I am too dumb to read or I was confused or somehow expected to get nerfed because I just like to QQ... whatever. In fact Shadow got buffed slightly, so again I apologize for talking bullshit. Hold on to yer shite load o´ bloody barnacles on me arse-cockles, me hearty! IGN: Trapsdrubel Last edited by Azdrubel#6242 on Jun 5, 2013, 6:57:53 PM
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