Brutality

You need to remove one of the drawbacks or tweek them.59% more is great but with hatred, herald rings and stat sticks you can get way more %MORE more more damage.Or maybe I'm missing something?Is it only for starforge type things?

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Vipermagi wrote:

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JKlupper wrote:

You need to remove one of the drawbacks or tweek them.59% more is great but with hatred, herald rings and stat sticks you can get way more %MORE more more damage.Or maybe I'm missing something?Is it only for starforge type things?

Bleed doesn't care for Hatred et al, seems pretty obvious to me.

Indeed now immagine brutality+ruthless with 2xheavy strike jewel.

I'm not real clear on the mechanics of bleed. I'm a lvl 49 Juggernaut 1h/shield Sunder build trying out the new bleed abilities and I'm trying to decide between Brutality and Ruthless Support. Brutality will give me 44% increased phys dmg, but eliminate all elemental or chaos dmg. Ruthless Support will give me 101% increased dmg every 3rd hit AND 101% increased dmg from bleeding caused by melee hit on the 3rd hit. From Passive nodes and a Chance to Inflict Bleed Support gem my tooltip chance to inflict Bleed is 75% (it's not showing the extra 10% chance to inflict bleed from my mace for some reason). I have Sunder in a 4L with Inc Mele Phys + CTIB + ?? [Brutality(lvl 5) or RS(lvl 14)]

If I swap the gems out I show 3175 dps for Sunder with Brutality (which should increase the amount of bleeding dmg) -- and I show 2378 dps for RS (the tooltip dps doesn't show ANY change from adding the RS). Three hit total with Brutality would be 9595 phys dmg + bleed dmg scaled from the phys dmg. Three hit total for RS should be 9535 [ (3 * 2378 + (2378 * 1.01) ] + scaled bleed dmg (from less phys dmg/hit) and 101% inc bleed dmg from 3rd melee hit. With the tooltip not showing ANY change from adding the RS I feel like I'm shooting blind here. RS is a lvl 1 gem and Brutality is a lvl 38 gem, and I would assume that Brutality is a more potent support gem. However I have 2 friends (both lvl 70+) playing Sunder builds that swear RS is much better (they are using a canned build from a website and I am self-building in the new League).

The question is how does bleed scale with phys dmg? Would I get more total dmg from the extra physical + higher bleed scaling from Brutality, or would the extra elemental dmg + 101% increased bleed dmg from every 3rd hit with RS be higher? Also, the RS gem caps in 6 lvls, but Brutality has 15 more lvls before it caps. Seems like the difference as I approach endgame could be substantial.

** I apologize if this is not well stated or confusing -- it's really early in the morning

It does not account for third hit dps from ruthless. Its easy to notice if you use some hard hiting skill.

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It does not account for third hit dps from ruthless. Its easy to notice if you use some hard hiting skill.

Actually I did account for that. I included:

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RS should be 9535 [ (3 * 2378 + (2378 * 1.01) ] + scaled bleed dmg (from less phys dmg/hit) and 101% inc bleed dmg from 3rd melee hit.

If you add it all together the base dmg of both skills is almost identical. The question is whether the the RS 101% extra bleed for one hit is more than the scaled bleed dmg from 3 hits at much more phys dmg from Brutality. The second question is how much difference will there be when when you have leveled Brutality 9 more times than you can lvl Ruthless Support.

BTW - the 3175 phys dmg of Brutalty is 139% more than the 2278 phys dmg from RS (3175/2278 = 1.39). So math-wise it seems that the total bleed dmg from the RS, including 34% extra total bleed dmg from the 3rd hit (RS dmg=, is actually 5% less total bleed dmg than you would get from Brutality. I suspect it's pretty evenly matched where I am now, but I'll have to see what kind of raw phys dmg increases I get as Brutality levels 9 times after RS has capped.

If I don't have this right, PLEASE some math nerd help me out!

I think you are correct.

Difference would be more clear for build that does not use crimson dance.

There is also issue of life leech. Slayer and Slayer Ascendant can overleech. Ruthless makes it easier to keep damage bonus from carnage heart and skill tree.

This gem also allows to disable elemental conversion for reflect maps. Its replacable with elemental damage with attacks as red gem.

This gem is not balanced and won't be an option in most builds. Very niche

I hope that was your intent

Hey,

I'm still confused about Brutality support. Is it give me +57% (at lvl 18) more physical damage only with hits OR 57% more total physical damage - included bleed dmg that is caused by my hits?
Can someone definitelly explain mechanics behind that support gem?