[3.21] Vatinas' Spiders + HoP Guardian - CI, 70K armour, 1400 ES on block, millions of DPS

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staidrecuacasa wrote:

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Zypherlol wrote:

How do you cause bleeding for the sentinels of purity? mine deal actually 0 damage.

You are missing Vulnerability curse on your gloves, that helps you and your spiders to inflict bleeding while having Bloodlust which reads 'Supported Attacks cannot cause Bleeding'.
Also, I was thinking about swapping Bloodlust with Awakened Brutality but for me at least it ended giving sentinels -100kcDPS so I don't think it's worth it.

Brutality nullifies all the chaos damage coming from our Offering, which is heavily scaled by the spider's Withering Touch.

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Zypherlol wrote:

How do you cause bleeding for the sentinels of purity? mine deal actually 0 damage.

It's written in the guide, in the section marked "(please read!)".

Hey Vatinas, stick with Aul's uprising with Envy or not?

Very hard to judge any difference in game play.

I hesitated to try this build for a while, reading it I thought it looked "gimmicky" I guess, but oh man was I wrong. It's an unkillable powerhouse. Absolutely beautiful build and guide, written extremely well with giving details about each piece of the puzzle, and the build itself is top notch. Currently 96 and Sirus 8 is basically faceroll now. Thank you for writing this up Vatinas.

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EDMOSES wrote:

Hey Vatinas, stick with Aul's uprising with Envy or not?

Very hard to judge any difference in game play.

I tried it out in PoB, and even bought one in game, and I'm sticking with the Astramentis. Aul's frankly doesn't give that much damage, and you lose quite a lot of ES and attributes (I needed to get a bit more dexterity to be able to use a lvl 21 withering touch, even with intrinsic catalysts on Aul's). It does have the benefit of granting us around 1k armour, but that's about it really. The Astramentis, combined with Shaper's Touch, is just too strong in my opinion.

But the idea was really interesting! And I actually tried it out in game. I really don't want to sound like I'm shooting down every new idea - I'm not. I try everything out to see if it can improve the build :) So thanks for contributing!

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Xazzi wrote:

I hesitated to try this build for a while, reading it I thought it looked "gimmicky" I guess, but oh man was I wrong. It's an unkillable powerhouse. Absolutely beautiful build and guide, written extremely well with giving details about each piece of the puzzle, and the build itself is top notch. Currently 96 and Sirus 8 is basically faceroll now. Thank you for writing this up Vatinas.

I'm glad you like it! And thank you for the compliments on the guide itself, I spent so much time writing it, it means a lot to know it makes the build clear. :)

Sirus is just a joke for this build. Switched to Soul of Ryslatha to sustain flasks and killed him without dying. Got a "DIE!" in the face, lost ~ 700 ES and froze. In the last phase, he chickened out, hid in a corner inside the storm and refused to go out. :D On a necromancer with 11.7k HP/ES, I would be dead. And at the same time, this build cost me ~15ex, and on my last build, only the mace cost 12ex, and the belt cost me 7ex (after crafting, I sold it for 20ex). I mean... wow!

In general, this is now my favorite build until it is fixed.

P.S. Instead of a Jewel with a block, I took a corrupted shield. I was able to save some currency and get a little more resistance on Jewels. It seems to me that it is worth adding to the guide.

Anything other than body armor can be upgraded? I even made implicits on all jewels.

Thank you! My gems aren’t even completely leveled up and I have downed Sirus, & mastermind for the first time ever.

Any way to get ailment immunity? Burning damage kinda hurts alot.

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Vatinas wrote:

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Zjoucura wrote:

Hi Vatinas,

Thanks for the build.

What do you think of this 6 point shift?

https://pastebin.com/EY4eJKxt

Armour down 10% (about 100 ES less on block)
Minion Damage up 7.5%
Energy Shield up 5%

Hi!

Thank you for helping me experiment with the build. :)

However, I still think I'm going to stick with my skill tree; in general, as I said in the guide, armour is much more relevant to our survival than raw ES; in this case, we lose 100 ES on block, which is huge (for comparison, the Surrender grants 250 and a lvl 20 bone offering grants 450, and those are often the only source of EHP on block).

I meant for the build to be as tanky as possible, while still having enough damage to do end game content, and I think we've achieved that. I don't think sacrificing 10% of our armour for 7.5% dps is worth it at this point. But once again, that's just how I feel; builds are made to be changed and tailored to everyone's preferences, so if you want to change it, go ahead! :)

Hi Vatinas,

Thanks for getting back to me. I was very skeptical of the build as I was already playing a HoA CI Guardian with over 10k ES and was still getting 1 shot at times.

I then decided to level a new character and try out your guide as I wasn't 100% sold on it.
And I have to say, OMG what a great build! really well done!

I think this is a great build even for new players and very viable as a league starter, as I find that CI Guardian is the only class you can play in this game due to pretty much everything 1 shoting players at T15 an beyond.

Some notes I made from my leveling experience following your guide, (playing as a league starter as much as possible):
Got Discipline and Rallying Cry from Act3 not Nessa as per your guide.
Dominating Blow is the bomb, was way better on bosses then Smite. My suggestion is to drop Smite altogether after getting Dominating Blow. Because the extra Dominating Blow adds tanked the bosses at times and did a lot of damage.
After Getting dominating blow, Zombies were dying a LOT and were a hassle to maintain (maybe drop altogether?)
Even with meat shield, Zombies were still dying a lot in mid leveling (act6-7)
I think the focus should be more on survivability, rather then minion damage in my opinion, from mid leveling (act6-7) and beyond. Otherwise I find my self dying on bosses a lot, and later on in early mapping.
Survivability when I got to tear 1 Mapping was VERY Poor, and dyed a lot on the final bosses. Zombies did not do much by this stage as they would die to bosses that AoE, in 1 hit! So AoE bosses were a VERY big problem in early on without gear. (Maybe we can swap zombies to Spectors in the guide?)
Underground (T1 Map) I had to completely abandon due to the inability to kill the lass boss no matter what (even having the Aegis Aurora Champion Kite Shield at that point)
I think some Chaos resistance before CI is a Must!

Are you able to also add to guide:
That the corrupted Blood immunity is a must before attempting Sirus. (only thing that totally destroyed me)

The guide is very good and detailed in how to obtaining gear, can you do the same for the many enchants you have? Maybe add thing like how to make some currency early on in the game with something like Chaos Orb recipe.

All in all, I think this is the only build to play if you don't want to get 1 shot every time you make a mistake and get hit by something.

Only thing I would like to have in the build is more Energy Shield, as I found there were some T15-16 Maps that could still 1 shot me at times. Even though I could take hits from end game bosses. I feel like 10k ES is the minimum in this game if you want to be able to survive hits in juicy end game Maps.