[Archived] Moosseolini's Holy Relics Guardian

Dear Moosseolini,
i'm playing this build and since i like to test things i just discovered that summon phantasm support gem is actually quite good fot this setup.

Summon phantasm support is cool because the level of phantasm you will summon depends NOT for the level of the support gem, but only from the level of SUPPORTED gem.

Your setup gives a whopping + 8 level to holy relic, moreover all the other support gem you are already using (minion damage, brutality, predator) works great with phantasm too.

Using your PoB i took off controlled destruction (the worst damge-improving support gem) for summon phantasm.

So we lose about 32% of raw damage (more or less 2,5 million DPS, so we lose about 750.000 dps), but we gain about 200.000 Dps for phantasm (and we can mantain quite easily all 11 phantasm up) for about 2 million total gain.

So basically we get about 1.250.000 more dps, maybe not 100% of the time while mapping, but surely up and running agoinst bosses.

Just wanted to share my findings and know your opinion about this.

"

Ghoulers wrote:

Would you say this build is SSF friendly, aside from just needing Geofri's Legacy? HCSSF viable even?

I've been playing this build a little bit in Standard SSF. I've managed to get to white maps just fine. Only one death so far (to labyrinth traps because I got impatient).

I would say this build can definitely work in SSF, but with one caveat; you need to get Geofri's Legacy if you want to do Maven, Uber Elder, and all other very endgame content. This will require donating quite a lot of silver coins to Navali until you get the Bishop's Legacy prophecy.

As for Hardcore, this build can also work, though we carry an increased risk of dying in comparison to other builds due to our low range. I seem to recall someone else taking this build all the way through endgame content some time ago. The most likely thing to kill you will be physical hits, so mitigate against those especially in HC.

HCSSF essentially combines both the downsides of HC and SSF. This might not be the most pleasant build to league-start in HCSSF, but you can certainly consider re-rolling into it if you happen to get Geofri's Legacy.

As a racing build, this build is simply not viable.

"

ChrisAdler wrote:

Hello, a likely newcomer with no idea about the game after giving a 5 year break here. Brilliant build, it helped me a lot to ramp up my progress. Thanks for that, firstly.

At the cluster jewel skills, do we max out all of those skills or is there any nodes that we avoid?

Ideally I would go for the cluster jewels shown in the PoB. As a general rule, the more point-efficient the passives you are taking (that is, the more stats per point you get), the better.

Until you get perfect cluster jewels though, you can use jewels with an un-optimal number of small passives which have been rolled for just a single good notable. Those should be cheap to acquire and point efficient enough to un-allocate some passives on the skill tree and relocate them to cluster jewels.

"

Dr_3 wrote:

Dear Moosseolini,
i'm playing this build and since i like to test things i just discovered that summon phantasm support gem is actually quite good fot this setup.

Summon phantasm support is cool because the level of phantasm you will summon depends NOT for the level of the support gem, but only from the level of SUPPORTED gem.

Your setup gives a whopping + 8 level to holy relic, moreover all the other support gem you are already using (minion damage, brutality, predator) works great with phantasm too.

Using your PoB i took off controlled destruction (the worst damge-improving support gem) for summon phantasm.

So we lose about 32% of raw damage (more or less 2,5 million DPS, so we lose about 750.000 dps), but we gain about 200.000 Dps for phantasm (and we can mantain quite easily all 11 phantasm up) for about 2 million total gain.

So basically we get about 1.250.000 more dps, maybe not 100% of the time while mapping, but surely up and running agoinst bosses.

Just wanted to share my findings and know your opinion about this.

I have tried summon phantasm support for a few maps previously. It felt like I would rather have higher damage on my holy relics than more damage overall with the phantasms. Phantasms are also extremely squishy (since we don't really scale minion life) and die quickly, which might be a problem for the hardest content.

That being said, I might have to give the phantasms a try against bosses like Shaper. It seems like they would be most useful there. It looks like they might be a damage upgrade against bosses since their downside can be mitigated.

Overall, summon phantasm support is probably too inconsistent to replace a support gem for general mapping, but I'll verify how it performs against bosses as it could be a great gem-swap there.

Edit:

I did two attempts at Shaper, one with phantasm support, and one with controlled destruction support.

Comparing the two, the attempt with the phantasm support felt like I was just doing Shaper with a 5-link. It would take me ages to stack enough phantasms, and even then they got one-shot by a single slam or beam. Even once I managed to stack up all 11 phantasms, the damage didn't feel much greater, it was about the same (possibly because they only got +3 levels when in the staff).

I think phantasms might need some more scaling specific to them to make them work. They only hit with one measly projectile which quickly dissipates. They would probably perform better with something like GMP or Chain support. Supporting them to minions which hit very often also seems to be key. Our relics can hardly sustain their numbers if they die.

So, the phantasms are probably a better fit when supporting a different minion skill.

Dear Mooseolini,

Reposting hoping you have time to answer a few of my questions!


1st time poster... long time lurker and casual player! I plan on using this build as my next league starter (was going to do it this league but a 6L white socketed Belly of the Beast appeared "thank you Vaal Orb" & could not pass up using it), however I am much of what I learned in a 2nd character I am playing now.

I have a couple of questions (understanding I am casual player):

1. Endurance Charges, how can this build generate these?

2. Lvl 20 Steelskin vs Lvl 20 Molten Shell (not Vaal), when do you make the switch at what armor level? I assume you would need to be 5-6k base armor for Molten Shell to make sense? I am using this either in my move button or with CWDT not self casting..... Or is Lvl 1 Immortal Call+CWDT the beter choice?

3. Enigmatic Defence VS Steadfast "10% increased Effect of Fortify on you
10% increased Effect of Fortify on you while Stationary
30% increased Armour while you have Fortify". Would Steadfast be a better option or worse? Also should we maybe consider Charging Offensive for Endurance & Frenzy charges (when hit) +6% Atk spd?

4. Controlled Destruction vs Maim? Why give up the crit chance for 44% More damage when using Maim would appear to give same/more damage & not reduce crit chance?

5. Instead of Cluster Jewels, taking staff blocking nodes for more defense?

Thanks in advance for answering any or all of my questions!

Oh and the Phantasm support questions are coming from a popular streamer who has been experimenting with Herald of Purity and Phantasm support....

However he has discovered better to just use better supported Herald of Purity and ditch Phantasms


Just an FYI

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xcf01rnxxZA

Do relics benefit from the double damage mod? ...and yes I'm still trying to 6link it.

"

Yipp wrote:

Dear Mooseolini,

Reposting hoping you have time to answer a few of my questions!


1st time poster... long time lurker and casual player! I plan on using this build as my next league starter (was going to do it this league but a 6L white socketed Belly of the Beast appeared "thank you Vaal Orb" & could not pass up using it), however I am much of what I learned in a 2nd character I am playing now.

I have a couple of questions (understanding I am casual player):

1. Endurance Charges, how can this build generate these?

2. Lvl 20 Steelskin vs Lvl 20 Molten Shell (not Vaal), when do you make the switch at what armor level? I assume you would need to be 5-6k base armor for Molten Shell to make sense? I am using this either in my move button or with CWDT not self casting..... Or is Lvl 1 Immortal Call+CWDT the beter choice?

3. Enigmatic Defence VS Steadfast "10% increased Effect of Fortify on you
10% increased Effect of Fortify on you while Stationary
30% increased Armour while you have Fortify". Would Steadfast be a better option or worse? Also should we maybe consider Charging Offensive for Endurance & Frenzy charges (when hit) +6% Atk spd?

4. Controlled Destruction vs Maim? Why give up the crit chance for 44% More damage when using Maim would appear to give same/more damage & not reduce crit chance?

5. Instead of Cluster Jewels, taking staff blocking nodes for more defense?

Thanks in advance for answering any or all of my questions!

1) We don't have charge generation but it's not too difficult to get. We use minimum endurance charges on accessories to ensure we always have some. Enduring cry can also generate endurance charges, but it's not the best skill to use in the endgame without cooldown reduction. Small cluster jewels have some nice notables for endurance charge generation: armour clusters have 'Enduring Composure' which gives 1 charge every second if we've been hit recently, while attack block clusters have 'Enduring Ward' and 'Rote Reinforcement' which has a chance to give endurance charges on block.

2) I think Molten Shell is the best to use due to its high levels of mitigation and long duration. It will be better than Steelskin pretty much as soon as you have your flasks set up. That being said, play around a bit with the different guard skills and use the one which you like most.

3) Personally I like the block more. Steadfast seems like a good option too though. I would avoid Charging Offensive when using Cyclone as it gives you conditional attack speed in the form of frenzy charges, making your relic procs inconsistent.

4) Unfortunately, I think Maim support can only support Attack skills, or anything else that can already maim.

5) I'm not quite sure what you mean here. We are already taking most staff blocking nodes on the tree and this doesn't impair our ability to use cluster jewels.

"

Kyuss12 wrote:

Do relics benefit from the double damage mod? ...and yes I'm still trying to 6link it.

I think the double damage mod refers to yourself rather than your minions. If it applied to minions, I think it would read something similar to Gravepact's "Minions have 4% chance to deal Double Damage".

Thank you Moosseolini, for taking the time to respond to my post!