If it's NOT Deterministic, It's not CRAFTING! Just glorified gambling which isn't fun

I just really hope some day that GGG adds crafting into PoE 2.

Do you think a black smith rolls up to a forge and says - Geez I don't know what is going to happen? NO! They take a bunch of material with a determined outcome and craft that item.

Last season GGG made improvements to their gambling system that they call crafting but it still wasn't enough for players like myself and many to actually get involved with it.

The gambling system in this game is still way too convoluted with RNG on top of RNG and you need some 3rd party website to figure it out. That isn't immersive interaction I'm looking for in a game.

- Obviously would love to see a crafting bench, I put in X materials get X affix or modifier. Which is what I call and most people will call crafting. I put in 10 exalts I get to pick out a specific affix. Have expensive affixes cost more currency. However please just give us crafting which means determined outcomes and we don't need 3rd party sites to understand the RNG.

If it's not deterministic, it's not crafting plain and simple. It's just gambling and I HATE casinos. I love professions in video games but what PoE has is just glorified gambling that satisfies only die hard gamblers with an addiction instead of people who love gaming.

There just really is no other way to see this. There is a plethora of video games that have some of the best deterministic crafting systems that exist in ARPGs. I'm not saying copy them 1 for 1 but at least try to take some ideas and implement crafting into PoE 2.

Right now what GGG has in PoE 2 isn't anywhere close to a crafting system and feels bare bones. It feels like we have alpha crafting/gabling system and they forgot to add core features.

I'd also like to add that if you need a 3rd party site to understand something then there is a flaw in it's design. There really needs to be some simplification to antiquated ideas that came over from PoE1. Or better yet leave those antiquated ideas in PoE1. If PoE 2 is going to be thee next Gen ARPG a lot old design from PoE 1 won't work.

I'm not saying you can't have any risk/reward in crafting after you crafted a determined item with the exact affixes you want. That's fine. However early and often as we progress through the game I should be picking up currency, going to a crafting bench and adding either spirit to a sceptre or + cast speed and be picking out these affixes. (Which is called CRAFTING) This will actually allow us to enjoy build diversity and get creative with builds and how we progress through this game.

Thanks

If i had something to say about the game development it wouldnt even have any crafting, it hurts the game more than it helps 90% of the times, the social aspect of the game goes out of the window as everyone can craft most of their items so everyone plays mostly solo (and i mean solo in every way mapping/trading etc), the drops wich are the biggest selling point of these games for the adrenaline of finding cool stuff dissapears really fast as everyone crafts way above average items easily etc.
I understand that some craft crafting might make sense to counter a really bad streak of RNG that you can get, but never in a way that negates 80% of your character progression or more.

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MakaveliPT#7753 wrote:

the drops wich are the biggest selling point of these games for the adrenaline of finding cool stuff dissapears really fast as everyone crafts way above average items easily etc.

I agree the drops are what is exciting however I completely disagree with it disappearing when everyone can now craft. I'm sorry there are great ARPG that have deterministic crafting and the crafting is what makes them a great ARPG.

Adding crafting into PoE 2 won't remove any excitement from drops, it will just be a better game because now it has an actual crafting system.

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MakaveliPT#7753 wrote:

I understand that some craft crafting might make sense to counter a really bad streak of RNG that you can get, but never in a way that negates 80% of your character progression or more.

If it's RNG and you don't know the outcome it's not crafting, it's gambling. Having an actual crafting system which has simple deterministic features enhances progression significantly. It opens up gampeplay, build diversity, creativity of the players to really explore what the game has to offer.

Crafting being deterministic improves the overall game allowing for a better player experience. It's improving progression and the ARPG experience either solo or with friends. So I respectfully disagree.

I don't think taking advantage of people gambling addiction is a good core foundation for a system. That is the way I look at it. You think it's exciting but it isn't. I don't have a gambling problem though so maybe this is obvious to someone like myself. Rather just have a really good designed system that enhances the game.

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AbombThePeoplesChamp#1184 wrote:

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MakaveliPT#7753 wrote:

the drops wich are the biggest selling point of these games for the adrenaline of finding cool stuff dissapears really fast as everyone crafts way above average items easily etc.

I agree the drops are what is exciting however I completely disagree with it disappearing when everyone can now craft. I'm sorry there are great ARPG that have deterministic crafting and the crafting is what makes them a great ARPG.

Adding crafting into PoE 2 won't remove any excitement from drops, it will just be a better game because now it has an actual crafting system.

"

MakaveliPT#7753 wrote:

I understand that some craft crafting might make sense to counter a really bad streak of RNG that you can get, but never in a way that negates 80% of your character progression or more.

If it's RNG and you don't know the outcome it's not crafting, it's gambling. Having an actual crafting system which has simple deterministic features enhances progression significantly. It opens up gampeplay, build diversity, creativity of the players to really explore what the game has to offer.

Crafting being deterministic improves the overall game allowing for a better player experience either solo or with friends. It's improving progression and the ARPG experience either solo or with friends. So I respectfully disagree.

I don't think taking advantage of people gambling addiction is a good core foundation for a system. That is the way I look at it. You think it's exciting but it isn't. I don't have a gambling problem though so maybe this is obvious to someone like myself. Rather just have a really good designed system that enhances the game.

Trade, that's the point of having an economy ingame, with millions of players playing the game for hours to no end youll always have someone trading for stuff you need/want, the league literally resets for a fresh economy/experience, if you do not trade by choice too bad, the game and the genre was made with that in mind and the worse thing they did was catering to ssf ideas and players that refuse to be part of any kind of social aspect present in the game.

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AbombThePeoplesChamp#1184 wrote:

"

MakaveliPT#7753 wrote:

the drops wich are the biggest selling point of these games for the adrenaline of finding cool stuff dissapears really fast as everyone crafts way above average items easily etc.

I agree the drops are what is exciting however I completely disagree with it disappearing when everyone can now craft. I'm sorry there are great ARPG that have deterministic crafting and the crafting is what makes them a great ARPG.

Adding crafting into PoE 2 won't remove any excitement from drops, it will just be a better game because now it has an actual crafting system.

"

MakaveliPT#7753 wrote:

I understand that some craft crafting might make sense to counter a really bad streak of RNG that you can get, but never in a way that negates 80% of your character progression or more.

If it's RNG and you don't know the outcome it's not crafting, it's gambling. Having an actual crafting system which has simple deterministic features enhances progression significantly. It opens up gampeplay, build diversity, creativity of the players to really explore what the game has to offer.

Crafting being deterministic improves the overall game allowing for a better player experience. It's improving progression and the ARPG experience either solo or with friends. So I respectfully disagree.

I don't think taking advantage of people gambling addiction is a good core foundation for a system. That is the way I look at it. You think it's exciting but it isn't. I don't have a gambling problem though so maybe this is obvious to someone like myself. Rather just have a really good designed system that enhances the game.

99% of the Drops are literally Trash. I am not saying you should get like a GG 5 T1 nice Weapon every now and then. But it is literally trash. Even an average mix of T3 AND T4s with one or two T2 OR t1 will be good. But it is literally Trash. 0.3 Patch at least give you some hope and even then it is not as easy as ABC, you need to work for it get enough Omens and Abyssal crafting items to try for one. Which is fine, because you will get 1 or 2 fairly decent item.

But they took out the Homogenizing Exalted Omen which is really a huge bummer.
I am find with the Essence going from 6 to 5, I think it is fair, but you further nerf it by allowing Divines to downgrade the Mod. That is just a huge bummer.

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Adding crafting into PoE 2 won't remove any excitement from drops

What excitement? After half of leveling, the loot is so bad it's barely worth looking at.

It is 100% objectively, undeniably true that a crafting system is only a crafting system if it provides an entirely deterministic way to force the creation of the exact item you want, without any rng or chance factors affecting the outcome.

On top of that, you can only say a game actually has crafting if the materials and tools needed to actually use the crafting system can be obtained in a reasonable timeframe.

Sadly, neither of those things have ever been the case in PoE 1 or 2.
Everything they call crafting is indeed just gambling, and it doesn't really matter what any of the crafting materials even do because they're all so rare, late to start appearing, and hard to obtain that they functionally don't exist anyway.
The orb of this, the omen of that, the bone, the lock, the mirror, all have no reason to be in the game, as most players are finding every league ends before they manage to get any in the first place.

But it is crafting. mitigating the factors of rng is the role of the crafter, even IRL.

Getting 10 orbies, walking up to a thing and asking "t1 life please" is a shopping experience, not crafting.

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Direfell#7544 wrote:

But it is crafting. mitigating the factors of rng is the role of the crafter, even IRL.

Getting 10 orbies, walking up to a thing and asking "t1 life please" is a shopping experience, not crafting.

Thank You

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Direfell#7544 wrote:

But it is crafting. mitigating the factors of rng is the role of the crafter, even IRL.

Getting 10 orbies, walking up to a thing and asking "t1 life please" is a shopping experience, not crafting.

^ this.