Following up on Recent Feedback

Im ready for POE Classic.. No interest in POE2

first thing allow unset rings to be mirrored

" We are also aware that there is a lot of disappointment around certain Harvest Crafts being removed. Previously, Harvest Crafting was balanced by how difficult it was to get the crafts that you want. Now that crafts are tradeable, Harvest's power was reduced to be more in line with other crafting methods. We understand that there is a call for us to bring those crafts back but it isn't really possible while allowing Harvest to remain tradeable. "

so now to craft u need 2 divines so most of the items are not really worthy try save cause is to expensive to change
and reroll keep prefix/suffix is not deterministic at all many times i used 30x without get anything good
bs
the only good thing about last league was the recombinators that allow any item be good u can just get anything with 2 stats and use it now is the oposite without the reroll keep prefix/sufix and recombinator everything is trash not worthy pick
and the ritual league was the best one with harvest to augment/remove and actually craft not gamble 1/150k to make a 3 t1 item

Seems to me like there is a group in PoE pushing for 3.13 gameplay but the dominant portion is nostalgic about D2.
And they are the ones in charge and power.

crafting ruined poe. players make way too OP gear with craft.

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Harvest's crafting potential without being gated by rarity is just too high.

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In the same way that we can store sextant mods in a surveyors compass, or store a beast in a Beastiary orb, why not have these highly desirable harvest crafts drop as a "Harvest Orb" or something along those lines. Whether it says "right click this item to unlock a single use of "x" crafting option at your Horticultural Station" or "right click this item and left click an item to apply "x" craft to that item".

In either sense it's tradeable, though the second one bypasses lifeforce, which would mean it needs to be even rarer to account for that.

Oh my gosh, I didn't think I'd have to say that but you're so fucking out of touch with how endgame crafting and gearing works it's just mindblowing, and it's the first time I'm making such a vicious statement about the state of this game...



Ok, let's talk examples: curse on hit ring first, for the sake of simplification let's pick Flammability and fire element in general.

Since this roll requires a high level item (and Conqueror-influenced items are being gatekept behind T14-T16 maps basically) we're pretty much forced to make it once but properly. That means that said ring is supposed to have Flammability with 32% increased effect on hit, at least T3 life, either T3+ attribute or resistance, and either cast speed, fire damage or flat phys/fire damage added to attacks, depending on build or preferences.

Last league, having fully upgraded Harvest on the Atlas Passive Tree, it has taken me 4 full days of near constant playing (over 8 hours a day) to roll a good ring with curse on hit, cast speed and life. Yes, it was SO GODDAMN BAD I gave up on having any resistances or attributes on said ring because I got completely fed up with this bullshit.

So I had to craft similar ring this league, except this time it's not cast speed but fire damage / flat damage added to attacks that's being my priority, and guess what. Over 4250 lifeforce spent on just caster slams alone and I haven't seen 32% Flammability more than twice, mostly because it competes with Vulnerability and cast speed. This is goddamn ridiculous! How the fuck are we supposed to get gear that you force upon us with your screwed up difficulty scaling if we have to spend 2 weeks playing PoE 10 hours a day just to make a single goddamn ring?! And it started bothering me despite the fact that I'm one of those people who can actually play the game for 10 hours a day and grind the hell out of it, how can that be a sign of good development?



Second example, self-cast ignite Elementalist build, requirement: Apothecary's Gloves, double-influenced (Warlord + Elder), T1 (non-elevated) DoT multiplier on a prefix + >=T3 life on a prefix + >=T2 attack and cast speed on a suffix + >=T2 strength on a suffix. Because you love your old influences so much you made them ban Searing Exarch and Eater of Worlds influences from being applicable on this kind of items so the only way to reroll prefixes or suffixes is to spend 2 divines on a crafting bench. Not to mention Searing and Eater influenced remove implicits for no goddamn reason so it wouldn't make any sense to use a dedicated base type in the first place. But let's get to the crafting.

The most important mods are DoT multi and mixed speed, former has been tagged as nothing but damage modifier, latter as attack, caster and speed modifier. Former has approx. weight % of 0.293% meaning roughly 341 chaos slams (on average) to hit it, latter has approx. weight % of 0.939%, translating to about 107 chaos slams on its own. That means we either need an average of 511 Harvest caster crafts, or something around 1748 chaos slams just to hit these 2 mods. And then what? Even if we were stupid enough to actually roll those 2 mods with chaos orbs there's a high chance that either prefixes or suffixes would end up completely filled, or they would be complete garbage (OR even worse - targetted mods with lowest possible tier, amazeballs!).

Oh but one could say 'Hey, just use alts and roll them as a magic item, it'll be cheaper!" Yes, I totally have the time, patience and stupidity to roll those goddamn gloves over and over for 8681 times! What could possibly go wrong?

What is that I hear you say? I can roll prefixes and then slam 'prefixes cannot be changed' on a bench? Truuuuue, I'm totally down to roll 1042 Harvest life slams to hopefully hit the DoT prefix so I can spend 60% of my currency on a single bench craft just to Harvest slam a caster mod that can roll crappy tier 3 (lowest possible) mixed speed mod and fill the remaining affixes with complete crap forcing me to either yolo annul or straight up start all the crafting again. I totally don't need to upgrade the remaining 8 or 9 items on my character, this is fine, I can easily spend 3 weeks farming some crapforce to brick the craft half way through and have to start again, no problem! sarcasm



What you're doing with Harvest is like pushing random buttons on a keyboard... with a sledgehammer... while blindfolded... and drunk...

It's you who kept pushing us further and further towards getting stupid expensive/rare gear to be able to do half of the endgame content, it's you who's gatekeeping Atlas progression behind some [redacted] stupid-ass Pinnacle bosses that are primarily nothing but DPS and mobility checks with some of the most bullshit mechanics I've ever seen, and now it's also you who's taking the only well-rounded and worthwhile crafting mechanic away from us while also expecting us to be greatful that wE cAn PiCk UsEfUl RaRe ItEmS fRoM tHe GrOuNd, which is easily one of the biggest freaking memes of this league.

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Raghin wrote:

If you want the best of both worlds for items crafting in harvest, powerful crafts and not tradeable, there's this word called "account-bound" items that exist in the mmo world gamespace that prevents trading.

Making the design such that those super powerful crafts will never be trade-able and using it on a powerful item costs the ability to trade it. If you want to limit accessibility to those crafts, you could also restore partial previous functionality where you can find a certain number of crafts from harvest, but they just get straight added to your bench. Bringing in more meaningful choices.

Suddenly I can enter a harvest, find a powerful craft and not trade it to others all at the same time. Problem solved.

No trading, powerful crafts restored, the more powerful crafts once again have limited access. Items could become "Account-bound" from the most powerful harvest crafts.

+1 this.
I know GGG don't like account-bound items, but if you want something non-tradeable - that's what account-bound is, that is what it means.

If you don't limit it on the craft, limited it on the crafted item.
Then it's a simple coding task: used X craft/orb/process on an item? It's account-bound and can't be traded - can't go in the trade window. Maybe even make it so it can't be drop-traded, if dropped it vanishes. And it can be applied to any mechanism.
And we can have at least a theoretical chance of powerful crafts, even if they are too expensive for most of us ever to see (a different story).

"We're making it so that you can see how much Lifeforce of each type you have available at the Horticrafting Station.

We are also aware that there is a lot of disappointment around certain Harvest Crafts being removed. Previously, Harvest Crafting was balanced by how difficult it was to get the crafts that you want. Now that crafts are tradeable, Harvest's power was reduced to be more in line with other crafting methods. We understand that there is a call for us to bring those crafts back but it isn't really possible while allowing Harvest to remain tradeable.

While this isn't exactly what you want to hear, I can say that this issue was pushed very hard during discussions to see if any compromise could be made. Harvest's crafting potential without being gated by rarity is just too high."

This statement is so far removed from reality it is painful. We already traded reforge keep suffix and reforge keep prefix. They weren't difficult to get as a crafter at all. The problem was we had to use a 3rd party discord and we had to trust the other player wasn't going to scam. These were almost always traded away between players. You are very out of touch with your player base and it shows.

Having them be tradable without using a sketchy third party discord wouldn't make any difference in the games economy and would have been a huge improvement to your game. Even using those crafts effectively takes an extreme amount of game knowledge. JUICING took game knowledge. You had to learn what was good in a league and what combinations and what was selling. You removed the value of game knowledge for a lottery machine.

All you would have to do is revert loot, nerf god touched rewards to something that takes the old loot system into context, and give reforge keep back and you'd make 90% of your player base so excited to get in and fight those hard as potato monsters and collect their loot. What do you have to lose by taking the feedback and going with it? If we're so wrong, prove it.

looks like you forgot the UW monitor comment. I hope you are aware that the players that have Ultra Wide monitors do not like the black bars

Basically removing Harvest from the game was one of the worst decision ever. Now that life force can be traded it would no longer be the TFT mafia which controls prices but GGG itself could influence how much a gear of a certain "quality" should cost by adjusting the prices.

The argument that trade able harvest is not allowed to be powerful is a joke. Every endgame crafter already traded for harvest craft since harvest league.