Less than 10,000 people play single player ARPG's. 1.4 million people just tested Lost Ark

Per 30 days:

Last Epoch: 600 to 2,000 players

Grim Dawn: 3,000 to 8,000 players

Diablo 3: 10,000 players?

D2R: How many still?

Lost Ark: 1.4 million player start to presently 400,000 players

Diablo Immortal: 10 million people tried the game. I'm glad to say I wasn't one of them.

I tried to find other popular ARPG single player games to list & their weren't any. It's not a successful genre.



So 11 million people who don't have a arpg game to play, yet want a arpg game that's not p2w. With better PVP Arena skillsets than LA. & more PVE evolution than Diablo Immortal.

11 million people without a ARPG game that's mmo styled verses 10 thousand people or less who like single player ARPG's.

DI & LA failed. From p2w reasons & lack of features. So don't tell someone to go simply play those games if they don't like how POE is.

10,000 single player ARPG audience verses 11 million mmo arpg audience. With ____ ZERO mmo arpg games that haven't failed. So then?

Obviously single player ARPG's aren't as popular as this forum believes they are. & People will rant over wanting that niche audience to be heard. Tho they are the minority. They are 10,000 forum talkers. While the other 11 million not playing poe for reasons not highlighted are silent. Yet same genre or same level of action & camera view. Is Lost Ark not a ARPG? For sure was or is. P2W wasn't LA's only problem. Tho theirs nothing that won, 1 million people left. POE hasn't won over those players that left LA either yet.

10,000 verse 11 million & that's only speaking of the ARPG genre too. Not speaking of bigger hero mmo's to weigh these populations. Like all the millions of people who left WoW retail, WoW Classic, New World, Black Desert, GW2, & ESO.

The other thread talks of features. This thread is about population numbers. What are your plans to do with the 1 million people who left Lost Ark? Or are your just going to tell them to play Final Fantasy when 80% of the mmo titles of populations that I mentioned quit those games, don't want to play Final Fantasy. So your solution for the 11 million arpg styled mmo retirees? & the other 20 million who quit other bigger hero mmo's too?

So 20 million people without a good regular mmorpg. 10 million people who already quit or will quit Lost Ark & DI. & 10,000 people who like single player ARPG's. Tho to be fair DI numbers are from the phone apps. So I'd cut those numbers by half & say 5 mill out of those half laptops equivalents. So the real DI number after everyone eventually leaves is 5 mill people who may or may not transfer over to poe after. Tho Lost Ark people for sure is 1 million. So that is 6 million for arpg mmo fan equivalents. & 20 to 30 million for mmorpg'ers who don't play final fantasy & quit everything else.

You may tell me how much you like single player theatrical D2 story zones & I do too. For the art. Yes. Tho you may not tell me that you know the " audience " populations. Who are waiting for a trend or new feature, to a non p2w title.

You the single player ARPG'er are the minority. & The majority's titles have failed them.

Nobody cares. The nature of the single player games is that once you finish them they are over. PoE will never be be MMO deal with it.

They would have to make it from scratch to be an MMO and its effort for next 10 years. Thats how long it takes to make decent MMO. GGG would have to remake and change every single mechanic to suit your needs. Just give it up, your idea is stupid and unrealistic.

those 1.4m can have their mmo (and most will quit in 3 months because its no longer shiny and new)

I DONT WANT IT.

LEAVE POE ALONE.

TLDR. What’s the elevator summary?

More players better updates.

Was POE always multiplayer available? Or was it single player to begin with? If it was single, well then they added multiplayer did they not?

Also define " nobody cares " you mean the 11,000 minority nobody cares? Or the 6 million to 30 million waiting for a non p2w rpg with above average pvp arenas. & some mmo review channel new party features to talk of.

11 million people concurrently trying a game on release day isnt the same thing as whatever amount is still playing on random days following it...

if a game has 1 million players online, that is only a concurrent number, not the actual playerbase size. the 11 million that tried diablo immortal happened to log in at the same time because it was release day, it is a point of convergence and therefore is expected

even poe with 150k peak concurrent players at launch has millions of unique accounts playing the league according to chris, concurrent player count skews your perception of a game's playerbase that much

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Thror2k5 wrote:

those 1.4m can have their mmo (and most will quit in 3 months because its no longer shiny and new)

I DONT WANT IT.

LEAVE POE ALONE.

Have what? If you actually read the thread. You'd know I said those games failed and to not tell those people to return to have those titles. They are failed games. Not from being a mmo. Failed from p2w models, lack of a skill tree, & limited pvp arena rewards or strategy or fairness. Not a genre dispute. When the business ruins their title.

Is Last Epoch THAT GOOD?

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RuneLuthien wrote:

More players better updates.

Was POE always multiplayer available? Or was it single player to begin with? If it was single, well then they added multiplayer did they not?

Also define " nobody cares " you mean the 11,000 minority nobody cares? Or the 6 million to 30 million waiting for a non p2w rpg with above average pvp arenas. & some mmo review channel new party features to talk of.

They have their game we have ours. PoE is mostly single player with MMO elements and it was like that from the get go.

Poeple that tried lost ark were looking for MMO not ARPG. People that tried Diablo3 wanted Diablo not ARPG. People avoid PoE because its overly complicated not because its not MMO.

To make PoE into MMO you would have to rebuild from scratch its core elements, make it more streamlined, vastly reduce the amount of options and builds, streamline itemization, rebalance monster density to like 1/30 on juiced map etc. Its project for years, you want a new game, different one, not PoE. Just move on.

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RuneLuthien wrote:

e 6 million to 30 million waiting for a non p2w rpg with above average pvp arenas. & some mmo review channel new party features to talk of.

POE was conceived and designed by D2 fans wanting a successor to D2, an ARPG. It's not an MMO, it's not meant to be an MMO, and its fans play it (and enough of them pay) because it's not an MMO. If we wanted to play MMOs... guess what? We would be.

Why come berating an unrelated game asking that it should be something it isn't, and stipulating thaht all the things it conspicuously doesn't do should be core?

Or do you think that because 273 million people play Candy Crush (source), obviously what POE needs is more match-3 gameplay?

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yamface wrote:

11 million people concurrently trying a game on release day isnt the same thing as whatever amount is still playing on random days following it...

if a game has 1 million players online, that is only a concurrent number, not the actual playerbase size. the 11 million that tried diablo immortal happened to log in at the same time because it was release day, it is a point of convergence and therefore is expected

even poe with 150k peak concurrent players at launch has millions of unique accounts playing the league according to chris, concurrent player count skews your perception of a game's playerbase that much

Ye, the game also has a lot of bots now adays. Tho overall why did people quit? Oh ye p2w. Pointing out that some of the millions of players may not be a full mill but like 800k or 600k. Is first of all still wayyyyyy more than 10k single player arpg titles. & the game is p2w so people left. So it's not a fair representation. Since POE isn't P2W.

If it wasn't p2w thousands more would have stayed. If it had more features per class or pvp rewards, thousands more would have stayed. & if their pve wasn't some mobile phone auto pather solo, npc walker, then ye.

Either way I know for a fact, that every mmo title since 2006 has had a exodus. Even GW2 needed some way to inspire people & never attained that past a few years, so never trended again. Nothing mmorpg wise is popular right now. Obvious, by the fact that Diablo Immortal is the #1 mmorpg talk of the month for pc mmorpg gamers. A phone game is #1 highlight for pc gamers. So don't tell a pc gamer to go play ANY GAME what so ever as a alternative to anything. The market is trash right now. & has been since 2006. Besides POE or PS2.

Even if LA numbers are from 800k to now 300k real numbers not counting bots or people who tried & left only. Theirs still 20 million people who aren't playing Final Fantasy, Nor WoW. & yes 1.4 mill or 800k LA people who left, aren't playing anything either. & Ye if not 10 mill Diablo Immortal people who will leave, then yes 4 mill of them are real people or how ever you explain. It still all equals like 10 to 30 million of people more than the 10,000 people who prioritize toward single player ARPG's.

It's fine to be a niche crowd, tho admit your a niche crowd & stop acting like you know anything about the rest of the pc market. I got people telling me to go play Lost Ark, after I told them I'm the main guy making the amazon Lost Ark threads & they still tell me to go play Lost Ark or Final Fantasy. When Final Fantasy has no good pvp & has no talent skill trees.

Toss me POE's skill tree for Final Fantasy and I WOULD go play Final Fantasy right away. '.' Minus not liking that the gameplay running or quests feels too much like playing WoW. From a camera angle perspective. Feature wise tho I'm fine with more stuff.