*Updated for 3.2* Volkuur's poison! millions of dps (7.5 mil shaper - 20 mil shaper GG gear)

I literally just took your PoB from the front page, replaced the tree & enabled frenzy charges + Onslaught.

Cospri's with Temporal Chains on Hit Volkuur's also seems incredibly strong, more-so than Dendrobate.

Also what the heck do I do with these?

This looks pretty close to a poison firestorm build I was playing last league. Same items. Same ideas. Good work!

"

Ceveth wrote:

I literally just took your PoB from the front page, replaced the tree & enabled frenzy charges + Onslaught.

Cospri's with Temporal Chains on Hit Volkuur's also seems incredibly strong, more-so than Dendrobate.

Also what the heck do I do with these?

temp chains on hit is great for mapping. for bossing, the 80% reduced curse effectiveness make it not as efficient. i can see scion beeing superior for mapping, but you wont have onslaught and frenzy charges when you need it, and your flasks will run out quicker (bosses)

You are missing status immunity from Pathfinder. That and duration/effect of flasks.

This alone makes Pathfinder a better choice. Instead of rolling magic flasks for status immunity you can just get uniques/other magic flask mods.

And if you really want frenzies, you can just get blood rage. Won't have it on bosses, but honestly I doubt it is that much of a gain in DPS. And if you get similar DPS, why bother?

Also, being flasked at all times is very easy as Pathfinder. Just get one max duration/least charges used utility flask there is and simply use it for massive on flask bonuses.



I personally use this one. For time being I'm also using:



to get more charges. Note: Nature's Boon flask charge generation is affected by those modifiers. In other words, I can get 4 flask charges every 3 seconds to all flasks when Chalice is in effect, without killing anything. And Chalice itself lasts for good 7 seconds, meanwhile giving 40%*Flask_bonuses increased damage (too lazy to count how much that is).
Given how long it lasts, you can keep flasks up permanently (or almost permanently), without killing anything.

In other words: Scion sadly sucks, no matter what you try to do. :(

Scion is strictly more DPS during flasks, which is a moot point because as you can see in OP's video everything currently in the game is going to die within two uses of flasks.

Here's a quickly modified version of OP's pastebin changing nothing other than pathing & enabling the permanent frenzy charges & onslaught from Raider ascendant. It's 500k~ more DPS with very little optimization as well as being a level lower.

https://pastebin.com/bw0SxK6T

"

Ceveth wrote:

Scion is strictly more DPS during flasks, which is a moot point because as you can see in OP's video everything currently in the game is going to die within two uses of flasks.

Here's a quickly modified version of OP's pastebin changing nothing other than pathing & enabling the permanent frenzy charges & onslaught from Raider ascendant. It's 500k~ more DPS with very little optimization as well as being a level lower.

https://pastebin.com/bw0SxK6T

2 problems :
pathfinder can get onslaught as well through jewels during mapping. even frenzy charges are possible with blood rage. if you enable those things in pob to boost the dmg for scion, pathfinder could do the same. you only have them during mapping and while they provide a nice dps boost there ( which we dont need really because we kill mobs pretty instant already) it does not boost boss dps. so the boss dmg is definitely not better as scion. the PoB shows actually 2,074 mil shaper dps (which is still nice). with the current flask setup you will die a lot by not removing ele ailments/vinktar's shock. i can see the flask setup working as scion for farming shaper but you will have problems during mapping if you dont equip remove bleed+remove freeze. so pathfinder has some advantages there too (regarding freeze+shock).

with the current tree, your ice shot has only 65% chance to poison. you'd have to sacrifice some passive notes to get the numbers up. that'd make you also loose some damage comparing to pathfinder.

you can definitely play this build as scion but i think pathfinder is better overall. it also offers better movement speed and defences due to the ascendancy notables and flask effectiveness.

Anyway, thanks a lot for your scion theorycraft, i'm always interested in some possible optimisations/changes!

I dont use PoB.

What are the main differences between the two talent trees? shaper vs mapping. Feeling a bit squishy at times and wanted to beef up a bit.

Hey Sacr0! I really like this build, what pantheon souls are you running with it?

I think it's fairly pointless trying to suggest alternatives when you don't know how the game works.

https://pathofexile.gamepedia.com/Ascendant

10% increased Movement Speed
4% chance to Dodge Attacks
You have Onslaught while on full Frenzy Charges
10% chance to gain a Frenzy Charge when you hit a Rare or Unique enemy

You are going to have 100% uptime on flasks while mapping & bosses die instantly, flask uptime is irrelevant.

Even if you remove Vinktar the DPS on bosses is still higher.

"

Wompapotomus wrote:

I dont use PoB.

What are the main differences between the two talent trees? shaper vs mapping. Feeling a bit squishy at times and wanted to beef up a bit.

you have a different flask setup (taste of hate+basalt) and you remove some dmg from passive tree for more life/mana notes.


lets consider a shaper fight.
You have Onslaught while on full Frenzy Charges
10% chance to gain a Frenzy Charge when you hit a Rare or Unique enemy
the calculated dps in PoB is the dps for maximum possible poison stacks based on your attack speed.
it will take you a second or two to gather the frenzy charges and gain onslaught buff to boost your attack speed. so there's a small ramp-up-time for it.

the poison itself has a ramp-up time as well (reaching maximum stacks after 2.4 seconds- if you reach your maximum attack speed after 1,5 seconds, this means that you will reach the 3 mil shaper dps from PoB after 3,9 seconds). it should take a scion 1-2 seconds longer than pathfinder to reach it's maximum dps due to this. shaper dies after 4 seconds. the scion buffs will not account for the full fight.
you'd have to invest into some %chance to poison notes on tree for your ice shot setup. not having it capped to 100% is annoying. and you still lack the defensive options from pathfinder.

the high Scion PoB shaper dmg is also based on the -15% chaos resi from occultist. it is absolutely possible to have that up 100% vs shaper but it's another "if"case. IF you have max frenzy charges and IF you have an enemy relatively close to you, you will reach higher numbers than pathfinder.
so i still doubt that scion's realistic dps is better than pathfinder's.