[3.11] Agnostic RF - Bane Occultist | All Content Viable | League Start | Now SSF Viable!

Im struggling with strength and i dont really see where i will get it all from, from your guide. I've took all the strength nodes in tree but still short by a lot.

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devilcorpsdoc wrote:

Im struggling with strength and i dont really see where i will get it all from, from your guide. I've took all the strength nodes in tree but still short by a lot.

Presumably from gear. Belt can have a +35 strength implicit.

Sadly the author seems to have abandoned the thread. The gear and skills seem at odds with the PoB. I just levelled Steelskin then found that the pob uses Arcane Cloak as a guard skill. The "current gear" also still has tabula instead of the pob's Cloak of Defiance.

I've actually found the build quite slow to level so not a great league starter and I hit some survivability issues towards the middle of Act 7. It might be ok running maps once the full build is up, but then so are lots of builds that can kill bosses well and don't need to change so much as this does.

I like the chaos damage skills though, they're always fun. I found darth_suicune's post very useful on page 8.

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darth_suicune wrote:

Spoiler

"

Icewind_1982 wrote:

...
Gearwhise I have double obliteration, but as I still lack a 6L chest I stick to Amplification for the essence and bane setup as it somewhat mitigates the need for a 5L at the cost of the chain-explosions. I do not struggle that much against packs, even when it sure takes more time than if I would use obliteration. But I die through bosses a lot as of late (Doedre, Shavronne and the final abomination in act 9 and Vilenta in act 10).

I made a ImmortalCall>Second Wind>Arcane Surge>Flame Dash link like recommended above, but Arcane Surge triggers not often enough and the Regeneration from Dynamo is not nearly sufficient to maintain RF.

Long story short: I would appreciate some more details on survivability and how to play with the bane / ed setup and RF setup if possible as I seem to not recognize something important and vour VoDs are to long to watch throug without highlights unless I want to stop playing for a day or two :(

I'm playing SSF, no cloak of defiance, no foible, just one obliteration, but I can sustain RF and I might have some tips for you.

If you are missing damage, get a tabula rasa. Blood aqueduct (act 9 start), waterways, channel maps drop the divination card "Humility". 9 of them and you get a 6l chest. I do it with my first char on lvl 60 blood aqueduct every league, makes it so much smoother.

Arcane Surge: You have leveled it too much, t only triggers after spending X mana on the linked skill and that X depends on the Arcane Surge level. I'd recommend just buying a new gem, level it to 7 and right click the level up icon to never see it again.

5l-6l Bane level 18-20 with 5/6 links insta pops normals/blues up to t10 maps (haven't tried reds yet), and normally one shots (over time) yellow mobs, sometimes 2 shot. If you are missing damage, try to get wands/spirit shields with increased spell damage, there is no exploding if they don't die.

For bosses you will need to throw everything at them, wither on totems right before the start, blight with infusion to boost the rest of the skills, essence drain and of course bane+despair (remember, if they are linked, bane applies despair). And learn what and when to dodge.

I wouldn't use RF to boost your damage until you find your way around with the build. For RF to be sustainable I use mana recovery besides regen (enduring eternal flask, mana on kill from gear/passive, etc). I tested it in my hideout until I could sustain it just with a mana flask, arcane surge and dynamo, and can keep it through a map without dropping even mana until I find a chunk without mobs.

I honestly don't use obliteration (doing t10s right now). I find the exploding thingy very lacking anyway, since packs are melted by bane and it doesn't start a chain reaction like ed+contagion does. Might be more useful deeper in red tier maps, but right now it feels like my damage wand and shield, or the cane of unravelling do much better.

On survivability, you are a mage, it's always a mess. I'm careless and have died 178 times this league (probably a couple more by the time you read this). But I might have some tips I learned in the time I've played:
-Dead mobs cannot hit you. They can still explode, though, be careful.
-Make sure your elemental resists are maxed. Try to keep chaos as well as high as possible, but is a slightly lower priority. Use the crafting bench to max out your resistances asap.
-Dash out of nasty situations. You are not supposed to face tank a mob of mobs
-This build focuses on acro/phase acro along MoM as defensive layers. Don't bother trying to add energy shield, armor or block, they're nullified by passives. Evasion, life and mana should be your focus.
-Have at least 4 flasks up with this suffixes (you can get at the Menagerie). Typically Quicksilver, enduring eternal mana, and 2 either for more damage or defense:
--Heat (prevents freeze/chill, even that from strongboxes)
--Warding (removes all curses, even from map mods)
--Staunching (removes bleeding. Stay alert when you start bleeding, it can make your HP vanish if you move)
--Dousing (removes burning, same as bleeding)
--To get this, just grab white flasks of the type you want, 4x glassblower bauble, use an augment on them, then spam alteration until they have the prefix you want and no suffix, then take them to the menagerie to get the suffix you want
--Remember, killing mobs fills the flasks, the more you kill, the faster they get back up. Try to kill fast enough that you can keep them up permanently
-The 5th flask is always a seething divine life flask (of staunching) for me. Burst recovery as a panic button.

That was a really useful post.

It would be good to know if you're still doing well in red maps? And how you may have needed to change the build.

I've got to the point in the PoB where I can do the acrobatics stuff or try to get lots of mana nodes. I'm not clear when to go for MoM and Agnostic so I've been putting it off because I'm afraid to trash the character if I go there too soon (mana issues etc).

Any tips would be appreciated. :)

"

SpontaneousCombustion wrote:

"

darth_suicune wrote:

Spoiler

"

Icewind_1982 wrote:

...
Gearwhise I have double obliteration, but as I still lack a 6L chest I stick to Amplification for the essence and bane setup as it somewhat mitigates the need for a 5L at the cost of the chain-explosions. I do not struggle that much against packs, even when it sure takes more time than if I would use obliteration. But I die through bosses a lot as of late (Doedre, Shavronne and the final abomination in act 9 and Vilenta in act 10).

I made a ImmortalCall>Second Wind>Arcane Surge>Flame Dash link like recommended above, but Arcane Surge triggers not often enough and the Regeneration from Dynamo is not nearly sufficient to maintain RF.

Long story short: I would appreciate some more details on survivability and how to play with the bane / ed setup and RF setup if possible as I seem to not recognize something important and vour VoDs are to long to watch throug without highlights unless I want to stop playing for a day or two :(

I'm playing SSF, no cloak of defiance, no foible, just one obliteration, but I can sustain RF and I might have some tips for you.

If you are missing damage, get a tabula rasa. Blood aqueduct (act 9 start), waterways, channel maps drop the divination card "Humility". 9 of them and you get a 6l chest. I do it with my first char on lvl 60 blood aqueduct every league, makes it so much smoother.

Arcane Surge: You have leveled it too much, t only triggers after spending X mana on the linked skill and that X depends on the Arcane Surge level. I'd recommend just buying a new gem, level it to 7 and right click the level up icon to never see it again.

5l-6l Bane level 18-20 with 5/6 links insta pops normals/blues up to t10 maps (haven't tried reds yet), and normally one shots (over time) yellow mobs, sometimes 2 shot. If you are missing damage, try to get wands/spirit shields with increased spell damage, there is no exploding if they don't die.

For bosses you will need to throw everything at them, wither on totems right before the start, blight with infusion to boost the rest of the skills, essence drain and of course bane+despair (remember, if they are linked, bane applies despair). And learn what and when to dodge.

I wouldn't use RF to boost your damage until you find your way around with the build. For RF to be sustainable I use mana recovery besides regen (enduring eternal flask, mana on kill from gear/passive, etc). I tested it in my hideout until I could sustain it just with a mana flask, arcane surge and dynamo, and can keep it through a map without dropping even mana until I find a chunk without mobs.

I honestly don't use obliteration (doing t10s right now). I find the exploding thingy very lacking anyway, since packs are melted by bane and it doesn't start a chain reaction like ed+contagion does. Might be more useful deeper in red tier maps, but right now it feels like my damage wand and shield, or the cane of unravelling do much better.

On survivability, you are a mage, it's always a mess. I'm careless and have died 178 times this league (probably a couple more by the time you read this). But I might have some tips I learned in the time I've played:
-Dead mobs cannot hit you. They can still explode, though, be careful.
-Make sure your elemental resists are maxed. Try to keep chaos as well as high as possible, but is a slightly lower priority. Use the crafting bench to max out your resistances asap.
-Dash out of nasty situations. You are not supposed to face tank a mob of mobs
-This build focuses on acro/phase acro along MoM as defensive layers. Don't bother trying to add energy shield, armor or block, they're nullified by passives. Evasion, life and mana should be your focus.
-Have at least 4 flasks up with this suffixes (you can get at the Menagerie). Typically Quicksilver, enduring eternal mana, and 2 either for more damage or defense:
--Heat (prevents freeze/chill, even that from strongboxes)
--Warding (removes all curses, even from map mods)
--Staunching (removes bleeding. Stay alert when you start bleeding, it can make your HP vanish if you move)
--Dousing (removes burning, same as bleeding)
--To get this, just grab white flasks of the type you want, 4x glassblower bauble, use an augment on them, then spam alteration until they have the prefix you want and no suffix, then take them to the menagerie to get the suffix you want
--Remember, killing mobs fills the flasks, the more you kill, the faster they get back up. Try to kill fast enough that you can keep them up permanently
-The 5th flask is always a seething divine life flask (of staunching) for me. Burst recovery as a panic button.

That was a really useful post.

It would be good to know if you're still doing well in red maps? And how you may have needed to change the build.

I've got to the point in the PoB where I can do the acrobatics stuff or try to get lots of mana nodes. I'm not clear when to go for MoM and Agnostic so I've been putting it off because I'm afraid to trash the character if I go there too soon (mana issues etc).

Any tips would be appreciated. :)

Hey, glad you found them useful :) I followed the changes through the conversation on the topic, so not using the pob nor the guide, but still following the core idea. Main difference is... I have RF but never use it (it's risky, maybe gear's fault, I forget it exists as well). It puts you in awkward spots for a damage boost you only need against bosses, where it's much harder to sustain. Will retry with cloak if I ever get it. OP might have been using it to boost obliterations lack of the extra boost that other gear gives, but I don't use obliterations so I don't find it as useful.

I'm level 93, still on a tabula, still no foible, and have done:


My current setup (ssf, get better stuff if you can trade for it) https://pastebin.com/VtpuLrDa . Check config for damage details. No RF, Bane + 5L ED is 700k shaper. With Vaal RF + RF and 6L it gets 1.5M. This might be a high enough amount to warrant using it against some bosses, but will have to test it. Using RF without cloak and on ssf gear means sustaining it is much harder, so if you cannot almost one-dot-shot bosses it might not be worth it, will otherwise have to train on my quick-portal skills.

About progression:


Gear wise



Going forward


All in all, this is my second highest char ever, behind a 3.9 skeleton necromancer, and I plan to still play it for quite a bit, so I can say that I'm enjoying harvest with this char quite a bit. It feels well rounded, particularly being on SSF where I cannot count my DPS on shapers per second. Part of it is surely harvest making it easier to have usable gear, but the character itself is enjoyable for me. It rushes through t16s, almost everything drops instantly, and the stuff I have difficulty with is stuff I always found difficult due to my playstyle and lack of knowledge of some parts.

I'd probably be able to do Sirus at high AL already (with a few deaths) if I was better at that fight, I put it down to ~15%ish on my AL7 attempt with 2 very stupid deaths, so some gear would certainly help, and I have a bunch of testing with RF to do if I get the cloak. With a shavs, moving to LL might happen if I don't create a dedicated bosser that would most likely be LL itself, I think the damage output is there, not so sure about survivability since I've never done LL before.

A follow up as I did some testing yesterday, and I need to give credit where credit is due:

Two obliterations actually are much better than when I tested. On T16s with life/chaos res mods it gets noticeable that you deal less damage, but mobs still pop and it's a lot cleaner, and the rest of the maps are a breeze. Switching to the Cane has not been hard (just hotkey it), even against intervention, but you have to play with the mentality of switching the weapons around. RF almost covers for the difference and makes the clear speed much higher. Cleared 2 rare unIDed lair of the hydra with a single RF up to the boss (where I left RF expire)

Not sure if the difference is that I have much larger AoE and increased damage to when I last tested it, but credit where credit is due, op was right with the dual obliteration setup, it's awesome for clearing.

It does get a lot more inconsistent with rare mobs, rogue exiles and stuff like beasts. Most of the time they will die to the explosions, also making it faster than the cane, even red beasts can die to 2-3 packs exploding on top of them, but it will randomly leave some on almost full life forcing you to stay more alert to switch if needed (or just zoom past and ignore, but I don't do that), as those can actually be dangerous and will not go down to a bane cast with 2 obliterations over skill+damage weapons.

Vaal RF + RF for regular, non-invulnerable-phase map bosses is fine, they go down faster. I had to portal out of another hydra map out of mana before getting a 25% of the boss. The life of the boss went down a bit faster but not enough to justify using it unless you portal out every time the boss phases out. Will retry with a 6L ED and hopefully some extra damage mods.

Clarity is very good and deserves a spot even without the essence worm or supreme ego. It reserves a negligible amount and adds almost a 50% of mana regen with my setup. Biggest issue is that the reserved amount is so small that it sometimes got switched off and I didn't notice for one or two full maps.

Also I can add t13 and 14 blighted maps to the list, and got a golden oil out of one of them. Got 2 map drops in a row, ran them and had amazing choke points where I could plant 4x tier 4 arc towers with a slow tower and a support tower. Just bosses got through them and they were at half life, which made the fights incredibly easy. Treat them like bosses (cane, no RF) and they'll go down easily

And last but not least, switched to the crown of the inward eye after divining it to a max roll and a different pair of boots and eff'd my resistances big time. Juggled some crafts around to get the elementals back to 75 but it's currently not pretty, especially chaos which is useful against some bosses. Will have to work on getting all of that back, but now I deal 20% more damage than before with more evasion and armour and a lot of potential for better stuff on the rest of the pieces

"

darth_suicune wrote:

Spoiler

A follow up as I did some testing yesterday, and I need to give credit where credit is due:

Two obliterations actually are much better than when I tested. On T16s with life/chaos res mods it gets noticeable that you deal less damage, but mobs still pop and it's a lot cleaner, and the rest of the maps are a breeze. Switching to the Cane has not been hard (just hotkey it), even against intervention, but you have to play with the mentality of switching the weapons around. RF almost covers for the difference and makes the clear speed much higher. Cleared 2 rare unIDed lair of the hydra with a single RF up to the boss (where I left RF expire)

Not sure if the difference is that I have much larger AoE and increased damage to when I last tested it, but credit where credit is due, op was right with the dual obliteration setup, it's awesome for clearing.

It does get a lot more inconsistent with rare mobs, rogue exiles and stuff like beasts. Most of the time they will die to the explosions, also making it faster than the cane, even red beasts can die to 2-3 packs exploding on top of them, but it will randomly leave some on almost full life forcing you to stay more alert to switch if needed (or just zoom past and ignore, but I don't do that), as those can actually be dangerous and will not go down to a bane cast with 2 obliterations over skill+damage weapons.

Vaal RF + RF for regular, non-invulnerable-phase map bosses is fine, they go down faster. I had to portal out of another hydra map out of mana before getting a 25% of the boss. The life of the boss went down a bit faster but not enough to justify using it unless you portal out every time the boss phases out. Will retry with a 6L ED and hopefully some extra damage mods.

Clarity is very good and deserves a spot even without the essence worm or supreme ego. It reserves a negligible amount and adds almost a 50% of mana regen with my setup. Biggest issue is that the reserved amount is so small that it sometimes got switched off and I didn't notice for one or two full maps.

Also I can add t13 and 14 blighted maps to the list, and got a golden oil out of one of them. Got 2 map drops in a row, ran them and had amazing choke points where I could plant 4x tier 4 arc towers with a slow tower and a support tower. Just bosses got through them and they were at half life, which made the fights incredibly easy. Treat them like bosses (cane, no RF) and they'll go down easily

And last but not least, switched to the crown of the inward eye after divining it to a max roll and a different pair of boots and eff'd my resistances big time. Juggled some crafts around to get the elementals back to 75 but it's currently not pretty, especially chaos which is useful against some bosses. Will have to work on getting all of that back, but now I deal 20% more damage than before with more evasion and armour and a lot of potential for better stuff on the rest of the pieces

Many thanks again for taking the time - such detailed posts, almost a guide in itself!

I'm still reading through and examining your setup, I'll finish doing all of that before I continue with the character. I parked it yesterday since I looked at the guide's end game gear for the first time just after I wrote the post above and was surprised (depressed) to see how different it was to the gear in the stage before - skills, sockets, colours, all very different.

Since the OP seems to have disappeared you are the best/only source of good information now - you've actually done most of the game with this build so you know what works in practice.

Thanks again. :)
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EDIT: A thought. Your setup seems to be steering in the direction of this build:
https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/2581551

I played it last season and it was very good. What might be useful for you in SSF is that he moves on from the Cane of Unravelling into an endgame setup that's fully crafted (using a short bow base which you can get via divination cards). He also provides a full crafting guide and an upgrade flowchart. So you wouldn't need to wait for that unique to finally drop, you could be crafting something even better.

The other good thing about that build is that the weapon got buffed by 25% this league! How many builds can say that?! The only reason I didn't play it this time is that I'd just done it, I wanted to try something new and learn a bit about the game. HTH

I was keeping track of the post as I was also trying to follow advice here, but started doing my own tweaking and went well past the guide. I'm enjoying the character a lot so if I can help I'm happy to. If you have specific questions for some point of the progression, feel free to ask.

Honestly, I was also surprised by the change from spellslinger ED to bane already in yellows (as suggested by op). It feels like too late for such a large change for a league starter, but from watching some streamers, it seems that spellslinger ed/c is very common all around to level and gear up even if you'll do something else with chaos later. But since the change is late, that also means that you can spend the previous time hoarding some gear to be ready once you go for it, or rather, you can change skills once you have the gear for it, since ed/c even in spellslinger can carry you to the reds easily.



Also thanks for the link, I had already seen that one and a couple others, and got some ideas from them to go ahead on my own pob and do a ci and ll versions of this one, since at the end of the day, they are different ascendancies but they scale the same attacking parameter (chaos dot).

I'm really enjoying the agnostic/dynamo/mom combination, it's not that I want to move along for extra damage or survivability. It's that I have never done CI or LL so far and wanted to try this league, and this char looks even better with that option.

Hey there
trying bane for first time and decided to go in on your guide. First thing im confused about are the end game skill gems.

The guide, Current Gear visuals, and PoB do not match with the skills gems and their links. Its very confusing if youre re-specing to this.

I wanted to give an update since a bunch of things have happened to the build since the last time I posted, and somebody asked.

-Killed Heart of the grove, Aul at 210 depth, Sirus AL5, died to AL6, AL7 and AL8
-Got a Foible
-Double corrupted tabula into a +2 curses, 5% reduced cold damage
-Got a carcass jack and 5 linked it
-Shifted a bunch of points from some small damage nodes to life.
-Got a 6L Shavronne's wrappings from a metamorph (it wasn't linked but it went 6L within the first 50 fusings). Also got the 6L recipe from delve.
-Shifted the main weapons to dual obliterations.
-Put spreading rot back after taking it out for a bit.
-Put a cheap anoint on hunter's gambit on my old amulet. Boost in damage and skill duration is cool. Put mana on the new one because it's cheap, while I decide how to move forward

Current PoB: https://pastebin.com/Ee1Za9tk

Where I'm at:
-I still struggle heavily with Sirus AL8. I don't do enough damage to take it down quickly so I have to try and dodge more off-screen die beams and eventually die to them before killing him. I need to get better at the fight but I think the character needs to be tankier to reliably win it. If I shift to more damage, I just die to random stuff or smaller shots, so it's not an option.
-Clearing with the obliterations is a breeze. I have noticed substantially the drop in damage against magic tanky packs, but the rest go really quickly and make clearing much safer. Except against the porcupines that throw thorns on death. I have lost count of how many times I die to a pack of them dying and throwing their spines directly at me. No phys mitigation is a problem.
-I don't know which body armour to wear. Tabula with +2 curse doubles the amount of damage bane does right now (due to +1L and +2 skills), so it makes clearing much faster. Carcass gives insane AoE, useful resistances and a good bunch of life, so helps with bosses, which is what I already struggled with.
-I still don't have a cloak, so I can't test if RF and survivability gets me over the edge.
-Wither totems, having the ascendancy (wither nearby) and blight + spreading rot seems redundant and takes 4 slots. Considering dropping it and making blight 4L, then getting some defensive stuff. They do work as decoys against some bosses, it's their saving grace, but I think 4 slots is too much.
-Arcane Cloak vs Immortal Call is an interesting question. Arcane cloak allows to run 20/20 Arcane Surge, protects you half the time from random one shots/shotguns (which are my main cause of death), but takes a bunch of mana. It also does something during RF as proccing it at 0 mana allows to regen mana for a second and start firing off spells, healing more mana, etc. I think it could be better than IC, at least right now.
-My obliterations currently carry gems I'm leveling. I could probably use something in there, maybe a cwdt setup, or I could snatch the storm brand+culling strike idea and try to kill bosses faster that way.

It's my first time gearing into the endgame so I honestly don't know how to move forward from here besides the cloak, or whether the build can, realistically for SSF, do Sirus AL8 at my skill level. Some ideas I've gathered:
-get an Elder pair of fingerless to craft chaos dot on them. Maybe even projectile speed, craft +1 to projectiles and put ED there.
-probably get a better pair of boots with more life and craft some utilities(cannot be chilled/frozen, avoid ailments...)
-get a better set of mods for the belt (mainly resistances, freeing up other stuff)
-get better mods for my jewels
-try to hit some good cluster jewels. I already have a couple of chaos damage, chaos dot and curse effect ready to craft, but not sure how I'd balance life, mana and damage with those.

I'm open for ideas if anybody can give a hand.

Hey darth_suicune. I don't understand one thing an I think you could be able to help me. I have less Life than you but somehow RF does more degen to me than to you. It's hard for me to understand why is that. Would you mind helping me out and take a look at my POB? https://pastebin.com/deSMmvEV