[3.6] Oro's Sacrifice Flicker Strike / Molten Strike - The Immortal Ascendant - Excels Everywhere

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srslyFaileR wrote:

Have you thought about loreweave instead of belly as your endgame armour - It has pretty much all we could ask for if decently rolled. Would like to hear your thoughts.

You could also go Kaoms with a 2nd 6l Oros in a Weaponswap, some people do that with this Build for maximum Survivability. Weaponswaps are always a bit tedious tho.

That said, I'm personally not a big fan of Loreweave over Belly. Belly offers Defensives in every Situation, and the most dangerous and most commonly encountered damage in the game is physical (against which Loreweave adds basically nothing).
If you don't decide to stand in Bearers/Volatiles/Detonate Dead. Obviously Loreweave adds a ton of Defensive value agains these, but they can all be manually avoided. Same for Boss mechanics that are Elemental: Shaper Beam/Balls, Atziri Flameblast etc. On Uber Elder you can even drop one Reservation for Purity of Ice, to gain even more max Cold Res than Loreweave offers and be a bit safer against the many sources of Cold Damage if you really need it.

Obviously Loreweave is still a great Chest, it also adds quite some offensive Value to many Builds and is unbeatable in -max Res maps. But only there do I personally see Loreweave beat Belly in terms of Defensives on a Life Based Build. Or at least in the Builds I play.
Also, it's not like the Damage is needed and the Allres from Belly smoothes out gearing.

Just my opinion tho, no idea what Monhsaroh has to say.

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srslyFaileR wrote:

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Soul of Arakaali pantheon instead of soul of Lunaris, which grants 50% increased life recovery

Went with this and spike hits dont feel as bad although Id still love a bit higher leech (maybe cause I come from playing slayer lol).

Have you thought about loreweave instead of belly as your endgame armour - It has pretty much all we could ask for if decently rolled. Would like to hear your thoughts.

Guffinn sums it up very nicely. (Ty guffinn)

In short, loreweave is insane once you reach a high enough HP pool so physical damage hits cant kill you. However, this is pretty hard to do with loreweave since it only gives at most +60hp.

We're in melee range all the time, we take a ton of random physical hits. Even with enfeeble, if a rare monster rolls a hexproof affix and some other nasty mods like +crit multi and +% phys damage, it's going to beat you into the ground if it crits. I distinctly remember seeing at least one 7k physical hit from T16 temple rares, as well as one from a super powered up carcass map boss.

That being said, if you can reach a health pool where physical damage doesn't one shot you, I couldn't recommend loreweave enough, and honestly wish I had at least given it a shot at 95+. While most spell damage can be avoided by player skill, the true bane of flicker strike is the tormented martyr's that you can offscreen flicker to. Anything touched by them will blow up when you kill them, and if you flicker to them from offscreen you can easily instantly die, without having any time to react. This is a very very rare event though, and I have a feeling that even if loreweave would prevent these deaths, many more deaths would occur due to physical one shots.

Loreweave isn't mentioned in the guide since most players will stop at around level 90 and won't reach a fat health pool, I don't want people who just reached maps to be using a loreweave and running around with 4000hp. If you can get away with 6500+ health while using a loreweave, it's definitely worth a try. Remember to go 3B 3R with loreweave for the optimal molten strike setup with combustion instead of fire penetration. If you're dying to physical hits switch back to belly.

Would be very grateful if you posted your experience with loreweave here if you decide to use it.

I will definitely give it a try if I accumulate enough currency this league. I'm hitting lvl 92 going strong in t11-14s right now. I bought a "cheap" %increased fire dmg watchers today and flicker dmg seems to be good enough. I'll now need to grab a enchanted starkonja and 6link the rest of my gear to be endgame ready.

Out of curiosity what is/was your HO tooltip on molten/flicker?

E: What will yield higher molten strike dps - going from 5l to 6l or the lab enchant? I only have currency to get one of those so I'd appreciate any input.

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srslyFaileR wrote:

I will definitely give it a try if I accumulate enough currency this league. I'm hitting lvl 92 going strong in t11-14s right now. I bought a "cheap" %increased fire dmg watchers today and flicker dmg seems to be good enough. I'll now need to grab a enchanted starkonja and 6link the rest of my gear to be endgame ready.

Out of curiosity what is/was your HO tooltip on molten/flicker?

E: What will yield higher molten strike dps - going from 5l to 6l or the lab enchant? I only have currency to get one of those so I'd appreciate any input.

Tooltip dps is 42k dps for molten strike and 9.7k damage per hit with 0.14 attacks per second with flicker strike. This is with only anger buff, no frenzies or anything.

The tooltip dps is highly misleading especially for molten strike as it's only showing the dps for the melee swing and not for any of the magma balls which make up the bulk of the attack. It's also not showing the benefits of all the fire penetration we stack nor the benefits from hitting ignited targets.

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Just realized that I made a mistake with the 4R 2B molten strike setup - The two blue gems being used should be concentrated effect and combustion, and not Concentrated effect and immolate as suggested in guide right now. Sorry for confusion, fixing right now. This shouldn't effect you in any way since you were still using a 5link. Optimal setup of 3B 3R is unchanged though.


POB was undervaluing combustion for molten strike because it thought the target was already under the effect of the -20% fire resist from being ignited by the combustion gem in flicker strike.

TLDR:

Getting the 6th link with the final support being Combustion would be the biggest dps increase, +48% more damage. In comparison the helmet enchant only adds +43% more damage.

Hey mate thanks for the additional info!

I went with the helmet enchant for now as I was able to snipe it for just 3ex - next on the list would be 6 linking my oros. I think I'll tackle shaper later on using my current gear..

Hey man looks like a very nice build really want to try a good all around Flicker build, simply had 1 question since you didnt really go over your ascendancy choice unless i missed it.

Have you considered going Slayer instead of Champion, Seems like the over leech would give alot more survivability against long fight like uber elder and such, And looking at the Champion it all seems very Meh, Fortify wasn't always up during your uber elder fight when it matters could easily be fix linked with leap slam, then the taunt is basically irrelevent since it doesnt affect you, Intimidate has 0 effect after the first hit and you don't need the Movement speed either.

So i'm i crazy for thinking that Slayer would simply be far superior for labbing/bossing ?


Also is there any reason for not using Ancestral call on top of Melee splash? Considering its your clear speed setup wouldnt that boost that even further?


Anyway Cheers for the build, bookmarked it :)

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coulombe123 wrote:

Intimidate has 0 effect after the first hit

Not gonna comment on what's better etc., but:
Intimidate is a straight up 10% more Multiplier for your Damage, if you don't have any other Sources of "increased Damage taken" on the Enemy.
Usually you would take Tombfist for that, but through the Champion Ascendancy you free up the Gloves Slot for something with more Gem Sockets and Res.
Also, these temple Gloves add a considerable amount of Damage.

Or did I misunderstand you? The Intimidate is permanent.

Oh i see i thought it lasted for something like 4sec and after it was gone

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srslyFaileR wrote:

I went with the helmet enchant for now as I was able to snipe it for just 3ex

Poor guy who sold you that got robbed. Gz on the deal!

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coulombe123 wrote:

Oh i see i thought it lasted for something like 4sec and after it was gone

Yup! It's a permanent 1.1x multiplier on all our damage as long as we hit first.

These are some really great questions, going to try to cover everything.

Taunt:

Concerning the taunt, this is basically a second intimidate. We don't care about the actual taunt effect, we care about the enemy taking 10% increased damage. This isn't an additive bonus that gets stacked onto all of our other sources, this is 10% increased damage that the enemy is taking.

Both the intimidate and the taunt stack with each other, resulting in 20% more damage being done to the enemy, which ends up being a pretty significant amount. This is competitive with other pure damage yolo ascendancies, even surpassing some of them. Champion is apparently a dps ascendancy.

Fortify:

Concerning the uber elder fight, you are very perceptive. Fortify does fall off at critical moments.

I believe what is occurring here (though I might be wrong) is that fortify is falling off when I'm using molten strike while out of melee range. Only the melee portion of molten strike can activate the fortify effect, the magma ball shower can't. I was too focused on dodging and wasn't paying attention if the actual sword was connecting since "attack in place" command was being used.

However I concede that even with better melee positioning, fortify would have fallen off at other dangerous times, as there are extended periods of dodging which last much longer than the four seconds of fortify. There is definitely a very strong argument for using fortify linked to leap slam on this fight.

Despite all of this, I urge you to reconsider the usefulness of the fortify on hit, especially for mapping. Since all of flicker hits are melee and have a chance to proc the fortify, the uptime on it is pretty nuts when clearing maps. You can check any of the map videos, fortify is literally up 99% of the time when in combat.

Having fortify on a leap slam combo for mapping is a great alternative, however I found that having to leap slam every four or five seconds was pretty mentally taxing especially during longer play sessions. This is particularly poignant due to the fact that our "flicker sprees" can sometimes last a lengthy amount of time (LONG on maps with sextants + elder shaper influence), having to disrupt this with leap slams didn't feel organic. The build didn't start as a champion, only switched over in low 90s.

Slayer:

Not going to argue that slayer isn't amazing, slayer leech is amazing. Reasoning behind not going slayer was that we would lose a pretty meaty portion of our damage by switching (lose a 20% more multiplier) and not even gain any damage in return, since we already have culling and the slayer increased damage is additive with our other sources.

Also if you're going to abuse slayer leech you might as well abuse the overpowered Oni-Goroshi since the leech largely negates Oni's life degen. But then you would have to find another way to get frenzies and the whole build changes.

That being said, slayer would certainly be super good if you're going with fortify linked to leap slam.

Gems:

Ancestral call is for sure faster map clear, but it feels really bad versus meaty rare monsters. With ruthless (40% more damage) you can just eviscerate them without stopping to switch over to molten strike. The difference in clear speeds honestly feels pretty minor. I think this one comes down to preference. You'd have to play and see for yourself, they are the same gem color so you can easily swap and try both.

Hope that answers everything!

This turned out way longer than I thought it would...

@OP - now that might of the meek jewels are stupid expensive and may stay that way (50c each) - is it still pretty much a requirement to get them? How far can you get by on other dmg/life jewels instead? thanks!