Will Harvest Become Core Path of Exile Content?

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Adrenicrome wrote:

I, like many others, had a ton of fun this league with harvest crafting. I've been at this game since beta and know my way around quite well. I stopped crafting items a long time ago after sinking and wasting so much currency into bricking items. It is not an intuitive or friendly system and you will lose a lot before you figure it out and get anything decent back. What harvest crafting brought to the table was incredible and allowed experimenting without feeling the huge loss of hard to find currency like exalts.

Going back to the old way of crafting really feels like a huge step backwards. Especially when other competitive arpg titles are working on making crafting more targeted. Last Epoch is a perfect example. You can craft your items with exactly the mods that you want. Not only that, but you can take other items that you would normally vendor or leave on the ground and shatter those items to collect the mods they had on them. Then you can use those mods on another piece of gear that you are crafting to use. GENIUS!!! So not only is the player allowed to choose what they want on their gear, but the issue of common items that never get used is fixed.

I'd hate to see this game get left in the dust of up and comers that have been paying attention to what players want and are making games accordingly.

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Gumlass wrote:

I'm on page 43, so do I even bother posting ...

How you read GGGs post, entirely depends on how you interpret this statement:

"at the top end of gameplay, Harvest has made it too easy to gain very powerful items that previously required a lot more work and investment to acquire"

Where is the "top end", and what is "too easy"?

If it's at all accessible for the top 2% of players in a month, then it will be accessible to 0.01% of players on Day 1.
If it's accessible to the top 0.01% of players in a month, then the top 2% of players won't have a chance of doing it at all in a whole challenge league.

Now lets say they just cut the top off the Harvest mechanic ... i.e. no T1 mods, not tailwind, no explode chests.
Even if you can craft T2 and below Life and Resists on items, that invalidates > 99.9% of items that drop ... most of which are already garbage.

Harvest REALLY highlights the big problems with other aspects of the game / economy:
- Drops are all bad (statistically speaking)
- Trade is horrible to interact with - both buying and selling.
- Crafting is generally useless for the majority of players.

Prior to Harvest, my crafting was limited to:
- Slamming essence of greed on the 6L Astral Plate I bought, and crossing fingers for resists
- Buying the Stygian Vise someone forgot to craft a 3rd resist on, benching and reselling it

Anything beyond that was really reserved for rich players who can afford to waste an infinite amount of currency to get what they want.

If we can no longer craft our own gear, can you PLEASE at least make trade less terrible?

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VashSan wrote:

"Too easy"

I strongly disagree. League I enjoyed the most, still playing, and I started getting good, or cool stuff probably after 3 weeks.

In other leagues after one week I already saw mirror tier weapons and armors for trade or mirror service, without harvest. With the player base PoE has people will always get something like this, but without harved, same few people will still crush the market.

Garden was something that did scare people away, who stayed and figured it out loved the league.

There is a reddit post saying somthing like "we should keep harvest and get rid of the old 'glorified gamble' system that was crafting before" and I really agree with that.

IMHO people who didn't like this league is divided in 2 types:
1-people who couldn't handle the "game grind" and also the "knowledge" grind to make a nice garden,
2-people who get mirror tier gear after one week anyway and couldn't sell "junk" from failed crafts anymore, because everyone can craft now.

Please don't come with "harvest is too powerfull". People always get good gear and Harvest just spread that. Now isn't only 1% of the players that have good gear, anyone that spend some time playing can also get something good without spending a league of savings for 1 item.

Really. I'm serious when I talk about a league of savings for one item is my experience in PoE untill now. I don't want to go back to this. My current gear is good, nothing mirror tier or like that and I crafted a lot. But in other leagues I wouldn't be able to have 2 pieces of what I have now. That was boring, I only keep playing because I can play the game without beign overwhelmed by gear checks.

Basically before you could save 10 ex and get something good, gamble it all to MAYBE get something a little bit better, or more likely lose it all. Mostly players don't get to play builds that worth 6 mirrors. Before Harverst if you want to craft something good you should be ready to bet 100-200 exalts.

I currently have about 300h in harvest. Never payed more than 4ex on something and crafted most of my gear. My bank is 67 exalts right now. 300h+ to have probably HALF of what you need to craft ONE good item. Please don't make us come back to that.

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Mike_84 wrote:

After already 600 hours this league again, I just say, scrapping harvest was one of Your worst decisions for a long time GGG.

Writing it down for the last time; yes, seed crafts could be strong, but their availability was rare and it was still heavily luck based.

All people complaining it was too easy to get godly items are eiter did not crafted anything by themselves (just seen some highlights) or bought / got the target crafts, dozens and hundreds of them.

I do not say, seed crafts are not powerful enough, but only a very very few of them, what You get very very rarely, then You will still fail most of the attempts.

For instance, I self made my whole gear this league, my pretty okay but far from perfect gear, took me the whole first 4.5 weeks, that is, around 400 hours, just for one character, and took me around 24000 self farmed T1 seeds, and a couple thousands more T2-T4 for resist swaps, fractures, influences, etc. And to add that, for instance, just my shield ate around 30-35 replace X to X crafts, and finally still settled on T2 life and T4 lightning resist, as could not hit higher lightning resist than T4 in 14 replace lightning attempts.

Yes, I play a lot, all alone, not a well fed streamer or partier, and this is what this kind gets.

Or for a more accurate numbers, I noted the results of my latest 7418 i81-83 non-socket T1 seeds. I harvested them 360 per run, I got 23 augment, 32 remove and 52 replace X to X, that is, 107 (1.442%) usable crafts. And You are going to fail most of those 1.4%, and will need a lot more attempts stat by stat.

I managed to make 3 (three) items with it, and still stopped again on some T2 and T4 stats after several unsuccessful (T8, T9, T5, T6, etc) replaces.

Not to mention, recently restarted in hardcore, and experienced the same as the beginning: up to act 8, crafts are brutally powerful, You are constantly getting 4-6 augment / remove / replace per 24 seed, constantly getting non-X to X socket colour change. Then You arrive to act 9, You know, to quarry, and all of the sudden, You are getting the 1.4% from that point, 0-2 crafts per 3 full fields.

So, yes, seed crafts can be powerful, but still very rarely available then still heavily luck based.

For me, RIP PoE after this league without seed crafts avaliable, I a lone player for instance absolutely not interested in the earlier 100%-shit-luck-craft-fest and just-buy-all-shit-fest.

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Educmack wrote:

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Viktranka wrote:

Yeah...

Reddit item showcase:
"It only took me 60ex worth of buying remove and add influence to make this mirror tier item!"

Casual player:
"Huh cool but I barely have more than 5ex in a league, glad the hardcore players are having their fun tho."

Forum troll:
"Hurr durr every casual player is running with mirror tier item in every slot for no effort at all, gaem too ez plz fix!"

Don't worry, if you are a casual player, WhY WoUlD U HaVe To Be AbLe To CrAfT gG ItEMz AnYW4Y?????????? :B *cries in kappa*

None of those who say the league is the WORST LEAGUE EVAH give us enough arguments to prove the rest wrong. I sustain that those wealthy players want to remain wealthy, while the rest of the player base stay poor.

I take this from the GGG reddit post:

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People keep saying "but every casual idiot has mirror tier gear!" which, a) is false, and b) what else should a player have after 1.5 months of constantly grinding in a game? in a league where gear is temporary, shouldn't gear progression be gated by your ability to craft deterministically (which is still a grind, mind you), vs just spamming alts and regals and imprints other awful qol crafts?

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lilouille wrote:

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overkligt1 wrote:

Thank god! 10 Exalt items wont cost 15 Chaos anymore!!!!!

Says fucking rich farmer who can play 12h/day. Harvest was one of the best league because it was opening actually very good items and customization for the first time for other ppl. The "poors" you may say. Yes, I'm poor, and yes, I loved Harvest. I'm glad items were 15c and not 10 ex. Should be the way.

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DaoistRyrick wrote:

THAT IS THE POINT! why do i have to? i mean no one is forcing you to play with the harvest mechanic? who why does it bother you? just don't use it. and go back to the old days. but as you said "You don't like trade league? Play SSF."
no. the answer is most people do not like it because they lose monopoly. end-game too fast and boring? then don't use the crafts and stick with currency slapping. do not forget there are players who have only and hour to play and trading takes that whole hour away from us.

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KinJin91 wrote:

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Vandrafon wrote:

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KinJin91 wrote:

Remove Harvest completely. Ty. I like you GGG but this league was a fail for me personally the first time ever. I even liked Synthesis a lot more.

Majority of players are just low IQ'ed, not realizing how Harvest league is/was destroying the core game completely:
Hunting for the good items by actually slaying monsters and not by rerolling 100 times some random items.

Slaying monsters will not yield gear sufficient for most of the game, you still have to craft... well now we're back to orb gambling, instead of being able to target something specific like phys on a weapon.

Tell me where is the point in slaying any of the end-game content when all the items that you can craft are far superior than all of the items you can get from the end-game bosses. This is so completely stupid, I cannot even find words for it.

Rares were always superior, but it was really hard to craft them. Now every redneck can craft OP items. Either make end-game at least 10 times more difficult or just remove this easy-peasy crafting. It's so obnoxious.

If this way of crafting stays PoE will turn into a 2nd Diablo 3 where you are done with endgame after 2 days even as a complete casual.

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WisestWolf wrote:

"at the top end of gameplay"

I'm really getting very sick of being constantly hampered in terms of what I am and am not allowed to do based on what somebody with 2000 mirrors can do with the same systems.